Steelers select Dri Archer in Round 3

[ark steel]

I have a lot of respect for the opinions of Dobre, TMC, deljzc. Idio, Vader and Tape might not believe it, but I also have a lot of respect for their opinions. That doesn't mean I have to agree with everything you say (and I obviously don't).

However, if anyone here, including those, think you are better than the Steelers organization at putting together and running a team, then, my respect for your opinion drops quite a bit. I hate to be the one to break it to you, but you are not. Sorry.

Someone mentioned that Dri wasn't a 3rd round pick. You may not care about the opinions/rankings of nfl.com (had Archer at 3-4) and walterfootball says he was a third rounder. So, clearly, others think he is worth a third. Doesn't mean you or I have to agree, but it does show that others thought he might be worth a third and the Steelers weren't alone in that opinion.

I'm a "cheeleader". I tend to believe that the Steelers knows more about what they are doing than I do. I thought it was a headscratcher pick, too, but I will wait until it fails (if it does) before I complain too much.

 

[Badcat]

No, you come bouncing into a thread where this has been discussed ad nauseam and throw out a players name that played almost 20 years ago and was roughly 20 pounds heavier as an example of why this works today. ******* brilliant. Then, when you get called on it, you go into the front office are professionals and ensure you point out everyone else is not. Why? Because your initial point blew ******* chunks and that is all you had. So, you are forced to pick up the pompoms and start shaking them to distract from the original point, because you failed to waive off the size issue.

No one has ever said the Steelers should ignore their scouts, but YOU are attempting to state that opinions that do not support it are lesser, on a ******* message board made up by the opinions of fans.

I NEVER stated my knowledge was superior to the Steelers, ever, even stated various times for those that do not drool on their keyboard and can read that my opinion carries no more weight than any other member of this message board. But, does that matter? **** no, you cannot drive a salient point home about the size of Archer so you have to deviate, throw up a shiny ball and say look at this because I really cannot handle the debate at hand. You reiterate the Steelers points, speed, speed, speed. Hell, I can read that too. Why come here? Stay at Steelers.com and get your happy-happy, greatest player, speed, speed thrills.

Nah, not good enough, you feel the need to drift over and attempt to set everyone straight about the drafting prowess and how everyone should just shut the **** up and take the Steelers opinions over any other opinion. I wonder if you do that with your government officials, because guess ******* what, they are professionals and you are not. ******* der.......

I am done with this ****. Same arguments with Rainey. Heard all this **** before. Keep eating the grass, they will be along to herd you back in soon.

Vader asked a question, and I answered it. You are the one that bounced in, highlighted the 190 lbs, and made it a point to show that it was off on my point of a small back. Go back and look at what I did. Look at my points for what they are. I never once said the steelers were right, and I certainly never said that they got it right. I simply answered a question that was posed on a message board and you and Vader had to poke holes into my argument to keep your "expert" mantras valid. God forbid someone show you where there was a small back who contributed to a teams success to counter your all knowing and all being opinions. You wanted one, just one back, and I gave him to you. What I got was an argument about 15lbs and one inch. Pathetic.

Sorry the Steelers didn't draft the way you mocked it. I guess they had other plans. Imagine that?

 

[TMC]

Ark, I do not doubt that he was drafted where many had his value. Never said anything about where he was drafted, if the value was there, if he could have been had later, or anything of the sort. I know, not think, but know, that in the last 12 years, of all the RBs under 180 pounds that were drafted, only Dexter McCluster had anything resembling an NFL career. He is the only guy to get a 2nd contract and has now moved out to WR. He is a slot WR now.

Why? Because RBs under 180 pounds are still subject to the same 300+ pound defensive linemen falling on them on a regular basis, just like 230 pound RBs like Bell. The smaller the back, the more big/heavy hits he takes inside, the greater the risk of injury, the greater the chance he is out of the league. Also, I fully understand that big hits on small guys make it difficult for them to hold onto the football. Archer had 13 fumbles in just over 400 career touches. Bell had almost as many touches his final season at Michigan State. If he fumbled 13 times, he would not have been drafted inside the 5th round. So, the chance that he can survive, not thrive, just survive inside is diminshed. Statistically, odds are against him.

