if Ayers plays they win by 20...if he doesn't get a helmet they win by 10
Bradshaw on MT
- Thread starter Ironcitysteelers
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Yet he calls the Ben-Santonio SB winner the greatest throw and catch he has ever seen. Calls Big Ben one of the 20 best players he has seen in watching 40 years of football. While I can agree he railed against the Steelers for SB XL, Tomlin didn't coach the Steelers in that SB. Plus,he has been pretty complimentary of them since then. I am not a huge fan of Cowherd, but he is pointing out a hypocrisy that certainly exists. There is some hyperbole in Cowherd's video, but there is a ton of truth.
Personally, I find Tomlin great and crummy at the same time.
He is our coach. Hope we win Sunday. Not holding my breath. Sue me.
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We have a difference of opinion as to what it reflects or possibly could reflect. I see several possible factors at work. A confluence, if you will. You see only one. Not surprising.
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i think MT is a very good, but not great, coach who occasionally does boneheaded ****. All coaches occasionally do boneheaded ****, some more than others.
32 head coaches in the NFL, one can name about 27 who are worse but not 27 who are better.
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Because your question is dumb as hell. Wanna get all deep about nothing. He said it as response to Bradshaw. To let Bradshaw know what he thought of his remarks. And he did it in a way the media got his message and didn't have to answer anymore questions about it. ONLY you want to get all deep and ask well what does it mean that he idolized Henderson. Don't even know if we was just trolling Bradshaw and if he wasn't so what. I live in Jersey do you know how many kids loved Lawrence Taylor around here. You like the player and his play not his off field antics.
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Okay. Let’s go that way. There have been 272 head coaches in the slwoB repuS era. Of those 119 coaches (44%) have taken teams to the playoffs and only 31 have reach 12 playoff games or more (11% of total coaches and 26% of playoff coaches). Of the 31 coaches who have reached 12 playoff games or more, only 23 coaches have reached 6 playoff victories (8.5% of total coaches, 19% of playoff coaches, 74% of coaches with 12 games or more). Of the 31 coaches who have reached 12 playoff games or more Tomlin’s current winning percentage based on 11 games (.545) has been exceeded by 19 of them. Currently his (.545) is better than these coaches with 12 or more playoff games: Don Shula (.528), Mike Holmgren (.542), Andy Reid (.500), Bud Grant (.455), Tony Dungy (.474), Mike McCarthy (.533), John Fox (.533), Chuck Knox (.389), Mike Ditka (.500), Marty Schottenheimer (.278), Paul Brown (.333), Dennis Green (.333) and he is tied with Dick Vermil (.545). If you factor in the number of playoff games, number of wins and winning percentage as a measure he is 20th of the 119 playoff coaches. If he wins tomorrow then his percentage rises to (.583) which will make him 14th of the 119 playoff coaches. He will pass the following 12 or more playoff game coaches: Mike Shanahan (.571), John Madden (.563), Dan Reeves (.550), Marv Levy (.579), Bill Parcells (.579), Tom Landry (.556) and our own beloved Bill Cowher (.571) for percentage of wins in the playoffs. If he wins he will measure as the 14th of the 119 playoff coaches on total games, wins and percentage.
Now the argument may be slwoB repuS. Okay let’s go there. Only 53 coaches of 272 in the slwoB repuS (19%) have taken their team to at least one slwoB repuS. 22 of the 53 have never won the big game. Only 23 have been to more than 1 championship game (of 272 - 8.5 %, of 53 - 43%). Currently, Tomlin is tied for 12th in winning percentage of the 23 coaches with multiple appearances in the championship with 1 win, 1 loss (.500).
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miami gives up a lot, update those numbers to 30
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16 degrees tomorrow. Nice.
Actually, you seem to have declared some kind of universal consensus that Phil Rivers is, and always has been, a "franchise quarterback." I don't believe that is the case, and I'm certainly not the only one who feels that way. Unlike Ben, he's rarely been a clutch performer, and that is reflected in his overall record as well as his postseason failures.
According to your "confluence" of factors, the Steelers would have had the same amount of success had they ended up with Rivers instead of Ben, right? I highly doubt it. Luckily for you (and all Steelers fans), we'll never know.
Rivers was designated as a franchise QB from the time he was drafted, much like Luck...neither has done anything to deserve the title.....
Actually, what you have attributed to me is NOT what I stated. You're still focusing on just one aspect. The QB. A "confluence" of factors implies more than one. As a matter of fact, I never said that Rivers was AS GOOD AS Ben ... only that Rivers is considered a franchise QB (by many, if not you personally) and has been since he was drafted. the almost identical stats between Ben and Rivers except for wins was posted by another poster..
