• Please be aware we've switched the forums to their own URL. (again) You'll find the new website address to be www.steelernationforum.com Thanks
  • Please clear your private messages. Your inbox is close to being full.

with LeBeau forced out who is the leading candidates for D coordinator ?

The problem I have with all of this is we ARE actually better suited (thanks to our draft picks) for a 4-3 defense now.

I don't have faith in Tomlin because he was only a DC for 1 year in Minny.

He had something like a #14 rating on defense who while being #1 in run stopping....were LAST in pass defense. Other than THIS lengthy resume highlight, he was a secondary coach. How good is OUR secondary under Tomlin???

I think diver was the one who suggested Tomlin "might" try to hire Raheem Morris...another secondary coach with ZERO years as a DC. (He went from SC to HC then back to SC)

I hope IF we switch that Tomlin has the brains to pick up an experienced (successfully) 4-3 DC to run the show as we currently have NOBODY on our staff who has minus Tomlin's arguably marginal success as a 1 year DC in Minny.
 
keslerclan said:
The problem I have with all of this is we ARE actually better suited (thanks to our draft picks) for a 4-3 defense now.

I don't have faith in Tomlin because he was only a DC for 1 year in Minny.

He had something like a #14 rating on defense who while being #1 in run stopping....were LAST in pass defense. Other than THIS lengthy resume highlight, he was a secondary coach. How good is OUR secondary under Tomlin???

I think diver was the one who suggested Tomlin "might" try to hire Raheem Morris...another secondary coach with ZERO years as a DC. (He went from SC to HC then back to SC)

I hope IF we switch that Tomlin has the brains to pick up an experienced (successfully) 4-3 DC to run the show as we currently have NOBODY on our staff who has minus Tomlin's arguably marginal success as a 1 year DC in Minny.
Click to expand...

Tomlin had the Williams Wall (Pat and Kevin Williams) during his year at DC. They had a top run defense year in and year out during that time. They were the reason our 2008 defense wasn't the 6th (and 1st since '91 Eagles) to finish 1st in Total, Rushing, and Passing Defense.

I think Tomlin knows **** about X's and O's, honestly, and agree that we need experience at the position.
 
keslerclan said:
The problem I have with all of this is we ARE actually better suited (thanks to our draft picks) for a 4-3 defense now.

I don't have faith in Tomlin because he was only a DC for 1 year in Minny.

He had something like a #14 rating on defense who while being #1 in run stopping....were LAST in pass defense. Other than THIS lengthy resume highlight, he was a secondary coach. How good is OUR secondary under Tomlin???

I think diver was the one who suggested Tomlin "might" try to hire Raheem Morris...another secondary coach with ZERO years as a DC. (He went from SC to HC then back to SC)

I hope IF we switch that Tomlin has the brains to pick up an experienced (successfully) 4-3 DC to run the show as we currently have NOBODY on our staff who has minus Tomlin's arguably marginal success as a 1 year DC in Minny.
Click to expand...

See I disagree... the single best spot on the Defense is Middle linebacker. What do they do at DL? heyward probably maybe can make the transition, Mclendon may, and tuitt may, but there is no where for McCuellers, we have nobody suited for 4-3 OL, and frankly im not certain Timmons is the guy for a 4-3 middle LB position. If you stay 3-4 or go 4-3 either way we need 2 OL and an overhaul in the secondary. if you make the switch you also need at least one DL. and even if a shazier or Timmons could move to OLB in the system next year is going to be utter scrap... This is a move you don't make if you have an O like we do. its a full rebuild move.
 
I see it like this mad:

D-line left to right - Tuitt, McCullers, McClendon, Heyward
WLB-Shazier, MLB-Timmons SLB-Jones
LCB-Cortez, SS-Shamarko, FS-Mitchell, RCB-Gay

comparing this base set to CIN:
Dunlap, Peko, Adkins, Gilberry
Rey, Maualuga, Burfict
Hall, Iloka, Nelson, Newman

Doesn't look awful but staying w the 3-4 we have some HUGE holes:
LOLB-nobody, LDE-Tuitt, NT- McClendon/McCullers, RDE-Heyward, ROLB-Jones
Mack-Mike- Shazier/Spence, Timmons/Williams
LCB- Cortez/McCain, SS-Allen/Shamarko, FS-Mitchell/Allen, RCB-Gay/Blake

I don't know what the plan is BUT our defense did as good this year as talent would allow WHILE our offense was a TOTAL crapshoot despite some good and developing talent.