So, best move is to get him out to WR. Get his little *** outside so he has a fighting chance. That is the wise move. The problem is, this draft was exceptionally deep at WR. I mean, you have excellent WRs lasting well into the 6th round. Hell, we took our big WR after Archer. We took a guy that Mike Mayock stated had first round talent after Archer. Now, Mike Mayock is not some internet guy, he played, works for the NFL, studies these guys, and is well respected by those IN the field. There were a host of pure WRs available. Why take a project here? Why take a RB that you are looking to turn into a WR? And, a guy with very small hands at that (8 7/8"). If WR was the goal, take a WR.

As for his kick return prowess, plenty of kick returners available. Plenty of kick returners that can also play WR were there. The only edge Archer had was elite speed and, while I look at the numbers just like everyone else, speed is not the most important stat when it is all said and done.

Let someone else turn him into a player. Just not interested in taking the football out of Bell's hands to hand it to Archer....like EVER. I also do not want Archer in the backfield on a passing down when the Ravens run a full blitz and he has to stand in and pick up Terrell Suggs. I would hate to think how many weeks Ben would be out while he recovered from having Archer pulled out his ***.

Just does not make much sense. Would love to see them prove me wrong. Won't hold my breath.

 

[ark steel]

Ark, I do not doubt that he was drafted where many had his value. Never said anything about where he was drafted, if the value was there, if he could have been had later, or anything of the sort. I know, not think, but know, that in the last 12 years, of all the RBs under 180 pounds that were drafted, only Dexter McCluster had anything resembling an NFL career. He is the only guy to get a 2nd contract and has now moved out to WR. He is a slot WR now.

Why? Because RBs under 180 pounds are still subject to the same 300+ pound defensive linemen falling on them on a regular basis, just like 230 pound RBs like Bell. The smaller the back, the more big/heavy hits he takes inside, the greater the risk of injury, the greater the chance he is out of the league. Also, I fully understand that big hits on small guys make it difficult for them to hold onto the football. Archer had 13 fumbles in just over 400 career touches. Bell had almost as many touches his final season at Michigan State. If he fumbled 13 times, he would not have been drafted inside the 5th round. So, the chance that he can survive, not thrive, just survive inside is diminshed. Statistically, odds are against him.

So, best move is to get him out to WR. Get his little *** outside so he has a fighting chance. That is the wise move. The problem is, this draft was exceptionally deep at WR. I mean, you have excellent WRs lasting well into the 6th round. Hell, we took our big WR after Archer. We took a guy that Mike Mayock stated had first round talent after Archer. Now, Mike Mayock is not some internet guy, he played, works for the NFL, studies these guys, and is well respected by those IN the field. There were a host of pure WRs available. Why take a project here? Why take a RB that you are looking to turn into a WR? And, a guy with very small hands at that (8 7/8"). If WR was the goal, take a WR.

As for his kick return prowess, plenty of kick returners available. Plenty of kick returners that can also play WR were there. The only edge Archer had was elite speed and, while I look at the numbers just like everyone else, speed is not the most important stat when it is all said and done.

Let someone else turn him into a player. Just not interested in taking the football out of Bell's hands to hand it to Archer....like EVER. I also do not want Archer in the backfield on a passing down when the Ravens run a full blitz and he has to stand in and pick up Terrell Suggs. I would hate to think how many weeks Ben would be out while he recovered from having Archer pulled out his ***.

Just does not make much sense. Would love to see them prove me wrong. Won't hold my breath.

Maybe they have him in the backfield in case Ngata is hungry and needs a snack?

