IMO we had the talent to play defense like you have to vs NE,

[obxsteeler]

How you lost is important. Our coaches seem to lack the diversity of play calling. This problem falls squarely on Tomlin who delegates to his OC and DC, and does not appear to call plays.

How many NFL head coaches call their own plays, Coach ?

 

[Punxsutawney]

Malcolm Butler was a rookie nobody who won the SB by playing tight man vs the Seahawks. The Pats saw the play on tape and had Butler practice jumping that quick slant.

I guess the Pats should have just sat back and said, Oh well, Butler is a rookie who can't possibly handle that. Let's just hope they don;t call slant plays.


The steeler defense has far more talent than the Pats. Burns and Davis are better athletes than anybody in the Pats secondary. Does anybody think Belickeck would have just played zone with the steelers players?

Exactly.

The inexperience of Burns and Davis should have been more of a reason to incorporate more man coverage into the game plan. You cannot do it every play, obviously, but at least give them some opportunities to simply man up and not have to sit back and process all that **** the Patriots were forcing them to read and react to, much of which they probably never seen before,.

And it's not like we haven't seen Burns and Davis in man coverage this season, especially Burns.

The Patriots secondary is better than the sum of its parts. All of their primary backs are not great at either man or zone, but they're all decent at both, giving Belichick a lot of flexibility in his game planning.

 

[topseed]

Dulac: Steelers Stopped Using Man Coverage In NE Because It Didn’t Work


BY MATTHEW MARCZI JANUARY 25, 2017 AT 07:00 AM



As we all know, whenever the Pittsburgh Steelers lose a game, they have the great luxury of having an endless resource of prime defensive coordinator minds to supply them with the ways that they can fix all of their problems. Message boards all across the internet, not to mention Steelers bars around the world—anywhere two Steelers fans are, really—can play host to these insightful minds who know better than the coaching staff. Myself included, of course.

As we all know, the reason that the Steelers lost to the Patriots on Sunday is because they were unwilling to check New England’s wide receivers in man coverage, preferring to stay in their comfort zone, literally, with the zone coverages that they have used for the bulk of the season.

According to Gerry Dulac of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, however, the season that the Steelers shied away from man coverage against the Patriots is because it didn’t work. He Tweeted last night that the defense “went to man coverage 3 times and got burned each time by Brady. Stopped doing it after that”, according to a team source.

He added that the “biggest culprit in man coverage was nickel back William Gay, who struggled [with Julian Edelman]”. So if you were looking for an answer as to why the Steelers didn’t do what they obviously needed to do in order to win the game, the answer is that they tried to do that and it failed spectacularly each time that they tried.

Now, that doesn’t mean that change is not coming. The Steelers have drafted cornerbacks in the top two rounds of the past two drafts who theoretically have the skill set to consistently engage in man coverage, with Artie Burns their first-round draft pick in 2016 and Senquez Golson, who has been on injured reserve the past two years a second-round pick in 2015, who would inherit Gay’s slot role should he take the field.

I'm wondering, in your extensive research (including pay sites, of course), have you discovered which 3 mystery man-to-man plays "burned" the Steelers? Specifically?

 

[antdrewjosh]

Searching?? When you read Steelers Depot it's right there. Not trying to be a dick..who am I kidding yes I am find it yourself if you truly care

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Steeler Nation mobile app

 

[Steeler Pride]

So let me get this straight. Our quarterback, a 13 year veteran, and 2x Super Bowl champion, takes the call from the coach and is not allowed to make a change at the line? He is so handcuffed, apparently, that he can't call an audible? Especially if he really didn't like the play? Look, I love Ben, but this nonsense that Ben only calls the plays that are called from the coach and can't change anything up is just that: nonsense. The coach calls what he feels will work, he doesn't know what the ******* defense is gonna trot out there(unless you're the patriots***). It's up to Ben to change things up accordingly.

Tomlin has said at 3 different press conferences this year that Ben does NOT have free reign and that he can only audible in certain circumstances and situations. The fact that Ben specifically said that he ran the goal line plays that Haley called in tells me that he probably didn't agree with them but couldn't change them.

So now our OC has no ******* clue what defense we are going to see...LOL What the **** do we even have a coaching staff for since they don;t know ****, our players have to make their own play calls on the field, the coaches are not responsible for squat, and you want to talk about nonsense?

