Excellent Article on Coaching

[Coach]

and you are still wrong.

Am I? Which active tenured coach has aworse record in the playoffs than 3-6 for his last nine? .

I'll save you some time. Out of coaches that have 8 or more playoff winsTomlin's winning percentage out of 25 coaches is 22nd worst. And guys behind him like Tony Dungy or Andy Reid didn't have Ben Roethlisberger at Quarterback for their entire career. I would say Dungy is a better coach than Tomlin. Maybe Reid too, even if he lacks a super bowl.

Coach Sean Peyton had 7 playoff wins, he'll likely pass Tomlin soon in terms of winning percentage for the playoffs. So could quickly be 24th worst of 26.

The Steelers have too much talent and sometimes a weak division not to win 9-13 games a year.

Quick prediction, if we are one and done again, the Fire Tomlin thread will bepage one news for a while. 3 wins in the last 10 tries for the playoffs =epic fail.

 

[paperclip]

Most of Tomlin's playoff success happened with Bill Cowher players.

you still have to be a good coach to have success. previous coach's players or not.

 

[paperclip]

Tony Dungy had Peyton Manning for most of his career

 

[ark steel]

Am I? Which active tenured coach has aworse record in the playoffs than 3-6 for his last nine? .

I'll save you some time. Out of coaches that have 8 or more playoff winsTomlin's winning percentage out of 25 coaches is 22nd worst. And guys behind him like Tony Dungy or Andy Reid didn't have Ben Roethlisberger at Quarterback for their entire career. I would say Dungy is a better coach than Tomlin. Maybe Reid too, even if he lacks a super bowl.

Coach Sean Peyton had 7 playoff wins, he'll likely pass Tomlin soon in terms of winning percentage for the playoffs. So could quickly be 24th worst of 26.

The Steelers have too much talent and sometimes a weak division not to win 9-13 games a year.

Quick prediction, if we are one and done again, the Fire Tomlin thread will bepage one news for a while. 3 wins in the last 10 tries for the playoffs =epic fail.

Yes, you are still wrong. Average coaches dont get that many playoff games.

 

[bermudasteel]

cheats,Chargers, and Saints is our Huckleberry. Those will be good watches.

Here's the thing - none of those defenses are as good as JAX, all around - and I'll go as far as saying the Rats D is better than all 3 teams as well. WE beat those two defenses already. So, three shootouts - I'll take Ben !!!

 

[Coach]

Deflect the argument when you’ve been shown the idiot you are.

What does Challenges have to do with penalties and penalty yards? Nothing genius. Keep getting schooled you moron.

And now you interpreted it wrong as usual, benching McCullers when he wasn’t getting the job done. Letting Hargrave ply nose and rush the passer. That’s called coaching decision. Your ego can’t cash the checks you write.


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Ike,

We are 1st overall in penalty yardage and 2nd overall in flags. Got it? Stop eating a$&^t sandwich and acting like it tastes good.

Secondarily, Tomlin is 0 for his last 7 on challenges. This cost his team timeouts, and plays into his sometimes suspect clock management.

Lastly I said NOTHING about McCullers lately. Your are confusing me with another poster...again. Get some help man.

 

[Steelworth]

Tomlin is also 7-2-1 and has won his last 6 games. And the penalties are continually going down as has been pointed out. And just a side note, it was funny to see the Jags get flagged for false starts in their stadium. And how many PF penalties did they have, 5-6?

 

[bermudasteel]

Cope,

I agree about results. What have the Steelers been in the playoffs? 13-3 means crap if you lose your first playoff game at home.

3-6 in the last nine when we were odds favorite more often than not? That my friend is the drink we have been served.

Wexell isn’t objective or correct in some cases. I pointed out a few in the article . The Steelers are a talented team.

I just want a head coach proactive to change not reactive after things blow up. I think I’m one of the least homer types here, as such I can be objective on less than popular observations and facts.


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Explain 'how' you replace Ryan Shazier proactively??? How about proactively being ready to change your Pro Bowl RB from smoking weed on the way to the game/airport??? Let's hear how you proactively change your WR roster when your top deep threat, too, is a weed head and gets suspended for the year??? Shall I go on???

We all know that there's BLUE CHIP talent and then there's talent - to think that ANY COACH can proactively pull another BLUE CHIPPER out of the ranks is quite hilarious...

But please do let us know how you would have proactively made these changes.

