Watt’s Up?

[Drink IRON City]

I'm thinking now that the sticking point must be the guaranteed money...historically, the Steelers haven't offered a ton of it, but always payout the life of the contract to special players like TJ.

I think this new modern era football is going to change the way the franchise has done business in the past to present. They will get it done but it will take a change in business practices and that is what I think is holding this back. They are trying to compromise from both sides, bonus / pay / incentive(s).

EDIT: The STEELERS are honorable as look what they did for Ryan Shazier, paid him his contract even though he couldn't take the field. TJ knows this but His agent and STEELERS need to find that happy ground.



Salute the nation

 

[F83]

do it before teusday so he can practice wedensday and maybe break rust off by playing 1 series vs Philly

 

[Frosty]

Madden is going to break his arm patting himself on the back over this.

 

[TDX27]

Players like Watt are getting at least 50% of their contract guaranteed. The Steelers are going to have to give him 2 years salary guaranteed to have a chance of signing him. That is, unless, he decides to give them a discount on the guaranteed with an increase in the yearly salary by a few million per year.

 

[Drink IRON City]

Players like Watt are getting at least 50% of their contract guaranteed. The Steelers are going to have to give him 2 years salary guaranteed to have a chance of signing him. That is, unless, he decides to give them a discount on the guaranteed with an increase in the yearly salary by a few million per year.

I'm sure PITTSBURGH's current cap situation has something to do with it as well. How much upfront money can the STEELERS give with current situation ?



Salute the nation

 

[Confluence]

Do we have any reports on where the two sides are at? Dollar ranges, length, gtee wanted/needed?

He has to be above Bosa....the team cannot say "we just cannot do that $ this year"

 

[slashsteel]

Do we have any reports on where the two sides are at? Dollar ranges, length, gtee wanted/needed?

He has to be above Bosa....the team cannot say "we just cannot do that $ this year"

They have been a little mum on the subject. I have a feeling they will iron it out soon though. Just my gut instinct.

 

[stillwright]

The up-front money and guarantees are the sticking point. Steelers just don't have the available $$$ like some teams. Will they get it all worked out? Time will tell. In the end it might simply be best if we can't.

 

[swal75]

We finally figured out how to do voidable years this year so hopefully modern contract structure will be next. Plus we'll get to do this exact same dance with Fitzpatrick next year.

 

[Stryker]

We finally figured out how to do voidable years this year so hopefully modern contract structure will be next. Plus we'll get to do this exact same dance with Fitzpatrick next year.

I'm pretty sure voidable years are only for 1yr contracts. Haven's seen a multi year contract with voidable years yet.

 

[Drink IRON City]

We finally figured out how to do voidable years this year so hopefully modern contract structure will be next. Plus we'll get to do this exact same dance with Fitzpatrick next year.

ALSO our cap situation is quite a bit different for next year as well.



Salute the nation

 

[swal75]

I'm pretty sure voidable years are only for 1yr contracts. Haven's seen a multi year contract with voidable years yet.

I probably should have split that thought up.

We finally started to use voidable years this year, which catches us up with all the other teams. Hopefully now we can ditch our antiquated "signing bonus is all the guarantees" contract structure and move towards the modern deals that other team are using.

A multi-year deal with voidable years type deal could happen, the Cowboys use these deals as do other teams. Like if we paid watt 5/130 they could write it as a 7 year deal or something to that effect. The last 2 years could be voidable. How it might work is that Watt could have some huge option bonus on year 2 of the contract and you could convert and spread that option bonus over the 4 remaining years and the one voidable year. Say his year 3 salary is 10 million and he has a huge option bonus that year. You could convert a huge chunk of that money into a signing bonus, and then split that hit among the remaining 3 real years of his contract and the 2 fictitious void years. At some point you'd be taking a huge dead hit when those actual void years void but it'd be way down the line.

For example, deal is 5 years, 130 million, with 2 fake years added to make it technically a 7 year deal 25 million dollar signing bonus, 25 million dollar guaranteed roster bonus's in years 2+3

2021- 5 million dollar salary, 25 million dollar signing bonus, which counts as 5 million dollar proration (30M cash)-this keeps his 2021 hit as same as his 5th year option(10 million ish)
2022-10 million dollar salary, 5 million dollar SB proration, 25 million dollar roster bonus(converted, counts as 5m/year) cap hit 20m, cash 35m
2023-11 million dollar salary of which 10m is converted into a bonus and spread over 5 years(2m per), 5 million dollar sb proration, 5 million dollar '22 bonus proration, plus another 25 million dollar roster bonus(converted, counts as 5 million per year)-Cash 36 million, cap hit is 18m

At this point his guaranteed money is all paid out, he gets 101 million paid over the first 3 years.

