Lake opens up:Boykin had a degenerative hip, William Jackson would have been th pick

[POP]

I know nobody likes cliché answers and like to get the inside scoop and as it pertains to Boykin fine. I imagine that most knew WJ3 was their target however it isn't necessary to make that public. Puts Burns in a difficult position looking like sloppy seconds. Puts the brass in a bad position knowing most of us felt that it was a reach and they should have at least taken the deal the Seahawks got. Not smart by a guy who should know better than that.

Can't agree with that at all. Doesn't Burns know we would have preferred Jalen Ramsey over him as well? Certainly. Does that make him feel like "sloppy seconds?" No. So what if he knows we would have preferred another player over him?

It's not relevant at all.

It should motivate him to prove everyone wrong. Show us that you're better than WJIII. (I doubt he will).

 

[slashsteel]

This coming from the person whining that I make unsolicited ad hominem attacks. What total bull ****.

You can't even START a thread without trying to insult me. Don't cry when I figuratively knock your teeth out like chicklets. If this isn't a clear violation against board rules, what is?

What's up with your wife?

 

[stillwright]

I know nobody likes cliché answers and like to get the inside scoop and as it pertains to Boykin fine. I imagine that most knew WJ3 was their target however it isn't necessary to make that public. Puts Burns in a difficult position looking like sloppy seconds. Puts the brass in a bad position knowing most of us felt that it was a reach and they should have at least taken the deal the Seahawks got. Not smart by a guy who should know better than that.

I will guess that the "BRASS" could give two ***** about what "most of us" think or thought.

 

[slashsteel]

Can't agree with that at all. Doesn't Burns know we would have preferred Jalen Ramsey over him as well? Certainly. Does that make him feel like "sloppy seconds?" No. So what if he knows we would have preferred another player over him?

It's not relevant at all.

It should motivate him to prove everyone wrong. Show us that you're better than WJIII. (I doubt he will).

Because you knowwwwww who will be the better player.

 

[deljzc]

I'm not buying this.

If this was such a degenerative condition, why did we never hear him missing any practice time? Why was he never on any injury report. A LOT of people have one leg shorter than the other with no adverse conditions. The eye test said he could play.

When he finally did get in games, he did just fine. Where was his problem then?

Lake said, "He could hardly run???"

I never observed him having a problem running. He was always tight on his man, not limping around as Lake suggests.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m2ballhnwKs

Gotta be his right leg that's shorter, right?

It's very tough to see anything wrong with him physically on that highlight reel. Maybe it got worse over the last 18 months. Degenerative does mean "gets worse over time"....

I love that Lake was being at least honest about WJIII vs. Burns (unlike Tomlin and Colbert). If anything this just proves that there are times Tomlin and Colbert are just flat our lying about draft picks.

Also, this further bothers me about the running to the podium. You think after Cincinnati takes the guy you want, there would at least be a PAUSE to reevaluate the board or reconsider the trade offers coming from Denver. Not for our war room.

 

[Litos]

Gotta be his right leg that's shorter, right?

It's very tough to see anything wrong with him physically on that highlight reel. Maybe it got worse over the last 18 months. Degenerative does mean "gets worse over time"....

I love that Lake was being at least honest about WJIII vs. Burns (unlike Tomlin and Colbert). If anything this just proves that there are times Tomlin and Colbert are just flat our lying about draft picks.

Also, this further bothers me about the running to the podium. You think after Cincinnati takes the guy you want, there would at least be a PAUSE to reevaluate the board or reconsider the trade offers coming from Denver. Not for our war room.

Maybe it was 1.A and 1.B with WJIII and Burns at that position and Joseph already taken. I don't like the run to the podium stuff but they still probably had a plan already set since before the bungles turn

 

[Steel Vanguard]

Because you knowwwwww who will be the better player.

It's so goddamn hard. I would never want to be an NFL scout or general manager and have my livelihood dictated by which players pan out and which ones don't. It's really hard.

I was SURE Plax would be a giant bust. I was SURE Kendrell Bell (Contact!) would be the next great Steeler. And I'm a know-nothing fan. The experts get this **** wrong ALL THE TIME. Tim Couch, first overall, Courtney Brown, first overall, Ryan Leaf, second overall, David Carr, First Overall. Most first round QBs are either busts or journeyman. There are obvious bad calls like JaMarcus Russell and Dri Archer, but those guys are the exception not the rule.

