Manny Sanders says FU to the Steelers

[tapeANaspirin2it]

The front office did not make a mistake on Sanders. They kept him last year when they could have let him go for a draft pick. They knew he was good and that he was needed last year.

This year Sanders wanted out and Wheaton was set to take his place so the steelers let him walk.

That is the key to winning in the cap age. You need young players to replace guys who leave. If Jarvis and Worilds were actually good, then the pass rush would not have missed a beat without Harrison and Woodley.

If Wheaton gets his head out of his ***, the steelers won't miss Sanders.

 

[Vader]

The front office did not make a mistake on Sanders. They kept him last year when they could have let him go for a draft pick. They knew he was good and that he was needed last year.

This year Sanders wanted out and Wheaton was set to take his place so the steelers let him walk.

That is the key to winning in the cap age. You need young players to replace guys who leave. If Jarvis and Worilds were actually good, then the pass rush would not have missed a beat without Harrison and Woodley.

If Wheaton gets his head out of his ***, the steelers won't miss Sanders.

I think the Steelers made a mistake on Sanders. They were 8-8 with him the year before and were 8-8 last year with him. He wasn't an important player in either year and they knew he wasn't going to stay. Let him go to the pats* and get their 3rd round pick. That pick today could be Williams, a starter on the DL for the rats. Or it could have been traded to move up or down. Sanders wasn't worth the 3rd round pick when everyone knew he was only playing for one year. You're basically trading a 3rd round pick for Sanders for one year. Unless you are signing him long term I never do that.

Also replacing guys has always been the key to wining in the NFL. The cap doesn't change that. The Steelers lost in the 80s because they didn't replace guys. Woodley wasn't let go because he was old. He was let go because he couldn't stay healthy. Nobody can keep replacing young players with young players. You need vets around as well.

 

[blitzburghv5]

My gawd....Wheaton has a couple of bad games and folks like to pile **** on him. We've seen him make brilliant catches...we have seen him run amazing routes. We've seen his speed. A ************ cant have one drop or a bad game and folks wanna dismiss em like pungent garbage.

 

[Litos]

wheaton will bounce back,bet on it

 

[Omar10213245]

My gawd....Wheaton has a couple of bad games and folks like to pile **** on him. We've seen him make brilliant catches...we have seen him run amazing routes. We've seen his speed. A ************ cant have one drop or a bad game and folks wanna dismiss em like pungent garbage.

agree with you on this. I can't dump on Wheaton just yet, I still think he's a highly capable football player; I think he gets better before he gets worse.

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

My gawd....Wheaton has a couple of bad games and folks like to pile **** on him. We've seen him make brilliant catches...we have seen him run amazing routes. We've seen his speed. A ************ cant have one drop or a bad game and folks wanna dismiss em like pungent garbage.

This isn't 1 bad game. Wheaton isn't a rookie either. He is making too many mistakes. Ben seems to have no idea where wheaton will be which is why he can't hit him. And it's not like Wheaton is running deep routes that are harder to complete where you'd expect a lower completion %. That's why Ben missed Wallace a ton, because they were often low % throws in the first place.

The Steelers pulled him too. He's making mental mistakes. Nobody is giving up on him but he's making too many mistakes. He's the offensive Cortez Allen right now.

 

[slashsteel]

Wheaton hasn't been producing. His benching would be warranted. And it isn't like that would have to be a finale he would have opportunities to work his way back in.

Hell sorry *** Cortez was benched and still managed to play enough to **** up some more.

 

[Idioteque]

This isn't 1 bad game. Wheaton isn't a rookie either. He is making too many mistakes. Ben seems to have no idea where wheaton will be which is why he can't hit him. And it's not like Wheaton is running deep routes that are harder to complete where you'd expect a lower completion %. That's why Ben missed Wallace a ton, because they were often low % throws in the first place.

The Steelers pulled him too. He's making mental mistakes. Nobody is giving up on him but he's making too many mistakes. He's the offensive Cortez Allen right now.