 

[6Lombardis]

Did they look at the Texan's tape of last week and say "ahh, that won't work cause they'll know that's what were going to run, probably." Lets rush 3 and drop into a zone, they'll never expect it.

Halftime adjustments: "The scheme isn't working...Lets stay with our plan, they'll never expect it."

I believe the first two NE drives made us believe our scheme would
Work. We held them to 3 then got sack and forced a punt. At that point, steelers had to feel the plan would work. I believe they kept thinking all that was needed was better execution. I think MT even said as much before half.

 

[topseed]

Searching?? When you read Steelers Depot it's right there. Not trying to be a dick..who am I kidding yes I am find it yourself if you truly care

You love avoiding direct questions and playing stupid ******* little games, don't you?

Except what's "right there" is an article that explains how the zone defense was confused and gave up big plays, even when they blitzed. Which actually supports the idea of playing man and not zone. Thanks.

 

[antdrewjosh]

You love avoiding direct questions and playing stupid ******* little games, don't you?

Except what's "right there" is an article that explains how the zone defense was confused and gave up big plays, even when they blitzed. Which actually supports the idea of playing man and not zone. Thanks.

Playing little games?? You are the smartest ******* guy on here. Look for it. It's called google. **** am I wasting my time for you to dismiss it for. There are numerous article stating that when the Steelers went man they were burned. If you aren't interested in the articles I post here don't read them don't comment. But if you want to dispute them go find it yourself. And that article is saying how the Steelers had trouble in zone too. They were ****** in both. The patriots took advantage of the young guys in zone and Gay in man.

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Steeler Nation mobile app

 

[topseed]

Playing little games?? You are the smartest ******* guy on here. Look for it. It's called google. **** am I wasting my time for you to dismiss it for. There are numerous article stating that when the Steelers went man they were burned. If you aren't interested in the articles I post here don't read them don't comment. But if you want to dispute them go find it yourself. And that article is saying how the Steelers had trouble in zone too. They were ****** in both. The patriots took advantage of the young guys in zone and Gay in man.

Look, you're the guy claiming you read all sorts of articles and you even pay for some of them. I didn't ask you for more articles stating that they were burned. I asked you if you could tell me which three specific plays they were burned on.

If you can't answer the question, just say so, don't post more vague bullshit.

 

[antdrewjosh]

Look, you're the guy claiming you read all sorts of articles and you even pay for some of them. I didn't ask you for more articles stating that they were burned. I asked you if you could tell me which three specific plays they were burned on.

If you can't answer the question, just say so, don't post more vague bullshit.

I can and will post what I want. Others may enjoy them. If they aren't good enough for you don't read them.

http://www.Invalid Link - Check SN ...ers-stopped-using-man-coverage-ne-didnt-work/

http://www.Invalid Link - Check SN Home Page/2017/01/film-room-brady-burns-steelers-blitz/

These aren't the specific plays if you want that find it yourself. I posted these articles in other threads in response to Every one saying including myself that we didn't try anything other then zone. I read these articles cause they show you things you might not necessarily see live.





Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Steeler Nation mobile app

 

[chipped ham]

Tomlin has said at 3 different press conferences this year that Ben does NOT have free reign and that he can only audible in certain circumstances and situations. The fact that Ben specifically said that he ran the goal line plays that Haley called in tells me that he probably didn't agree with them but couldn't change them.

So now our OC has no ******* clue what defense we are going to see...LOL What the **** do we even have a coaching staff for since they don;t know ****, our players have to make their own play calls on the field, the coaches are not responsible for squat, and you want to talk about nonsense?

Or maybe Ben is just doing a little bit of whining, seeing as he's done it since Haley was brought aboard. Of course, he hasn't been as outspoken about it until just this instance. I also have to believe thag Ben has the ability to audible inside the five ******* yard line considering he did as much the week before against the chefs and threw a ******* interception. Oh, and On a play-by-play basis, I would have to assume that, unless you're the New England patriots** or a ******* time traveler, you're not going to know which play the defense is going to ******* run next. I was certain that one could surmise that was what I meant, but, silly, old me, I still haven't learned my lesson about assuming.

 

[slashsteel]

See problem with articles is one paints one picture another...well another.

Some of yinz get too wrapped up in reading one article.

As sometimes it might be a little of both sides of the discussion.

Case in point TMC and I a few times would look at game tape.

Break it down. Sometimes I saw something different than him.I didn't lock into me being right in that case, as I knew he watched a helluva lot of game tape.