2024-14 million salary, 5 million proration each from SB, 22 Roster Bonus, 23 roster bonus, 2 million from 2023 contract conversion, Cash-14 million, cap hit-31 million(STILL HAVE OPTION HERE TO CONVERT AND DUMP SOME OF THAT 14M SALARY ONTO 2025/2026/2027 CAPS TO REDUCE HIT, not doing that for this example but it's possible)
2025-15milion salary, 5 million proration each from SB, 22 Roster Bonus, 23 roster bonus, 2 million from 2023 contract conversion, cash 15 million, cap hit 32 million

DEAD MONEY going on 26 cap-19million
2026 5 million from '22 roster bonus, 5 million from '23 roster bonus, 2 million from 2023 contract convers-- 12 million
2027 5 million from '23 bonus, 2million from 2023 contract conversion-7 million

 

[TDX27]

This is a maybe. I can see Watt playing past his 5 year contract. At least I hope he does like Heyward has.

 

[stillwright]

We finally figured out how to do voidable years this year so hopefully modern contract structure will be next. Plus we'll get to do this exact same dance with Fitzpatrick next year.

Yeah. If we sign Watt I don't see us signing Fitz long-term next year. If the Watt deal doesn't get done we then may have an opportunity then to sign Fitz long-term. It's all about the guaranteed Benjamin's.

I probably should have split that thought up.

We finally started to use voidable years this year, which catches us up with all the other teams. Hopefully now we can ditch our antiquated "signing bonus is all the guarantees" contract structure and move towards the modern deals that other team are using.

A multi-year deal with voidable years type deal could happen, the Cowboys use these deals as do other teams. Like if we paid watt 5/130 they could write it as a 7 year deal or something to that effect. The last 2 years could be voidable. How it might work is that Watt could have some huge option bonus on year 2 of the contract and you could convert and spread that option bonus over the 4 remaining years and the one voidable year. Say his year 3 salary is 10 million and he has a huge option bonus that year. You could convert a huge chunk of that money into a signing bonus, and then split that hit among the remaining 3 real years of his contract and the 2 fictitious void years. At some point you'd be taking a huge dead hit when those actual void years void but it'd be way down the line.

For example, deal is 5 years, 130 million, with 2 fake years added to make it technically a 7 year deal 25 million dollar signing bonus, 25 million dollar guaranteed roster bonus's in years 2+3

2021- 5 million dollar salary, 25 million dollar signing bonus, which counts as 5 million dollar proration (30M cash)-this keeps his 2021 hit as same as his 5th year option(10 million ish)
2022-10 million dollar salary, 5 million dollar SB proration, 25 million dollar roster bonus(converted, counts as 5m/year) cap hit 20m, cash 35m
2023-11 million dollar salary of which 10m is converted into a bonus and spread over 5 years(2m per), 5 million dollar sb proration, 5 million dollar '22 bonus proration, plus another 25 million dollar roster bonus(converted, counts as 5 million per year)-Cash 36 million, cap hit is 18m

At this point his guaranteed money is all paid out, he gets 101 million paid over the first 3 years.

2024-14 million salary, 5 million proration each from SB, 22 Roster Bonus, 23 roster bonus, 2 million from 2023 contract conversion, Cash-14 million, cap hit-31 million(STILL HAVE OPTION HERE TO CONVERT AND DUMP SOME OF THAT 14M SALARY ONTO 2025/2026/2027 CAPS TO REDUCE HIT, not doing that for this example but it's possible)
2025-15milion salary, 5 million proration each from SB, 22 Roster Bonus, 23 roster bonus, 2 million from 2023 contract conversion, cash 15 million, cap hit 32 million

DEAD MONEY going on 26 cap-19million
2026 5 million from '22 roster bonus, 5 million from '23 roster bonus, 2 million from 2023 contract convers-- 12 million
2027 5 million from '23 bonus, 2million from 2023 contract conversion-7 million

I think the voidable years won't be needed if the Steelers are able to and decide to pony up the guarantees/upfront monies. Probably looking at in the $50 mill range. As I said before....might actually be better not to resign him long term go with the 5th year option and a few tags. In the end it isn't my money so if the Steelers are able to swing it so be it.