Then he needs to be locked up NOW. What are we waiting for? Sheesh, he'll hit free agency in 2016.

 

[diver]

Yeah. Now they have 3 cornerbacks who can't cover. Just what they need.

Hold on a minute. Over the years, Ike Taylor could cover. Maybe not so much now, but he could without question. Still, teams did not fear him because he could not catch. Teams have never feared him because of that. Therefore, why not throw over there, even if he can cover? The worst you will get is an incomplete. There is little fear of a pick, and you may get an interference.

Lewis was the same thing. He dropped a few that were right there. I remember one his last year that would have sealed the deal against the Titans. So why fear that? You guys are looking at it in hindsight. That is too easy.

 

[topseed]

Hold on a minute. Over the years, Ike Taylor could cover. Maybe not so much now, but he could without question. Still, teams did not fear him because he could not catch. Teams have never feared him because of that. Therefore, why not throw over there, even if he can cover? The worst you will get is an incomplete. There is little fear of a pick, and you may get an interference.

Lewis was the same thing. He dropped a few that were right there. I remember one his last year that would have sealed the deal against the Titans. So why fear that? You guys are looking at it in hindsight. That is too easy.

#1 cover corners don't grow on trees. Ike Taylor couldn't catch a cold, but his coverage skills were evident. This mystical non-fear factor you speak of is negligible. Normally, quarterbacks try to throw to the open guy. They're not thinking: "Well, gee, let me see if I can force this ball to receiver x, even though he's covered, because I won't throw a pick to Ike Taylor."

Lewis wasn't the same thing. Just because Ike has shown no improvement with his hands over a long career doesn't mean it's impossible for another guy to get better. And Keenan did get better, with 4 INTs last year, more than Taylor's ever had in a season.

They let a guy in the prime of his career, who can cover, walk and sign for 5 mill a year, and signed an unproven player in Allen to 6 mill a year, who is now ranked 106th out of 106 eligible cornerbacks according to PFF. And they still have that other guy with the ****** hands, except that he's too old to cover anymore. Plus a journeyman and no depth at the position whatsoever.

You didn't need hindsight back in 2013 to realize Ike was just about done, and Lewis was clearly better than Allen. You just needed sight.

 

[Fiji Mariner]

Lewis, while a much better player than Allen wanted to go home to New Orleans... And as always we were cash strapped

 

[Vader]

Lewis, while a much better player than Allen wanted to go home to New Orleans... And as always we were cash strapped

Not true. They never offered Lewis a contract. I saw his interview right after he signed with N.O. He was willing to come back to Pitts but he said they never even talked with him. They made the decision to go with Allen and didn't even want Lewis back.

 

[topseed]

Lewis, while a much better player than Allen wanted to go home to New Orleans... And as always we were cash strapped

Of course Lewis wanted to go home...after the Steelers somehow never made him an offer. The Saints were up against the cap in 2013, and still managed to sign him for a million base and a 2.25 million cap hit.

And yet the always cash-strapped Steelers were able to guarantee the horrendous Cortez 6.75 million and an average salary of $6,150,000 less than 18 months later.

 

[diver]

#1 cover corners don't grow on trees. Ike Taylor couldn't catch a cold, but his coverage skills were evident. This mystical non-fear factor you speak of is negligible. Normally, quarterbacks try to throw to the open guy. They're not thinking: "Well, gee, let me see if I can force this ball to receiver x, even though he's covered, because I won't throw a pick to Ike Taylor."

Lewis wasn't the same thing. Just because Ike has shown no improvement with his hands over a long career doesn't mean it's impossible for another guy to get better. And Keenan did get better, with 4 INTs last year, more than Taylor's ever had in a season.

They let a guy in the prime of his career, who can cover, walk and sign for 5 mill a year, and signed an unproven player in Allen to 6 mill a year, who is now ranked 106th out of 106 eligible cornerbacks according to PFF. And they still have that other guy with the ****** hands, except that he's too old to cover anymore. Plus a journeyman and no depth at the position whatsoever.