I hate the off-season! I know a lot of folks wanted DL gone but I have a feeling we will be sorry. To see a guy w as much respect league-wide disrespected to the point of coming out and STATING he is NOT retiring but resigning means that he opposed the direction the team wanted to go...this said, it wasn't to finally get Butler the job he's been promised, IMO.

When guys w his level of 'Cred' go down swinging, it make me believe he doesn't agree w the 'direction' our FO/HC have chosen which make me nervous since NONE of them carry this kind of experience or credibility. Our HC ran a defense for ONE year with decent talent and sucked at the thing we most suck at currently! I don't know what's in store but we were making progress...if not consistency. Now, we are letting someone else drive for the first time...we shall see.
 
I do not think lake is ready or qualified. Our secondary is still a weak point. Some of it is due to talent, but some is coaching. Mitchell / troy are always or of position, also how many times have cbs expected help over the top and not received it. Aside from gay the dbs have been iffy at best. Allen should have been a good project for Lake but he went downhill.

Another issue with lake is we are not talking about a tweak here or there on defense. The whole defense needs rebuilt and a new philosophy. Seems like too much to handle for someone who has not been coaching long.

I think we need someone with experience who has some fire and coaches aggressively. Currently we play soft and still get burnt deep so i don't think a more aggressive scheme will hurt. I want to see the steelers play D like Car / Sea again.
 
I would need to be committed to a mental institution if the Steelers hired Haslett again....
 
Chicoman said:
I think the Steelers will interview Rex Ryan honestly. They lured Munchak here last year and I feel they can do the same with Rex. Ryan switching to the 46 Defense but I'm not sure we have the personnel at the LB'er position to transition to a Rex Ryan 46 Defense as the OLB'ers typically match up against tackles to try and force the play inside or bounce back the other way where the backside LB'er has contain.

You also need a stud Free Safety who can be effective in run support and pass cover too....Safety is key to being able to run the 46.

I think the Steelers are best suited to the Tampa 2 Defense with the guys they have on that roster now. Especially the LB'ers.
Click to expand...
Munchak never had success, and was not getting another HC job until he did more assistant coaching. Rex had success, even without talent on the offensive side of the ball. Plus a pedigree of a head coach. The Ryan ego isnt taking a back seat. His old man took a swing at our old OC when they coached together in Houston. His brother dismissed his former team when fired, and is a lose cannon.

Ryan will be a head coach until he goes on TV and will be on TV being one of the most entertaining talking heads until he says something stupid a network has to fire him.
 
If they are committed to 3-4 you go Butler. If you are going 4-3, you might have to go outside the organization. If it was me, I'd be asking their intentions. This team can't play passive defense like they did. If you look at the game plan of the playoff game to the last time they played, not even close. Dick was schizo this year. He had a masterful game plan the last time they played where they crowded the line of scrimmage. In the playoffs, tin soldiers lined up for the battle of Waterloo. 3rd and 15 and they are getting burned with 4 man rushes.
 
Haven't read this whole thread, but has Greg Schiano been mentioned?

One of the guys on NFL Gameday (can't remember who) said that defensive players love to play for Rex Ryan because he has 'street cred', so they buy into his system completely (I'm paraphrasing). I think Schiano might also be someone that defensive players would want to play hard for, I think he could bring out the aggression in our defensive players that so many seem to have been lacking the past couple of years. I know he was an ******* at Tampa Bay, but I think we need an ******* to toughen up our defense and put fear in opposing teams the way we used to.

Off the Rex Ryan pimp wagon / on the Greg Schiano pimp wagon.
 
Stoney said:
Haven't read this whole thread, but has Greg Schiano been mentioned?

One of the guys on NFL Gameday (can't remember who) said that defensive players love to play for Rex Ryan because he has 'street cred', so they buy into his system completely (I'm paraphrasing). I think Schiano might also be someone that defensive players would want to play hard for, I think he could bring out the aggression in our defensive players that so many seem to have been lacking the past couple of years. I know he was an ******* at Tampa Bay, but I think we need an ******* to toughen up our defense and put fear in opposing teams the way we used to.

Off the Rex Ryan pimp wagon / on the Greg Schiano pimp wagon.
Click to expand...

I dunno if our First Take crowd is going to like that suggestion
 
The line between a 4-3 and a 3-4 are much blurred than it was a decade ago.

So many defenses are hybrids now. Teams run nickle (5 DB's) so often that what they do the rest of the time and the variations of the front-7 really doesn't define the defense anymore. The 3-4 defense we have run has not been exactly the same 2-gap system we ran under Cowher in his hey-day with Aaron Smith, Hampton and Kimo.