Some of those pay sites give you a good look, but you are either seeing a small sample, or are seeing their viewpoint. Which could be off, just as well as my viewpoint or anyone else's could be off.

Which leave us with our opinions. And they are just that.

Few might be wise not to glue onto a article and pass it off as gold.

Sometimes sure it may be, and other times it may not.

So when we discuss try to keep that in mind, if anyone is debating with articles.

 

[antdrewjosh]

See problem with articles is one paints one picture another...well another.

Some of yinz get too wrapped up in reading one article.

As sometimes it might be a little of both sides of the discussion.

Case in point TMC and I a few times would look at game tape.

Break it down. Sometimes I saw something different than him.I didn't lock into me being right in that case, as I knew he watched a helluva lot of game tape.

Some of those pay sites give you a good look, but you are either seeing a small sample, or are seeing their viewpoint. Which could be off, just as well as my viewpoint or anyone else's could be off.

Which leave us with our opinions. And they are just that.

Few might be wise not to glue onto a article and pass it off as gold.

Sometimes sure it may be, and other times it may not.

So when we discuss try to keep that in mind, if anyone is debating with articles.

There are are at least three articles posted and all show breakdown in three different phases of the defense. Lapses when they played zone, failure to get home when they blitzed, and failures when they played man. Articles was written to show the different things the Steelers tried to stop the Patriots. Alot of people claimed the Steelers just sat back in zone all game the articles are showing different.. The game plan sucked and the execution sucked also..

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Steeler Nation mobile app

 

[Steelerfreak]

We have to get the 1 seed next year to have any chance at all. We also need someone to knock the patriots out in order to have a chance at making to the SB. Both are tall tasks.

In order to do that we will most likely have to beat them in the refular season, which ,eams in the rematch they will be well versed in whatever adjustment was made to beat them making it highly unlikely to sweep them, and another loss.I swear those guys are in our heads. We play scared and just play the role of ***** when we line up. Still frustrated after 8 days.

 

[Coryea]

Of all those vids from the link above, showing the blitzes, we sent 5 guys one time and in that play we are giving the WR's a cushion and free release, well no **** Brady is going to complete that, it's a simple 3 step drop and throw an out.

The other so called blitzes we sent 4 guys, against 5 pass rushers, that's not a blitz IMO. Also the point if blitzing is to get to the qb, you can't blitz and give a cushion and free release to Brady's WR's no **** he's going to complete those.

So sick of hearing "we don't have the personnel to play man". I've seen Cockrell follow the other teams #1 all over the field before, especially AJ Green who is better than anyone NE has, I've see Burns covering Tyrek Hill, maybe the fastest guy in the NFL man to man, if we think ay can cover Edleman than that's our fault for not giving him help.

Yeah Mitchell biting on the flea flicker was on him, not the coaches, but him saying they've never seen that play before when they ran it 5 weeks ago???

 

[topseed]

I can and will post what I want. Others may enjoy them. If they aren't good enough for you don't read them.

http://www.Invalid Link - Check SN ...ers-stopped-using-man-coverage-ne-didnt-work/

http://www.Invalid Link - Check SN Home Page/2017/01/film-room-brady-burns-steelers-blitz/

These aren't the specific plays if you want that find it yourself. I posted these articles in other threads in response to Every one saying including myself that we didn't try anything other then zone. I read these articles cause they show you things you might not necessarily see live.

So you have an article from Gerry Dulac citing an unnamed "team source" who said that the Steelers stopped running man after 3 tries, because it didn't work. That's nice. How did this mysterious team source feel about the other 40 or so drop backs where Brady ate their soft zone alive? How was that working?

The second article is the one detailed earlier that condemns the zone blitz, not man coverage. Great.

I'd love to find the specific plays myself...except I've looked, and I can't seem to locate three examples. And, evidently, neither can you or anyone else.

 

[CharlesDavenport]

We'll never know if we had the talent to play a defense that we needed to play. All we know is that we played a defense that sucked *** against them from the start and stuck with it.

 

[topseed]

We'll never know if we had the talent to play a defense that we needed to play. All we know is that we played a defense that sucked *** against them from the start and stuck with it.

Indeed. That's what's so confounding and honestly, it's going to to take a lot of enjoyment out of watching the Super Bowl. If the Steelers had gone down playing aggressively, at least I wouldn't have this nagging feeling of "what if" lingering in the pit of my stomach.