 

[TMC]

Vader asked a question, and I answered it. You are the one that bounced in, highlighted the 190 lbs, and made it a point to show that it was off on my point of a small back. Go back and look at what I did. Look at my points for what they are. I never once said the steelers were right, and I certainly never said that they got it right. I simply answered a question that was posed on a message board and you and Vader had to poke holes into my argument to keep your "expert" mantras valid. God forbid someone show you where there was a small back who contributed to a teams success to counter your all knowing and all being opinions. You wanted one, just one back, and I gave him to you. What I got was an argument about 15lbs and one inch. Pathetic.

Sorry the Steelers didn't draft the way you mocked it. I guess they had other plans. Imagine that?

You did NOT answer it. Here is the question AGAIN:

Please name me ONE 170 lbs. 5'8" RB that has done anything in the NFL?

Was the player you gave under 170? Around 170? **** no. He was 190. You act like 15 or 20 pounds on a 175 pound guy is nothing. When asked about the Steelers draft pick McCullers, who is 354 pounds, Coach Mitchell said they want him at 330 because there was a HUGE difference in a 350 pound player and a 330 pound player. Twenty pounds on a 330 pound man is @6% of his body weight. That is a huge difference to the Steelers DL coach. Are you really trying to sell that 8.5% in weight on a 175 pound guy is insignificant? Is that really your stance? Well, who are you to question what a coach states? I am sure that Coach Mitchell knows more about the body weight of NFL players than some guy on a message board. Coach Mitchell is a highly regarded coach and you are just some "expert" trying to hold up your mantra. Pathetic.

Did not do a mock draft. Did not post any write ups. Been relatively quiet this year because I am, quite frankly, tired of the same old **** from the same old people that are gurgling the black and gold jizz. Not really worth it. Wish the **** I had not said anything about Archer either. Regret the **** out of it. Won't have to sweat it again. Just find your way into the middle of the circle and see how many you can get a hand on before the time runs out.

 

[Stoney]

I have a lot of respect for the opinions of Dobre, TMC, deljzc. Idio, Vader and Tape might not believe it, but I also have a lot of respect for their opinions. That doesn't mean I have to agree with everything you say (and I obviously don't).

However, if anyone here, including those, think you are better than the Steelers organization at putting together and running a team, then, my respect for your opinion drops quite a bit. I hate to be the one to break it to you, but you are not. Sorry.

Someone mentioned that Dri wasn't a 3rd round pick. You may not care about the opinions/rankings of nfl.com (had Archer at 3-4) and walterfootball says he was a third rounder. So, clearly, others think he is worth a third. Doesn't mean you or I have to agree, but it does show that others thought he might be worth a third and the Steelers weren't alone in that opinion.

I'm a "cheeleader". I tend to believe that the Steelers knows more about what they are doing than I do. I thought it was a headscratcher pick, too, but I will wait until it fails (if it does) before I complain too much.

Yeah, but WF also had Marcus Roberson, Brandon Coleman, and Jeffcoat all going in the 3rd. So.... that means nothing.

 

[Steel Not A Player]

Gawd damn!

12 pages of this train wreck? Can we let the guy PLAY before we decide he's garbage?

 

[Gareth]

I have high hopes and low expectations.


Regardless, they are wasting no time in getting him in pads and seeing what he brings to the table...


Secret spy photos from today's workout...

 

[Franco]

Gawd damn!

12 pages of this train wreck? Can we let the guy PLAY before we decide he's garbage?

Says the moron who claims this midget will have 4 or 5 punt returns a game for a minimum of 20 yards. The midget returned 6 punts in college for 8 total yards, 1.3 yards a return far from the aggregate you lied about

 

[madinsomniac]

I think my opinion is better than the Steelers.

I've been tracking my drafts vs. the Steelers since 2007 and my guys have accumulated more starts and more AV (per PFR) than the Steelers have. I also currently have more guys still in the league.

I think front offices in the NFL are filled with underqualified people that know people to get their foot in the door. It's a good old boys network of friends of friends and fathers and sons. It's a ******* joke. Scouts are still scouting like they did 40 years ago, like there is some magic to be gained by driving 100,000 miles a year on your car and talking with coaches that are just trying to promote their programs (and again, it's friends of friends).