 

[SteelerInLebanon]

Yeah. If we sign Watt I don't see us signing Fitz long-term next year. If the Watt deal doesn't get done we then may have an opportunity then to sign Fitz long-term. It's all about the guaranteed Benjamin's.

I think the voidable years won't be needed if the Steelers are able to and decide to pony up the guarantees/upfront monies. Probably looking at in the $50 mill range. As I said before....might actually be better not to resign him long term go with the 5th year option and a few tags. In the end it isn't my money so if the Steelers are able to swing it so be it.

Nonsense the cap has plenty of room for both next year. It is only this years cap that is a problem in getting Watt signed.

 

[SteelerFan448]

Nonsense the cap has plenty of room for both next year. It is only this years cap that is a problem in getting Watt signed.

Between the cap going up and not having a huge QB contract on the books they should absolutely be able to sign both.

 

[TDX27]

I definitely see us signing Watt this year, Fitz next year and Bush the year after (assuming he comes back healthy and plays at or near pro-bowl level). They are the foundation of this D for the next 6 to 8 years. Heyward will be gone. Haden gone. Tuitt a few years left maybe. Those 3 are the core/nucleus of our D.

 

[stillwright]

Nonsense the cap has plenty of room for both next year. It is only this years cap that is a problem in getting Watt signed.

The cap has NOTHING to do with it. It is all about the guarantees monies. Just like Bell wanted more guarantees. Watt wants more. What do you think Fitz will want? Guarantees that is.

 

[stillwright]

I definitely see us signing Watt this year, Fitz next year and Bush the year after (assuming he comes back healthy and plays at or near pro-bowl level). They are the foundation of this D for the next 6 to 8 years. Heyward will be gone. Haden gone. Tuitt a few years left maybe. Those 3 are the core/nucleus of our D.

To bad defense means nothing in todays NFL. It is all about the offense.

 

[Punxsutawney]

To bad defense means nothing in todays NFL. It is all about the offense.

People say this often, but when was the last time a team won the Superbowl without a good defense?

 

[stillwright]

People say this often, but when was the last time a team won the Superbowl without a good defense?

When was the last time our defense did something in the playoffs? We are suppose to have one of the better defenses in the game over the handful of seasons. What has it been? 40 plus points we gave up in our last three home playoff games? Or something like that. Average defenses win SBs.

 

[Punxsutawney]

When was the last time our defense did something in the playoffs? We are suppose to have one of the better defenses in the game over the handful of seasons. What has it been? 40 plus points we gave up in our last three home playoff games? Or something like that. Average defenses win SBs.

They've laid an egg in their last three playoff games, but that shouldn't be an excuse to not invest money into the defense, especially the pass rush, as you have to be able to disrupt the opposing QB to win in the post season.

Not really sure why the likes of Watt, Tuitt and Heyward seem to shoot blanks in the playoffs, but you need players of their caliber to have a chance.

 

[stillwright]

They've laid an egg in their last three playoff games, but that shouldn't be an excuse to not invest money into the defense, especially the pass rush, as you have to be able to disrupt the opposing QB to win in the post season.

Not really sure why the likes of Watt, Tuitt and Heyward seem to shoot blanks in the playoffs, but you need players of their caliber to have

They've laid an egg in their last three playoff games, but that shouldn't be an excuse to not invest money into the defense, especially the pass rush, as you have to be able to disrupt the opposing QB to win in the post season.

Not really sure why the likes of Watt, Tuitt and Heyward seem to shoot blanks in the playoffs, but you need players of their caliber to have a chance.

You can win with an average defense. Can you win with an average offense in today's NFL?

 

[FatsHolmes]

They've laid an egg in their last three playoff games, but that shouldn't be an excuse to not invest money into the defense, especially the pass rush, as you have to be able to disrupt the opposing QB to win in the post season.

Not really sure why the likes of Watt, Tuitt and Heyward seem to shoot blanks in the playoffs, but you need players of their caliber to have a chance.

Maybe being down 28-0 in the first quarter because the offense was being so generous to the opponent had something to do with it.

 

[Punxsutawney]

Maybe being down 28-0 in the first quarter because the offense was being so generous to the opponent had something to do with it.

The turnovers did not help, but it was not like the Browns started those first half drives in the redzone.

The defense did not put up any resistance at all. The Browns offense just went right up and down the field.

When the offense started rolling and made the game competitive in the second half, the defense failed to get a stop or turnover when they needed to.

It was pretty much an exact copy of the Jaguars playoff loss, made worse by the Browns missing three starters on their OL.