You didn't need hindsight back in 2013 to realize Ike was just about done, and Lewis was clearly better than Allen. You just needed sight.

I think you are using hindsight, whether you want to admit it or not. You had a guy who did nothing for 3 years. He played pretty well in 2012, but I would not call him a #1. He didn't make plays on the ball. He just didn't. I am not saying because Taylor can't, Lewis wouldn't. I am saying you have to go with what you see, and IMO you saw a future with another guy who hadn't proven he could make picks. I wouldn't pay for that. I wouldn't have paid Allen, either. I never said they should have done that.

Keenan Lewis plays on a 2-4 football team. The Steelers stink, too. He would be making about as much difference here as he is there.

 

[topseed]

I think you are using hindsight, whether you want to admit it or not. You had a guy who did nothing for 3 years. He played pretty well in 2012, but I would not call him a #1. He didn't make plays on the ball. He just didn't. I am not saying because Taylor can't, Lewis wouldn't. I am saying you have to go with what you see, and IMO you saw a future with another guy who hadn't proven he could make picks. I wouldn't pay for that. I wouldn't have paid Allen, either. I never said they should have done that.

Keenan Lewis plays on a 2-4 football team. The Steelers stink, too. He would be making about as much difference here as he is there.

I don't know what you were watching. He did nothing for three years? LOL. Lewis was second in the league (behind Richard Sherman) with 23 passed defended in 2012, and was at or near the top of the list of free agent cornerbacks in 2013. The Steelers didn't want the guy, but at least four other teams besides the Saints had visits set up with him.

Lewis made a HUGE difference in New Orleans last year. In 2012, they were 31st in the league in pass defense, allowing 292.6 yards per game. In 2013, they gave up nearly 100 ypg less and finished #2. The Steelers went from #1 with him to #9 without him.

I'm not sure how much football you watch (evidently it's not a whole lot), but if you happened to tune in for the Saints-Cowboys SNF game a few weeks ago, even you could plainly see how effective Lewis was in covering one of the best wideouts in league, Dez Bryant. If you think he wouldn't be making a difference in Pittsburgh, after they trotted the worst cornerback in the league out there for six starts, you must be truly blind.

 

[Wingman]

#1 cover corners don't grow on trees. Ike Taylor couldn't catch a cold, but his coverage skills were evident. This mystical non-fear factor you speak of is negligible. Normally, quarterbacks try to throw to the open guy. They're not thinking: "Well, gee, let me see if I can force this ball to receiver x, even though he's covered, because I won't throw a pick to Ike Taylor."

Lewis wasn't the same thing. Just because Ike has shown no improvement with his hands over a long career doesn't mean it's impossible for another guy to get better. And Keenan did get better, with 4 INTs last year, more than Taylor's ever had in a season.

They let a guy in the prime of his career, who can cover, walk and sign for 5 mill a year, and signed an unproven player in Allen to 6 mill a year, who is now ranked 106th out of 106 eligible cornerbacks according to PFF. And they still have that other guy with the ****** hands, except that he's too old to cover anymore. Plus a journeyman and no depth at the position whatsoever.

You didn't need hindsight back in 2013 to realize Ike was just about done, and Lewis was clearly better than Allen. You just needed sight.

It takes two to tango, I also believe there was interest in Lewis going to New Orleans because he was from that area of the country. I seem to recall it being discussed on here and the Steelers did not want to get into a bidding war for a player as well. In many instances a player will make a jump in maturity after his first contract particularly when going to a second team. Lewis may have also done that, although I do not know as I do not follow players when they leave the team.

 

[diver]

I don't know what you were watching. He did nothing for three years? LOL. Lewis was second in the league (behind Richard Sherman) with 23 passed defended in 2012, and was at or near the top of the list of free agent cornerbacks in 2013. The Steelers didn't want the guy, but at least four other teams besides the Saints had visits set up with him.