I've come to the conclusion that anyone who claims to know for sure is more than likely full of ****.

 

[antdrewjosh]

What's to consider? We would of taken Jackson. Ok. But if he was gone we obviously were prepared to take Burns. Does it matter if Jackson was taken 10 spots 5 spots 1 spot before we picked. What difference does it make. In the pre draft process we had Jackson above Burns but also had burns part of the group of players we would take at at our pick. What's the problem???

 

[FordFairLane]

LOL. Panicked......months of prep work and you think they panicked. Our front office must be the most inept group in the league in your eyes. Maybe they just went to their draft board and took their next guy there. Nah.....that couldn't be it.

I think they were taking a CB come hell or high water and I'm sure burns was the next guy on their board at CB but no way no how was he the next guy on their board.

 

[slashsteel]

I think they were taking a CB come hell or high water and I'm sure burns was the next guy on their board at CB but no way no how was he the next guy on their board.

and you know this how?

 

[FordFairLane]

and you know this how?

Because I have more faith in our scouting department than that.

 

[Spike]

William Jackson would have been the pick

I knew it - they panicked

 

[SteelerSask2]

I will guess that the "BRASS" could give two ***** about what "most of us" think or thought.

Everyone who works in an organization knows stuff. You keep your mouth shut so you don't make your boss look like an idiot. If Burns busts it will look real bad. How much would it cost to jump ahead of The Bengals. I guess we will never know, but there wasnt much ammo because they picked up the guy with one leg shorter than the other and a kicker that couldn't kick. Not exactly looking brilliant.

 

[Steel Vanguard]

Everyone who works in an organization knows stuff. You keep your mouth shut so you don't make your boss look like an idiot. If Burns busts it will look real bad. How much would it cost to jump ahead of The Bengals. I guess we will never know, but there wasnt much ammo because they picked up the guy with one leg shorter than the other and a kicker that couldn't kick. Not exactly looking brilliant.

A better question would be this: which looks worse?

A: You take what the draft gives you (Burns) and he busts out

or

B: You trade up for Jackson, giving up additional picks and he busts out

The smart play was A, and that's what we did. Jackson is not Deion Sanders, and Burns has both size and talent with a side of character.

 

[slashsteel]

Because I have more faith in our scouting department than that.

still not putting the two together. As I don't you don't Joe Shmoe doesn't know the range of the prospects left on their board.

There could have been (to throw **** on the wall) five prospects that the Steelers thought were worthy of drafting at that spot. And Burns was the last corner.

Giving their track record in the first, I am more willing to think that was the scenario than them just flat out reaching.

 

[DBS1970]

What does it say about our secondary when a guy the coach says could barely run was one of the better players at his position? At least they are trying to address needs rather than drafting a project.

 

[ZACKB]

AZ and KC were interested in Burns...he never would have made it to 32

 

[SteelerFan448]

A better question would be this: which looks worse?

A: You take what the draft gives you (Burns) and he busts out

or

B: You trade up for Jackson, giving up additional picks and he busts out

The smart play was A, and that's what we did. Jackson is not Deion Sanders, and Burns has both size and talent with a side of character.

Beyond whether a player is a bust or not, you make the move if you think there is a big separation between the two players. If the Steelers thought Jackson was going to be the next Woodson, then you make a trade. However, if you project Jackson and Burns to be similar players, then take a chance and stand pat. Apparently the Steelers didn't believe that Jackson was going to be the next great superstar at corner or else I think you have to make the move.

 

[deljzc]

AZ and KC were interested in Burns...he never would have made it to 32

Link for Kansas City? They just drafted Marcus Peters....

I love how we just PROVED front offices lie about interest in players all the time yet you are now taking the word of leaked information BEFORE the draft as gospel?

You don't know one iota whether or not Burns is available at pick 32. You just flat 100% do not know. You make this **** up like it's fact and you are just flat wrong on this.