 

[ark steel]

Here's the thing - none of those defenses are as good as JAX, all around - and I'll go as far as saying the Rats D is better than all 3 teams as well. WE beat those two defenses already. So, three shootouts - I'll take Ben !!!

Im gonna go with losses to *'s and Saints.

 

[ark steel]

Honestly, when you can't even define "most", im not sure why you'd try to argue anything statistical.

 

[ark steel]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_National_Football_League_head_coaches_by_playoff_record

I don't know the accuracy. Only 19 coaches in nfl history have more playoff game appearances than Tomlin. I don't know how many coaches have had 11 seasons, though.

 

[Ike Kelly]

Did I read it correctly. Did Tomlin say there were not defensive adjustments yesterday?

I don't think Tomlin is the worst head coach. I see him as average.

Ike,

We are 1st overall in penalty yardage and 2nd overall in flags. Got it? Stop eating a$&^t sandwich and acting like it tastes good.

Secondarily, Tomlin is 0 for his last 7 on challenges. This cost his team timeouts, and plays into his sometimes suspect clock management.

Lastly I said NOTHING about McCullers lately. Your are confusing me with another poster...again. Get some help man.

Moron,

Your comment above says there were no defensive adjustments. The base 3/4 onset was with McCullers as NT. He was getting pushed around by a backup center. It was a COACHING decision to bench him. Replace him with Hargrave who was to be the 3rd down rusher in the alignment. You saw the results.

There was no adjustment to the defensive alignment. Only the personnel. That’s a coaching decision. But of course, you will find something else to push your agenda.

Guess what moron, KC is 2nd in yardage and 1st in penalties. Oh and hey! KC is 1st in the conference. Pitt is 2nd.

The two worse coached teams by your logic leading the conference. BS is BS and boy you have BS for brains. Just go back to preening at yourself in the mirror. Moron.


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[ark steel]

Accepted penalties only:

http://www.nflpenalties.com/index.php?year=2018&view=play

Chargers have 1 less penalty accepted than us. But 151 less plays.

Seattle, who everyone seems to think has a good coach has 3 less accepted penalties, but 80 less plays.

This gives the breakdown of the #of penalties per 100 plays. Puts us at 5th. Still high, but the difference between 5th and 15th is .5 penalties per 100 plays, which doesn't seem like a whole lot.

One interesting thing that this site shows is penalties and yards against you but also that you are the beneficiary of.

#1 in against yards per 100 plays at 39.652! We've been the beneficiaries of 34.112 penalty yards per 100 plays. That, sort of, fits Cope's theory of flag happy referees.

*'s have a net +10.521 yards per 100 plays over their opponents....

 

[bermudasteel]

Great talent. It's rather elementary dear Watson. Just ask Barry Switzer. Our best coaches at Munchak and Randy Fichtner, Todd Haley was awful. Tomlin sticking with Haley for years shows what he knows about the offense.

On coaches challenges, Tomlin is 0-3 this year. I'm sure guys on this board could do better, just look at the stadium replay. This only adds to bad clock management.

Did I read it correctly. Did Tomlin say there were not defensive adjustments yesterday?

I don't think Tomlin is the worst head coach. I see him as average.

One of your dumber opinions for sure...

 

[insaniti]

I like how he has completely ignored the comments and KC, or the fact that Dungy had PEYTON ******* MANNING for most of his career. I think we should refer to coach as the spin doctor from here on out.

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[SteelBuckeye]

Hey Coach ... with 5:35 left in the FIRST Qtr, the Chiefs have had 8 penalties called against them. Don't know how many were accepted, but 8 in the first alone? Yeah, much more disciplined than the Steelers. smh

 

[Stryker]

3-6 if you count the super bowl. And many of these were home games, or when the odds makers made us favorites to win.

If Tomlin goes 3 for his last 7 playoff games, he should be fired. That sucks. No top coach is that under preforming in playoff games.

Most of Tomlin's playoff success happened with Bill Cowher players.

Now you're just trolling...

 

[Stryker]

Am I? Which active tenured coach has aworse record in the playoffs than 3-6 for his last nine? .

I'll save you some time. Out of coaches that have 8 or more playoff winsTomlin's winning percentage out of 25 coaches is 22nd worst. And guys behind him like Tony Dungy or Andy Reid didn't have Ben Roethlisberger at Quarterback for their entire career. I would say Dungy is a better coach than Tomlin. Maybe Reid too, even if he lacks a super bowl.