Lewis made a HUGE difference in New Orleans last year. In 2012, they were 31st in the league in pass defense, allowing 292.6 yards per game. In 2013, they gave up nearly 100 ypg less and finished #2. The Steelers went from #1 with him to #9 without him.

I'm not sure how much football you watch (evidently it's not a whole lot), but if you happened to tune in for the Saints-Cowboys SNF game a few weeks ago, even you could plainly see how effective Lewis was in covering one of the best wideouts in league, Dez Bryant. If you think he wouldn't be making a difference in Pittsburgh, after they trotted the worst cornerback in the league out there for six starts, you must be truly blind.

Lewis was drafted in 2009. I don't recall him doing much of anything until 2012. '09, '10, and '11 is 3 years.

Again, at the time, the guy just didn't make turnovers. That is just a damn fact. One interception in four years. This is a Steeler defense that has been struggling to make turnovers for years, so you pay a guy big money who UP TO THAT POINT didn't turn the ball over?

Dammit, you do not read. I never said they should have paid Allen. This is the problem with the Steelers. They are paying average football players big money. That is the issue. We will just have to disagree on Lewis. At least Cortez Allen had some picks, for crying out loud. Hell, I ever remember a game in which he shut down Rob Gronkowski. He showed some potential.

They have to stop paying average football players. I think they did the right thing letting Lewis go. They shouldn't have paid Allen, either. Watch them make the same mistake this offseason with Ben, who has become really an average QB.

 

[STEELERS R GR8]

Here is a link that pretty much covers the years here for Lewis and also the last year in detail. This is a very long article but lots of information, the people who don't read this are the people who just want to say the Steelers made a mistake not signing him, the people who do read this might have a different opinion. The contract that Lewis signed with the Saints was a good one and the contract we gave Allen was a bad one and contracts like that is why the Steelers are hurting every year vs the cap but that is a different story. Did the Steelers make a mistake not signing Lewis, well yeah we can say that now but read this article and maybe you might see what the Steelers were thinking.

http://presnapreads.com/2013/06/30/keenan-lewis-the-numbers-the-tape-the-verdict/

 

[Vader]

Here is a link that pretty much covers the years here for Lewis and also the last year in detail. This is a very long article but lots of information, the people who don't read this are the people who just want to say the Steelers made a mistake not signing him, the people who do read this might have a different opinion. The contract that Lewis signed with the Saints was a good one and the contract we gave Allen was a bad one and contracts like that is why the Steelers are hurting every year vs the cap but that is a different story. Did the Steelers make a mistake not signing Lewis, well yeah we can say that now but read this article and maybe you might see what the Steelers were thinking.

http://presnapreads.com/2013/06/30/keenan-lewis-the-numbers-the-tape-the-verdict/

I've read it and other articles before. I've also seen him interviewed. Lewis wasn't a great CB but that's par for the course. The Steelers need to sign people that can actually play the position unlike Allen who has been benched and still manages to give up a ton of yards. I understand what the Steelers were thinking. I just don't agree with it. I know what they were thinking when they signed Allen. I just don't agree.

Also the guy who wrote the article is horrible at predictions. The season isn't half over and almost all his predictions are wrong.

 

[STEELERS R GR8]

I've read it and other articles before. I've also seen him interviewed. Lewis wasn't a great CB but that's par for the course. The Steelers need to sign people that can actually play the position unlike Allen who has been benched and still manages to give up a ton of yards. I understand what the Steelers were thinking. I just don't agree with it. I know what they were thinking when they signed Allen. I just don't agree.

Also the guy who wrote the article is horrible at predictions. The season isn't half over and almost all his predictions are wrong.

Well I am glad you know what the Steelers are thinking cause I have no clue what they were thinking by signing Allen. Honestly I thought it was a panic move after letting Lewis go, jmo!
As for the predictions that is not the part of the article I was referring to, I was more pointing out how Lewis didn't do a whole hell of a lot the 1st 3 seasons then in the last season how he went game by game.
My opinion is Lewis didn't show me anything special so I am not one of them guys who keep beating the "we should have signed him long term" drum like people are saying about Sanders as well. These two guys are very similar and make for good talk on these boards.

