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Former Steeler Ryan Harris on Tomlin and the culture

ExUSAF said:
"No one was more important than anyone else" - This pretty much sealed it for me. Maybe that's how it was in 2016 but by 2018 the divas ran the place.
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This is part of what I took away...in my life (and I remember the first SB), the Steelers locker room was rarely question and that seems to be true up until the last 2 seasons when a couple of diva's (at least a couple) created chaos. Bell was one thing and actually somewhat managable but the playoff loss to Jax came along and things just snowballed from there. Bell's situation spiraled out of control and then AB started up his antics by training camp. Those guys are gone and there is a steady beat from player comments and media reports trying to show team unity and a good locker room. Hope it is all true and not just lip service from the team (although I do believe it is driven from Rooney-Tombert). We will know soon enough. Camp can't start soon enough for me.
 
Cope said:
Only 4 current coaches in the NFL have more playoff wins than Tomlin. Discuss...
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For a better discussion, I feel it would be fair to list the four coaches with more and the four coaches with less, sandwiching Tomlin between, and also providing the number of years on the job to accumulate those playoff wins.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say Billy Bellicheats is #1 on this list, and I believe he has 7 or 8 years on Tomlin in just his stint with the Pats, not to mention his Cleveland time.
So because he has more years, he should feasibly have more playoff wins, all things considered equal.
I know Sean Payton was hired the same year as Tomlin and probably has more playoff wins. This is a better/more fair gauge against Tomlin.
But I'm pretty sure those are the only two with more/as many years coaching as Tomlin, which means two coaches with less years HC'ing than Tomlin have more wins in the playoffs than Tomlin........and that ain't a good look.
 
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Cope said:
Only 4 current coaches in the NFL have more playoff wins than Tomlin. Discuss...
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Would have been 5 if Mike McCarthy -- the most symmetrical Tomlin comparison -- hadn't got fired despite his 10 playoff wins but few lately.

It doesn't help Tomlin's case either that one of the 4 current coaches is John Harbaugh -- also with 10. Hairball has done more with less, and stole the Division from Tomlin last year while integrating a Service Academy offense in midseason.
 
Cope said:
Only 4 current coaches in the NFL have more playoff wins than Tomlin. Discuss...
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Of those 4, which have shorter tenures?

Of the coaches with not quite as many playoff wins, how close are they, and what is the tenure situation for those coaches?

What is the win percentage of those 4 teams vs the other teams that don't quite make the grade? Are ANY Of them aside from the cheats anywhere near the Steelers winning percentage during the regular season?

In short, with the in season dominance the Steelers have enjoyed for the last 14 or so years, how is it that they are near the bottom in terms of playoff win percentages?

Mike has been around for a LONG time. He's had an opportunity to rack up some playoff wins. He just doesn't have as many as one would expect for a team with the kind of roster and regular season win/loss record that the Steelers have.
 
I don't care what kind of talent we supposedly have or don't have.
-you don't use you ILB to try to cover WR's over and over again, we saw Bostic and Williams get torched by Allen last season, and every time we play NE Timmons is trying to chase Edlemen or Welker around the field
-you don't use 2 DLinemen on goal line or short yardage situations, ever!!!! Something we do often under him.
-How about on 4th-1 in the playoffs, you don't call a ******* toss, where the RB is lined up 5 yards behind the LOS, oh by the way it was to the short side of the damn field.

He's seems liked by the players, can talk really well, and seems to be able to motivate somewhat, but the he's dumb when it comes to the X's and O's side of the ball, stubborn as hell, and horrible at challenges.
 
Stoney said:
If I all of the sudden start shooting a 72 on the golf course, I will change my mind about sucking at golf. Really.
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Well it's a little more nuanced than that don't you think? Like, say, if you currently have a +4 handicap and just missed the cut to the playoffs (not the tour of course) due to something that wasn't completely in your control.

Now I'm not saying Tomlin doesn't have his shortcomings and is ultimately responsible for their success, but he did take them to the AFCCG just 2 years ago and losing L. Bell at the start of that game certainly threw a wrench in their game-plan.

Or perhaps I'm the eternal optimist who thinks "this is the year". If he chokes this one away, I'm done.
 
SteelerSask said:
This is such a money post here. Coaching is one part dealing with the people and motivating, one part teaching and one part strategy. Despite what has happened, I believe that Tomlin handles the players well and most want to play for him. Teaching and Strategy?? Belichek's teams frequently look like **** in the first 4 games, but manage at least 2 wins. The team that starts the season is unrecognizable to the team that ends it. Why? Cause they teach over there. Tomlin can only fix a problem with an influx of talent. He cannot teach or scheme his way out.
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Agreed...BUT...