Coach Sean Peyton had 7 playoff wins, he'll likely pass Tomlin soon in terms of winning percentage for the playoffs. So could quickly be 24th worst of 26.

The Steelers have too much talent and sometimes a weak division not to win 9-13 games a year.

Quick prediction, if we are one and done again, the Fire Tomlin thread will bepage one news for a while. 3 wins in the last 10 tries for the playoffs =epic fail.

Coach, the worst coaches don't make the playoffs. Tomlin has only missed the playoffs 3 times in his 11 years, and he's probably making it again this year. You are going to have playoff failure when you don't make it to the Super Bowl, which makes playoff record, the MOST SKEWED STAT you can quote. Though if you want to be fair, which you don't. Tomlin has a winning playoff record.

Steelers are #5 on O and #6 on D. We are the only team in the league that is top ten in yardage per game on both O and D. Tomlin's doing something right bro.

 

[topseed]

Pitt is in average 5-6 penalty yards more a game than KC and at one full penalty (8.6) less a game. So one 5 yard penalty is the difference. But KC coaches are pretty terrible by your logic since they lead the league in penalties flagged.

But wait....if they lead in penalties, how can they be the best team in the AFC with poor coaching? Clarify that genius.

So, suddenly, the Chiefs have great coaching, led by Andy Reid?

Another regular season champion. 11-13 in the playoffs.

At least Tomlin managed to win a Super Bowl.

 

[topseed]

Majority opinion? Go back and look at the "majority" opinion at the end of last year. Every one loved 13-3.... they were going to NE to... wait what? The coach is planning for NE but forgot about Jax?

The fact is that this team has to win a SB. Nothing else matters. Since Haley is gone, Brady's arm is shot and Tomlin is a genius/ master coach the trophy should be coming right? But I'm going out on a limb and say if it doesn't come Tomlin won't be blame by the "majority". It's going to be the OC, DC, players, cheating pats****, cheating refs, rigged games ETC.... Just like last year.

Exactly.

I've been saying for years (and years) that I will forever stop criticizing Tomlin the day he wins a second Super Bowl. Needless to say, I'm still waiting.


And as far as this wonderfully biased article is concerned, it might indeed take the jaws of life to extract the author's nose from Tomlin's anal pore.

1) Yes, we all like the new OC. For Christ's sake, it only took the ******* Browns (!) a half a season to realize they made a mistake with Haley...what took the Steelers so long?

2) Of course Tomlin wasn't going to do **** about AB, the guy who has so much respect for his head coach that he was on his own social media during Tomlin's locker room address to the team, completely ignoring him. Coach T let that nonsense slide, too.

3) Of course Tomlin was going to side with Conner -- he's a volunteer, not a hostage, right?

4) Yeah, I would say a 1-2-1 first quarter of the season would indeed qualify as coming "out of the gate sluggishly," but hell, let's hand Tomlin credit for having all his vets healthy (um, except for Gilbert and Tuitt, that is...they don't count).

5) Let's give Tomlin kudos for benching Artie Burns...but of course no blame for wasting a first round pick on him. Full credit must be given to Tomlin (and Tomlin only) for the Switzer acquisition, however.

6) "Easing Morgan Burnett through the preseason." Wait, what? Didn't this guy already miss a bunch of games? Yeah, another part of the "rest the vets" plan that worked out great!

7) Yes, Tomlin finally figured out that Bostic couldn't cover his grandmother, and LJ Fort is a bit better in passing situations. Wow. How insightful.

8) He let the backup quarterback throw a pass when the other team was expecting a run. A great call, no doubt. And evidently worthy of Tomlin's immediate induction into the HOF.

9) It only took Tomlin three years to figure out that Feiler is better at tackle, his natural position? Awesome!

10) I don't even understand what the **** the author is talking about with the Bostic/Williams dynamic, and/or how it relates to what a great coach Tomlin is. Maybe one of you nuthuggers can explain it.

11) Yes, we're all happy that Mike Mitchell is finally gone, and we all know that Sean Davis can play different positions, and it looks like he's found a home at free safety after nearly three seasons. Amen.

12) Wow, another ingenious move by the head coach to put Watt on the side where he's actually more comfortable, and moving Bud away from where he's sucked for so long. Amazing insight.