 

[ark steel]

I love how we just PROVED front offices lie about interest in players all the time

Well, I don't know what was PROVED. What is PROVED is the FO says something, you don't believe them. Another coach says something and you do.....

Maybe Lake is lying?

 

[FordFairLane]

still not putting the two together. As I don't you don't Joe Shmoe doesn't know the range of the prospects left on their board.

There could have been (to throw **** on the wall) five prospects that the Steelers thought were worthy of drafting at that spot. And Burns was the last corner.

Giving their track record in the first, I am more willing to think that was the scenario than them just flat out reaching.

I don't know certainly, but I do know looking at Burns and his lack of athleticism, rawness, and the fact most draft experts had him as a second or third round prospect that either we panicked and jumped on the next CB on our board or have a bunch of nincompoops scouting. I am going with we panicked. Even a pause and letting the clock tick down to maybe see if the Broncos would sweeten the deal a little. It was a very fair trade offer by the numbers but lets say they felt the trade was only fair and that they weren't getting a "deal" just a fair trade. Well, see if they'd throw in a 5th which we were missing. But now we had pre-decided before the draft even started we would take a CB no matter what. That drives me up the wall!!! I would prefer taking a position of not as much need as long as it meant getting good value for your spot. And if you have your guy taken in front of you look at who drafts after you. No one minus the Panthers were really in need of a CB. Most likely, they could have traded back and still got Burns at the end of the first round. Now I cannot be certain of that either but odds are they still would have been able to get Burns.

 

[Coach]

Originally Posted by ZACKB View Post
AZ and KC were interested in Burns...he never would have made it to 32

Link for Kansas City? They just drafted Marcus Peters....

I love how we just PROVED front offices lie about interest in players all the time yet you are now taking the word of leaked information BEFORE the draft as gospel?

You don't know one iota whether or not Burns is available at pick 32. You just flat 100% do not know. You make this **** up like it's fact and you are just flat wrong on this.

Correct. No one can say for certain if Burns would have been there at pick #32.

12 other players were selected until the next corner came off the board and most independent draft people had Burns rated from Pick #40-60.

My guess is Burns slips out of round one if we did not take him.

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

Well, I don't know what was PROVED. What is PROVED is the FO says something, you don't believe them. Another coach says something and you do.....

Maybe Lake is lying?

I agree. Otherwise Carolina just bought a bill of goods. Maybe when the hip gets bad enough we can sign him back for league minimum , etc...

I don't care so much about artie burns vs. Jackson. We all know who was preferred.

But the whole fiasco of bringing in boykin and not playing him,,and then losing him to FA. Its just ridiculous.

 

[POP]

It's so goddamn hard. I would never want to be an NFL scout or general manager and have my livelihood dictated by which players pan out and which ones don't. It's really hard.

I was SURE Plax would be a giant bust. I was SURE Kendrell Bell (Contact!) would be the next great Steeler. And I'm a know-nothing fan. The experts get this **** wrong ALL THE TIME. Tim Couch, first overall, Courtney Brown, first overall, Ryan Leaf, second overall, David Carr, First Overall. Most first round QBs are either busts or journeyman. There are obvious bad calls like JaMarcus Russell and Dri Archer, but those guys are the exception not the rule.

I've come to the conclusion that anyone who claims to know for sure is more than likely full of ****.

I know very few who ever claim to know for sure about almost any player. Even some supposed "blue chips" end up sucking.

Tim Couch, Akili Smith, Heath Shuler, Ryan Leaf, Blair Thomas, Curtis Enis, Jermain Stephens, Kajana Carter, Dan McGwire, Tony Mandarich, David Klingler, Andre Ware, Jamarcus Russell, Huey Richardson....

 

[POP]

What does it say about our secondary when a guy the coach says could barely run was one of the better players at his position? At least they are trying to address needs rather than drafting a project.

I'm not buying it. I have never seen any evidence that Boink "couldn't run." He wasn't on any injury reports, didn't miss any practice time that was ever reported, showed no signs of "not being able to run" when he did play in games.

I think the team is just trying to throw some propaganda and half truths out there to cover up a blunder (i.e. trading a draft pick away for a player that they barely ever played). This has all the signs of "CYA" to me, which the Steelers
are fond of (as opposed to admitting mistakes).