 

[diver]

Indeed. That's what's so confounding and honestly, it's going to to take a lot of enjoyment out of watching the Super Bowl. If the Steelers had gone down playing aggressively, at least I wouldn't have this nagging feeling of "what if" lingering in the pit of my stomach.

I don't know where the hell this "what if" is coming from. The Steeler offense only managed 17 points. As good as Brady and that offense is, even if the Steelers played much better defense, the Pats are scoring more than 17 ******' points.

 

[antdrewjosh]

I don't know where the hell this "what if" is coming from. The Steeler offense only managed 17 points. As good as Brady and that offense is, even if the Steelers played much better defense, the Pats are scoring more than 17 ******' points.

Said this on another thread everybody bitching about the defense forgetting the offense did ****.

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Steeler Nation mobile app

 

[slashsteel]

There are are at least three articles posted and all show breakdown in three different phases of the defense. Lapses when they played zone, failure to get home when they blitzed, and failures when they played man. Articles was written to show the different things the Steelers tried to stop the Patriots. Alot of people claimed the Steelers just sat back in zone all game the articles are showing different.. The game plan sucked and the execution sucked also..

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Steeler Nation mobile app

we all watched the game there was little to no pressure up the middle where lady is the most vulnerable
and they dropped their LBers in coverage far too often

we do not have coverage LBers outside of Shazier.


as much as the execution sucked


the scheme was simply down right horrific

some might argue the Steelers simply didn't have the players to pull off a pressure D

so as we swing this back n forth back n forth


it always comes back to two things.

A coverage corner is needed.
A pass rushing OLBer is needed.


And how we would all love to sit on pins and needles and hope we could draft a OLBer and CB that could bring this, this year.

If they are really serious about getting back to a SB in a timely manner, the way Ben is talking they better ******* make it timely.. You better be aggressive in free agency and bring in at least one of this, if not two.

In theory I think you can draft a CB with the skills in 1, but I would like to see a pass rushing competent OLBer brought in. With Bell and Brown high priority contracts. So is this.


And if the FO sits on their hands, we could very well be talking about this again next year, same bat channel.

 

[slashsteel]

Said this on another thread everybody bitching about the defense forgetting the offense did ****.

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Steeler Nation mobile app

True the O is much to blame as the D as the coaches.

Thing is most of the pieces are there on O, as you have two WRs factoring that didn't factor in down the stretch.


But a TE and a backup RB should be drafted and I am saying at least in the 3 /4 range.

 

[chipped ham]

we all watched the game there was little to no pressure up the middle where lady is the most vulnerable
and they dropped their LBers in coverage far too often

we do not have coverage LBers outside of Shazier.


as much as the execution sucked


the scheme was simply down right horrific

some might argue the Steelers simply didn't have the players to pull off a pressure D

so as we swing this back n forth back n forth


it always comes back to two things.

A coverage corner is needed.
A pass rushing OLBer is needed.


And how we would all love to sit on pins and needles and hope we could draft a OLBer and CB that could bring this, this year.

If they are really serious about getting back to a SB in a timely manner, the way Ben is talking they better ******* make it timely.. You better be aggressive in free agency and bring in at least one of this, if not two.

In theory I think you can draft a CB with the skills in 1, but I would like to see a pass rushing competent OLBer brought in. With Bell and Brown high priority contracts. So is this.


And if the FO sits on their hands, we could very well be talking about this again next year, same bat channel.

Slash, we have disagreed on a few things, but this sums everything up very nicely. We can "what if" all god damn day, but the AFCCG showed us where we are lacking, and what we still need to take the next step. It's right in front of us. We all see it. The hope is that the FO sees the same thing and acts appropriately.

 

[obxsteeler]

Burns, Cockrell, Davis all bigger guys that can press and be in their face at the LOS. Harrison and Dupree can both rush the passer, and Timmons and Shazier can blitz very well, as can Davis.
Yet we didn't even attempt to play that way, why????? We looked like we were running that ******* Tampa 2.
Hogan after the game said we knew what they'd be running

Pat's ran 4 wr's/1 rb the first 20 plays. Name me the Steeler db's you honestly think can play bump and run coverage at this point in their career.

 

[F83]

the 2-4-5 must go use a 4-2-5 and you need to bring a extra DB move at times Davis we need to completely get rid of the cushion nethier CB is 32 or runs a 4.6 where they are at great risk to play man to man.