13) And finally, yes, Tomlin is seriously compared to Chuck Noll (two guys whose personalities couldn't be more polar opposites) because he "understands how the camera is always on him" on the sideline. Naw, that spittle never made it to Tomlin's players, pal -- it got stuck in his own beard, sitting there symbolically for those cameras to focus in on at the end of the Steelers' lone playoff game last season, adding insult to injury as Blake Bortles and the Jacksonville Jaguars embarrassed them in Pittsburgh, and never gave him a chance to continue his preparation for the Patriots...remember?

 

[Stryker]

Topseed, you are well within your right to criticize Tomlin. He's not perfect, but he's not terrible as you are insinuating, and he's not devoid of impact here. He's improved in many areas where bashers have been blasting him on:

Game plans
Preparedness
Ability to change the game plan mid game when it isn't working
Sticking with players that aren't getting the job done
Not calling plays that can be successful on 3rd/4th and short or goal line
Bringing back the QB Sneak
Control of the Locker room
Not allowing Bell's absence to be a team distraction
Helping to get the D out of the basement and into the top 10 - Though Butler gets the most credit here
Developing young talent
The AB thing went away after their meeting, and AB has been quiet off the field, and balling on the field since.
Penalties
Personnel acquisition in free agency (though Colbert deserves most of the credit here, Tomlin just has to let him know his needs)

This team has improved in all of these areas. Sure Tomlin can improve with challenges, and some end game scenarios (we were atrocious in September), but I can see where the improvement lies. Tomlin brought in his guys on OC and DC. All of his coaches are his now. Colbert works really well with Tomlin to get him the pieces we need to be successful, but then again we aren't perfect. No team is. But this team is making more positive moves than negative moves, which is why they consistently win.

And one thing where resting starters does help: No season ending injuries this year (knock on wood). Every injury is a nagging one. Tuitt will be back, same as Gilbert. Chick might be gone for the year if that's a break, but injuries happen in games, we're late in the season, and we're going to start losing players for the year with smaller injuries, because they won't have enough time to rehab to get back. It's giving your team the best chance early in the season, so your team is not derailed by a season ender. And I'm fine with slow Septembers if it means AB, Ben, Pouncey, DeCastro, Haden, Heyward, and Tuitt don't sit out the year with a preseason game injury. Coaching moves are already set on the roster, we have a WR Eli, and OLB Ola that can be called up from IR now. Good depth on the PS. Burnett has a groin, hurt first day of camp, and came back to play the first 2 preseason games. out the next 2 reinjured week 2, and just within the past 3 weeks is able to return, and is now being eased back into the D. Injuries dictate performance, not the coach. You can't make someone play hurt.

Feiler moving to tackle, you probably have to give the most credit to Munch here, but he can play any position on the line (except center, don't ever want him snapping).

Watt was good on either side. Dupree sucked on the left. It was good to make a move that benefitted both players, though I would give more credit to Butler and Porter for doing this.

Success is measured in Lombardis, Tomlin knows that. I'm sure he'd agree that all but one year was a failure in that respect. I'd also say that I like the improvement this year, and the Head Coach should get a lot of credit.

 

[CharlesDavenport]

Tomlin is also 7-2-1 and has won his last 6 games. And the penalties are continually going down as has been pointed out. And just a side note, it was funny to see the Jags get flagged for false starts in their stadium. And how many PF penalties did they have, 5-6?

True, and I am on record as saying Tomlin is doing well and trending up. The 7-2-1 record is a little misleading IMO. You can't control who you play, but Carolina is the only team we've beaten that has a winning record.

 

[paperclip]

Accepted penalties only:

http://www.nflpenalties.com/index.php?year=2018&view=play

Chargers have 1 less penalty accepted than us. But 151 less plays.

Seattle, who everyone seems to think has a good coach has 3 less accepted penalties, but 80 less plays.

This gives the breakdown of the #of penalties per 100 plays. Puts us at 5th. Still high, but the difference between 5th and 15th is .5 penalties per 100 plays, which doesn't seem like a whole lot.

One interesting thing that this site shows is penalties and yards against you but also that you are the beneficiary of.

#1 in against yards per 100 plays at 39.652! We've been the beneficiaries of 34.112 penalty yards per 100 plays. That, sort of, fits Cope's theory of flag happy referees.