 

[Vader]

Well I am glad you know what the Steelers are thinking cause I have no clue what they were thinking by signing Allen. Honestly I thought it was a panic move after letting Lewis go, jmo!
As for the predictions that is not the part of the article I was referring to, I was more pointing out how Lewis didn't do a whole hell of a lot the 1st 3 seasons then in the last season how he went game by game.
My opinion is Lewis didn't show me anything special so I am not one of them guys who keep beating the "we should have signed him long term" drum like people are saying about Sanders as well. These two guys are very similar and make for good talk on these boards.

It's obvious what they were thinking isn't it? They thought Allen would be just as good or better than Lewis. They never even talked to Lewis. So understanding their thinking isn't difficult. The article made some good points. But the Steelers, for whatever reason, felt Allen was their guy. I didn't agree then and sure as hell don't agree now. My issues was that people think Lewis left to go home. That just isn't true. He left because the Steelers didn't want him. He had no problem staying.

 

[topseed]

It takes two to tango, I also believe there was interest in Lewis going to New Orleans because he was from that area of the country. I seem to recall it being discussed on here and the Steelers did not want to get into a bidding war for a player as well. In many instances a player will make a jump in maturity after his first contract particularly when going to a second team. Lewis may have also done that, although I do not know as I do not follow players when they leave the team.

Offering a decent contract to one of your starting cornerbacks who has performed well isn't equivalent to entering a "bidding war," in my opinion. Lewis had actually begun to consider Pittsburgh as a second home...until the Steelers orphaned him out.

 

[JJ_Steel]

Not to at least gauge his interest in staying with the Steelers was beyond stupid and arrogant, typical of Tombert.

 

[topseed]

Lewis was drafted in 2009. I don't recall him doing much of anything until 2012. '09, '10, and '11 is 3 years.

Again, at the time, the guy just didn't make turnovers. That is just a damn fact. One interception in four years. This is a Steeler defense that has been struggling to make turnovers for years, so you pay a guy big money who UP TO THAT POINT didn't turn the ball over?

Usually, third-round cornerbacks don't get involved much at the start. Lewis started showing his ability in 2011, which is why he became the starter in 2012.

Wow, you're really hung up on this non-turnover issue. Again, I'd much rather have a guy who can cover. And again, Lewis proved last year he could create interceptions, so evidently the Steelers were wrong.

Dammit, you do not read. I never said they should have paid Allen. This is the problem with the Steelers. They are paying average football players big money. That is the issue. We will just have to disagree on Lewis. At least Cortez Allen had some picks, for crying out loud. Hell, I ever remember a game in which he shut down Rob Gronkowski. He showed some potential.

They have to stop paying average football players. I think they did the right thing letting Lewis go. They shouldn't have paid Allen, either. Watch them make the same mistake this offseason with Ben, who has become really an average QB.

I read. Do you? Where did I say that you said they should have paid Allen? I'm saying that despite this glaring weakness (according to you) of not seeing turnovers from Lewis, he still showed much more ability at the cornerback position than Allen, and they should have at the very least offered him a contract at a thin position.

Yeah, at least Cortez Allen had some picks, because that's all that matters. By God, he's got two more this year, he must be having a monster season.

And I think either your memory is failing you, or you're trying to pull some **** out of your *** with Gronkowski. In the two games he's played against the Steelers since Cortez has been here, in 2011 and 2013, he caught 7 balls for 94 yards and had 9 receptions for 143 yards and a touchdown, respectively.


Yes, we will have to disagree on Lewis, who allowed Jordy Nelson 25 yards on 3 catches last night, and couldn't even manage to pick one off.

 

[F83]

looks like Tomlin or Haley sat Wheaton @ Bryant and showed Sanders highlights from his big game and said you 2 are to replace him , Marcus the above people let manny go b/c you 2 have the same style of play, same speed, now it is time you make those catch able passes thrown at your way and Bryant kid if you want to keep playing you got to make play's.