The *'s play in the AFC East - automatic 5 wins. Switch them w/ the Brownies and see just how well they fair...
 
Cope said:
Only 4 current coaches in the NFL have more playoff wins than Tomlin. Discuss...
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Right place, right time. And he has nothing to do with the culture, he just went along for the ride. What has he done after the Polamalu's, Farrior's, Aaron Smith's, Ike's, Hampton's, etc. have retired? What's he done the last 8 years?
 
SojournerSteel said:
From the Interview:

"It was the most competitive team locker room I played in. Tomlin had unbelievable talent at every position and created a competitive mentality in every player. From the front office to the players – it was in every part of the program. It makes sense why they win."

Then, it "doesn't make sense" why they have only 3 playoff wins in 8 years? With "unbelievable talent at every position?"

Not quite buying the "combat catches" and "two dogs and one bone" lore of Tomlin when the bottom line is what it is.
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Boom......
 
bermudasteel said:
Agreed...BUT...

The *'s play in the AFC East - automatic 5 wins. Switch them w/ the Brownies and see just how well they fair...
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The Steelers play in a division with the clowns (haven't won a playoff game since Clinton's first term) and the bungles (who haven't won a playoff game since they beat the Houston Oilers Jan. of 1990). So in essence you're dealing with one team.. the rats...who were the clowns after the vans left in the dead of night.

The pats*** can't help the fact that their division sucks. They do play the division leaders every year. But the Steelers division isn't like running the gauntlet either.
 
Playoff record is the ultimate skewed stat, as I always state, and you guys get worked up over it. You don't suck by getting to 2 super bowls, and late injuries are a factor that derailed a few postseasons. You can't have it both ways,if he sucks, you have to recognize his accomplishments.

Peyton has the same number of playoff wins.

Those higher are

Bellicheck
Reid
Carrol
Harbaugh

All of them tend to have good regular season records too. Only Harbaugh has less years with more wins (2 more wins in 1 less year.

Harbaugh is the ultimate example of the skewed stat. You only get a winning record by winning/making it to superbowls in the post season. Harbaugh is a 500 coach in the post season except for his 4-0 SB run skewing his stats upward.
 
Cope said:
Playoff record is the ultimate skewed stat, as I always state, and you guys get worked up over it. You don't suck by getting to 2 super bowls, and late injuries are a factor that derailed a few postseasons. You can't have it both ways,if he sucks, you have to recognize his accomplishments.

Peyton has the same number of playoff wins.

Those higher are

Bellicheck
Reid
Carrol
Harbaugh

All of them tend to have good regular season records too. Only Harbaugh has less years with more wins (2 more wins in 1 less year.

Harbaugh is the ultimate example of the skewed stat. You only get a winning record by winning/making it to superbowls in the post season. Harbaugh is a 500 coach in the post season except for his 4-0 SB run skewing his stats upward.
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Talk about Skewed. So if I take out Tomlin's one SB winning run he is 2 games below .500.
 
Vader said:
Talk about Skewed. So if I take out Tomlin's one SB winning run he is 2 games below .500.
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STATS - You can make them make your point and say whatever you want them to say.
 
fedderone said:
STATS - You can make them make your point and say whatever you want them to say.
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Exactly. I'd rather not take things out of them and see the entire picture. Cope is stuck on this idea that you can't have a winning record unless you make it to a SB. But math works a little differently. You can get over .500 just by making it to the AFCC game. The worst you can do is 0-1.
 
Vader said:
Exactly. I'd rather not take things out of them and see the entire picture. Cope is stuck on this idea that you can't have a winning record unless you make it to a SB. But math works a little differently. You can get over .500 just by making it to the AFCC game. The worst you can do is 0-1.
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Now you're getting it, but by making it to a conference game and losing, you are either going 1-1 or 2-1 that season, depending if you play an extra game. Since you don't make the SB, you don't get +2 +3 or +4 wins in a playoff season. A +1 is easily negated by a playoff loss and out another year.

Also I'm not arguing that Tomlin isn't also a result of this own skewing, I understand it. And if you want to relate apples to apples, he's still #5 in the league as we sit today. And you don't get that many playoff wins without hitting Superbowls.
 
Can we all agree to give this ************ a pass to get this team to where it needs to go?

If it falls apart, tear it the **** down.
 
Black & Gold Bleeder said:
Dude, Hes gotten a pass since 2010
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Well he's still here and it doesn't look like he's going anywhere anytime soon, so what the **** can we do about it?

We can ***** all we want. Where's that getting us?
 
Steelworth said:
Well he's still here and it doesn't look like he's going anywhere anytime soon, so what the **** can we do about it?

We can ***** all we want. Where's that getting us?
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we can continue to *****.
 
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