*'s have a net +10.521 yards per 100 plays over their opponents....

there you go.

perhaps the number of penalties per play is the way to look at this stat, not penalties per game. thanks for digging through.

 

[ark steel]

there you go.

perhaps the number of penalties per play is the way to look at this stat, not penalties per game. thanks for digging through.

I thought it was a bit more instructive than looking at total penalties, but I hadn't, really, expected to have that many more plays than other teams, either. it also avoids improper comparisons between teams that may not have had the same number of games, although the penalties per game stat does that, too.

You can get in trouble drilling down too much into a stat. For example, I stated .5 penalty per 100 plays doesn't seem like much. it doesn't, but an actual statistical analysis might show that it is.

 

[topseed]

Topseed, you are well within your right to criticize Tomlin. He's not perfect, but he's not terrible as you are insinuating, and he's not devoid of impact here. He's improved in many areas where bashers have been blasting him on:

Game plans
Preparedness
Ability to change the game plan mid game when it isn't working
Sticking with players that aren't getting the job done
Not calling plays that can be successful on 3rd/4th and short or goal line
Bringing back the QB Sneak
Control of the Locker room
Not allowing Bell's absence to be a team distraction
Helping to get the D out of the basement and into the top 10 - Though Butler gets the most credit here
Developing young talent
The AB thing went away after their meeting, and AB has been quiet off the field, and balling on the field since.
Penalties
Personnel acquisition in free agency (though Colbert deserves most of the credit here, Tomlin just has to let him know his needs)

This team has improved in all of these areas. Sure Tomlin can improve with challenges, and some end game scenarios (we were atrocious in September), but I can see where the improvement lies. Tomlin brought in his guys on OC and DC. All of his coaches are his now. Colbert works really well with Tomlin to get him the pieces we need to be successful, but then again we aren't perfect. No team is. But this team is making more positive moves than negative moves, which is why they consistently win.

And one thing where resting starters does help: No season ending injuries this year (knock on wood). Every injury is a nagging one. Tuitt will be back, same as Gilbert. Chick might be gone for the year if that's a break, but injuries happen in games, we're late in the season, and we're going to start losing players for the year with smaller injuries, because they won't have enough time to rehab to get back. It's giving your team the best chance early in the season, so your team is not derailed by a season ender. And I'm fine with slow Septembers if it means AB, Ben, Pouncey, DeCastro, Haden, Heyward, and Tuitt don't sit out the year with a preseason game injury. Coaching moves are already set on the roster, we have a WR Eli, and OLB Ola that can be called up from IR now. Good depth on the PS. Burnett has a groin, hurt first day of camp, and came back to play the first 2 preseason games. out the next 2 reinjured week 2, and just within the past 3 weeks is able to return, and is now being eased back into the D. Injuries dictate performance, not the coach. You can't make someone play hurt.

Feiler moving to tackle, you probably have to give the most credit to Munch here, but he can play any position on the line (except center, don't ever want him snapping).

Watt was good on either side. Dupree sucked on the left. It was good to make a move that benefitted both players, though I would give more credit to Butler and Porter for doing this.

Success is measured in Lombardis, Tomlin knows that. I'm sure he'd agree that all but one year was a failure in that respect. I'd also say that I like the improvement this year, and the Head Coach should get a lot of credit.

Never said Tomlin was terrible. Just wanted to point out how biased that article was. Most of the high praise in there was common sense stuff that you or I could figure out, and most certainly what I'd expect from any decent NFL head coach.

I can't say I agree with every part of your list there, but I will concede that Tomlin's done a good job cutting back on the penalties, which were out of control early in the season. And the defense has been better, for sure...but I think a huge part of that has been the development of Mike Hilton (which, no doubt you'll tell me is all because of Tomlin). However, the Steelers are still razor-thin at cornerback, and if something happens to Hilton and/or Haden, we'll surely see better quarterbacks start to eat this D alive again, unfortunately.

We've seen this movie before. Great regular season results. Long winning streaks. Never a losing record. Proud Tomlin lovers crowing about how wonderful the guy is...

But then, the playoff disappointments inevitably put the bashers back in the driver's seat, and we start the whole process over again the following season. I'm tired of that cycle, man. I think this team has enough talent as it's currently constituted to make a long postseason run. Let's keep our fingers crossed, and hope they do manage to stay healthy. If Tomlin has improved as much as you say he has, then come February, you'll never have to hear me criticize the man again.