Scouts time would be much better spend watching film than behind the wheel of a ******* car or in a run down hotel room. You want to find dirt out, hire professional shrinks with PHD's that actually study human behavior for a living. We expect ex-jocks to watch film AND be psychologists on the player profiles. Did you read the scouting report on Manziel that got leaked by New England? Half of it wasn't about his tape at all. Half of his grade came from off-field stuff anyone could find out on the internet.

The problem with today's scouting and evaluation is this attachment to some by-gone era. The technological revolution should have changed the way we evaluate players a decade ago. You should have guys scouting positions, NOT regions. Because I would suspect, if you looked back in the Steelers records, there is one scout that consistently scouts O-lineman better than someone else. But because they are in a different region, you never get their input. That makes NO SENSE.

Christ, scouts still hold stop watches!!! What year is this again? 1973?

Damn that is spot on. Id say the same thing about coaching too... its a good ol boy network that needs an overhaul

 

[Stryker]

The only thing I'm hoping for is similar production to a Cribbs or Metcalf type player on 3rd downs and KRs.

 

[Idioteque]

Says the moron who claims this midget will have 4 or 5 punt returns a game for a minimum of 20 yards. The midget returned 6 punts in college for 8 total yards, 1.3 yards a return far from the aggregate you lied about

It will be easier in the NFL.

Besides, we all know that kickoffs and punts are interchangeable.

 

[Tibs]

I think the reaction to the Archer pick can be clearly broken down into three groups:

1. Likes the player, likes the pick. Trusts the evaluation of Steelers coaching staff and Colbert that Archer is a full-blown playmaker who will be a big-play TD machine regardless of position and perceived size issues. Round 3 for such an impact player was a great opportunity to add a difference-maker, elated the Steelers had the balls to make the pick.

2. Likes the player, doesn't like the pick. Thinks Archer could be everything the Steelers think of him, but his size/stature makes it a risky proposition in the third round. Still thinks highly of Archer's abilities, is looking forward to seeing him play, just annoyed by the 3rd round pick, would have rather drafted a CB/WR here.

3. Hates the player, hates the pick. Thinks Archer has no place in today's NFL, will be squashed like a little bug the second he steps onto the field. Views this selection in the 3rd round as one of the worst all-time picks in NFL history. Feels Archer should be banned from playing football, for his own good, as he's like a scrawny 11 year-old boy who should be chased off the field so he doesn't get hurt. Feels strongly that Tomlin & Colbert should be tarred & feathered and hung out to dry for insulting the fan base. Has burned all Steelers memorabilia & destroyed Steelers jersey collection in a fit of rage over picking such a scrub in the 3rd round. Is on the verge of an aneurysm, cannot sleep at night, wakes up in a cold sweat seeing the teeny-tiny Archer in a Steelers jersey.


Seems to me, much of the "old guard" here at SN falls into category 3.

Hope you guys somehow find a way to get over it, and welcome little Dri into the fold. Tibs

 

[SteelerAl]

The only thing I'm hoping for is similar production to a Cribbs or Metcalf type player on 3rd downs and KRs.

I certainly would not have picked Archer at #97, but it won't be the worst thing in the world if he can be something like McCluster. He will never rack up yards from scrimmage, but can he make a few game-changing plays?

I really don't project Archer as a running back in any traditional sense. He's a kick returner that will probably get put in the slot a couple times a game to try to take the top off the defense. Hopefully he can be a useful decoy at times, make the defense spend some time during the week preparing for what to do if he runs a wheel route out of the backfield...

 

[ark steel]

I have high hopes and low expectations.


Regardless, they are wasting no time in getting him in pads and seeing what he brings to the table...


Secret spy photos from today's workout...

We need karma back!

 

[Rod Farva]

I don't care how bad he looks, they aren't cutting a 3rd Round pick in his first camp.