Tomlin has obviously even made changes to the size/shape of the LB's he wants over the years. I don't think players like Timmons and Shazier and maybe even Jarvis Jones would ever have been on Cowher's radar as draftable players for his system.

The 4-3 vs. 3-4 is just a "name" and doesn't really represent all the variations and different ways to approach defensive football.

In current football, I would argue the nickle defense is really the "Base" defense as it is often played the most and everything done on "traditional" downs is actually a hybrid situation where teams like to create their best matchups.
 
We've been running what is effectively a 4-3 on passing downs for a long time now.
 
Slaine said:
We've been running what is effectively a 4-3 on passing downs for a long time now.
Click to expand...

To little success unfortunately.
 
keslerclan said:
I see it like this mad:

D-line left to right - Tuitt, McCullers, McClendon, Heyward
WLB-Shazier, MLB-Timmons SLB-Jones
LCB-Cortez, SS-Shamarko, FS-Mitchell, RCB-Gay

comparing this base set to CIN:
Dunlap, Peko, Adkins, Gilberry
Rey, Maualuga, Burfict
Hall, Iloka, Nelson, Newman
Click to expand...

A team even worse than us at getting to the quarterback.
 
thesteelcity said:
hiring Horton wouldn't be a promotion for him. He's already a DC. My gut say it will be Butler. The Steelers are about promoting from within and loyalty. Keith Butler has shown that and the Rooneys don't take that lightly. Although a lot of players will be pissed with DL leaving, they may come back to earth to know someone familiar and they trust got the job. Just my opinion. . .
Click to expand...


Your opinioon, YES, but I don't think this is what is best for the team. If Butler is meeting (internally) with management about what direction he would take them. I hope management gives him ample response as to if he can direct in their coarse of heading. Thjat being said, management will decide if he is worth keeping or not. I HOPE there is a change of defensive philosophy in PITTSBURGH. Wade Phillips I kind of forgot about, he'd be an interesting candidate for sure.



Salute the nation
 
Drink IRON City said:
Your opinioon, YES, but I don't think this is what is best for the team. If Butler is meeting (internally) with management about what direction he would take them. I hope management gives him ample response as to if he can direct in their coarse of heading. Thjat being said, management will decide if he is worth keeping or not. I HOPE there is a change of defensive philosophy in PITTSBURGH. Wade Phillips I kind of forgot about, he'd be an interesting candidate for sure.



Salute the nation
Click to expand...

And at one time Butler's units ( thats what she said) was performing better. Is he still thought of in the same manner as he once was?


There is this possibility as well............
 
Drink IRON City said:
Your opinioon, YES, but I don't think this is what is best for the team. If Butler is meeting (internally) with management about what direction he would take them. I hope management gives him ample response as to if he can direct in their coarse of heading. Thjat being said, management will decide if he is worth keeping or not. I HOPE there is a change of defensive philosophy in PITTSBURGH. Wade Phillips I kind of forgot about, he'd be an interesting candidate for sure.

Salute the nation
Click to expand...

I honestly don't know if hiring Butler is the best option. What is interesting is that Butler wasn't immediately named the DC, if he has been in waiting or given the verbal agreement. If they want a change, they need to go outside of the organization for fresh eyes. Phillips is an interesting name to ponder.
 
thesteelcity said:
I honestly don't know if hiring Butler is the best option. What is interesting is that Butler wasn't immediately named the DC, if he has been in waiting or given the verbal agreement. If they want a change, they need to go outside of the organization for fresh eyes. Phillips is an interesting name to ponder.
Click to expand...

Out of all the coaches mentioned (we can leave Rex out of the equation) which would you consider the best motivator or X and O guy?

That college Clemson coach has be curious as well.....

I do agree with the notion it is time to look elsewhere for a coach. a different look a different approach...... They need to do their homework because the right decision could do great things for the team moving forward......................
 
slashsteel said:
Out of all the coaches mentioned (we can leave Rex out of the equation) which would you consider the best motivator or X and O guy?

That college Clemson coach has be curious as well.....

I do agree with the notion it is time to look elsewhere for a coach. a different look a different approach...... They need to do their homework because the right decision could do great things for the team moving forward......................
Click to expand...

Listening to The Fan today, Carnell Lake was mentioned, as Tomlin is a DB guy and values the backside of the defense. Plus, the job CL did with Blake, Gay and McClain. I guess they have a point there, but they have overlooked the secondary for far too long.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top