This. The guy will be "protected" in camp. I seriously doubt they'll be letting Heyward tee off on him.....which will provide a false picture of what the guy can or can't handle.I'm completely puzzled by this pick.......

Maybe they have him in the backfield in case Ngata is hungry and needs a snack?

If he and Ngata are in the backfield at the same time Ngata will have already eaten Ben and use lil' Dri to pick the remains out of his teeth.

 

[diver]

I have high hopes and low expectations.


Regardless, they are wasting no time in getting him in pads and seeing what he brings to the table...


Secret spy photos from today's workout...

Great picture. Funny, that is the way Rainey looked to me when he was here, like that picture. At least Archer, watching his highlights, seems to have a strong enough neck where he can wear his helmet the right way.

 

[diver]

I think my opinion is better than the Steelers.

I've been tracking my drafts vs. the Steelers since 2007 and my guys have accumulated more starts and more AV (per PFR) than the Steelers have. I also currently have more guys still in the league.

I think front offices in the NFL are filled with underqualified people that know people to get their foot in the door. It's a good old boys network of friends of friends and fathers and sons. It's a ******* joke. Scouts are still scouting like they did 40 years ago, like there is some magic to be gained by driving 100,000 miles a year on your car and talking with coaches that are just trying to promote their programs (and again, it's friends of friends).

Scouts time would be much better spend watching film than behind the wheel of a ******* car or in a run down hotel room. You want to find dirt out, hire professional shrinks with PHD's that actually study human behavior for a living. We expect ex-jocks to watch film AND be psychologists on the player profiles. Did you read the scouting report on Manziel that got leaked by New England? Half of it wasn't about his tape at all. Half of his grade came from off-field stuff anyone could find out on the internet.

The problem with today's scouting and evaluation is this attachment to some by-gone era. The technological revolution should have changed the way we evaluate players a decade ago. You should have guys scouting positions, NOT regions. Because I would suspect, if you looked back in the Steelers records, there is one scout that consistently scouts O-lineman better than someone else. But because they are in a different region, you never get their input. That makes NO SENSE.

Christ, scouts still hold stop watches!!! What year is this again? 1973?

I just don't buy that, the part about scouting. I don't know. Are there great hordes of unfound talents? Are they bouncing at bars or something? The Steelers drafted guys this year from the West, South, Midwest, and East. That pretty much covers the country. Maybe their scouting department was limited in the Northwest? Football is still about tackling, blocking, running, catching and so on, isn't it? We ain't splitting the atom here.

 

[diver]

Ignore my last post, del. I didn't read thoroughly what you were saying. Sorry.

 

[Wingman]

I have high hopes and low expectations.


Regardless, they are wasting no time in getting him in pads and seeing what he brings to the table...


Secret spy photos from today's workout...

That is priceless

 

[Supersteeler]

I read this morning that he benched 225 more times than Mike Adams, our 300 plus lb OT.

 

[FordFairLane]

Ok this is what I think. First pick Shazier and second pick Tuitt the Steelers brass are sure are starters, maybe this year maybe next but starters. Third pick 97 overall there's Bryant, McGill, Richardson and Archer. Maybe they aren't even close to sure about any of them starting but Archer they know will touch the football in the return game and will have nitch plays to try to use his speed. So is it better to draft a guy thinking he won't start or draft a guy you know won't start but will touch the football? And my guess is Bryant, McGill or Richardson will be there with our 4th pick but maybe they knew Archer won't get past Oakland in the 4th.

Just saying....

 

[dobre shunka]

I read this morning that he benched 225 more times than Mike Adams, our 300 plus lb OT.

Does that make you feel better about Archer or worse about Adams?

 

[Supersteeler]

Does that make you feel better about Archer or worse about Adams?

A little of both.

 

[madinsomniac]

Great, he is strong, but that didn't help him with his issues with putting the ball on the ground a ton against smaller players than he will be facing here. Im with everyone else... 175 is just too small, especially for a 3rd round pick in a deep and talented draft