But again, the QB is only one factor in the "confluence" .... Coaching, teammates, chemistry, leadership are some others. So to repeat, while I am looking at many different factors (including the Head Coaches that each has worked with), you seem intent to focus on just one ... not surprising.
Of course, if things had fallen how Bill Cowher wanted during that draft, we WOULD have known whether Rivers would have achieved success here. Then again, if Bill hadn't been talked out of his second choice, we wouldn't be seeing how good Ben is as a Steeler either. Luckily for you (and all Steelers fans), Bill didn't get his way.
Have a good night top ... 10 a.m. church comes pretty early.
Let's root on the Steelers tomorrow. Even if it galls you to root for success for Tomlin as an individual, the TEAM is the thing .... right?
But see, you're missing the fact that Henderson was the guy who ripped Bradshaw, but wasn't able to back it up in either Super Bowl. Bradshaw had the last laugh on him when it mattered, not the other way around. That's the main reason Tomlin's response was misguided, but yes, I suppose that's way too "deep" for you to comprehend.
And please, don't further insult your intelligence by comparing Thomas Henderson to Lawrence Taylor. Hollywood got cut in the prime of his career. Taylor was one of the greatest defensive players of all-time. Indeed, kids can idolize whomever they choose. If they end up becoming head coaches in the NFL, however, in my opinion, they should probably use more discretion.
Wow. Thanks for the info!
So his postseason winning percentage is 20th out of 31 coaches with as much playoff experience. Got it.
I agree. But Luck has time to change his legacy. Rivers is finished.
Wait, you disagree with me that Rivers was considered a franchise QB from the time he was drafted; but you AGREE with Coolie that Rivers was considered a franchise QB from the time he was drafted?
OK, that's about all I need to see here
Goodnight top. I'll probably get a few stares at church in the morning as I'm laughing about this one.
No ****, man. Really? Other factors besides the quarterback can create a confluence for why teams could succeed or not? Damn. Thanks for clearing that up, Einstein.
Again...my argument from the start of the subject WAS INDEED singularly focused in that Ben is a better quarterback than Rivers. Let me refresh you failing memory. YOU said this:
"I keep hearing this slam about the PRIME of a franchise QB's career and how that's supposed to guarantee a playoff spot. If that's truly the case, I'm baffled about what has happened in SD during Rivers career. Weren't they supposed to be in the playoffs every year? Especially given that they played in what WAS a weaker division than ours for most of his career. I guess it's a paradox ... "
In response, I said: "Philip Rivers is not anywhere close to Ben's caliber, so that is a ****** comparison. You're kidding yourself."
No, it isn't surprising, because that's been my point all along. I could give a **** why the Chargers haven't done as well as the Steelers since these two guys were drafted, but I know that Ben is the better quarterback, no matter what those "almost identical stats" read. And it's encouraging to see that you've put aside the other factors you've been chirping about and finally agree. Of course Ben's superiority it isn't the ONLY reason, but it certainly is a main one.
Actually, as much as I hate to correct you once again, Rivers was already gone with the fourth pick of the draft, and Cowher had wanted Shawn Andrews, so no, we WOULDN'T have known.
You go ahead and pray to your invisible god tomorrow -- maybe He's a Steelers fan. I'll rely on the odds. The Steelers are up to 12-point favorites now. Yes, 12 points. Even Tomlin (whom, btw, I would like to see win every game he coaches until his retirement, because he happens to work for my favorite team) should win this one...right?
Man, I really have to turn my notifications off on my phone so I can get some sleep.
I'm not even going to take the time to read whatever drivel you've written above.
After your disagreeing/agreeing, River's wasn't considered, was considered, isn't considered, is considered a franchise QB flip-flop mumbo jumbo, it's not worth my time. Apparently, you can't even convince yourself enough to believe the stuff you write. So, why should I waste my time?
Good night top. God Bless and Go Steelers!
I'm not even going to take the time to read whatever drivel you've written above.
After your disagreeing/agreeing, River's wasn't considered, was considered, isn't considered, is considered a franchise QB flip-flop mumbo jumbo, it's not worth my time. Apparently, you can't even convince yourself enough to believe the stuff you write. So, why should I waste my time?
Good night top. God Bless and Go Steelers!
Wait, you disagree with me that Rivers was considered a franchise QB from the time he was drafted; but you AGREE with Coolie that Rivers was considered a franchise QB from the time he was drafted?
OK, that's about all I need to see here
Goodnight top. I'll probably get a few stares at church in the morning as I'm laughing about this one.
No, smart person. I agreed with Coolie that Rivers was touted as a franchise quarterback WHEN he was drafted, and I agreed that he hasn't done anything to deserve that title. I disagree that he actually ever became one, which is your contention...did I type slow enough for you?
Goodnight. Enjoy doing whatever it is you do on Sunday mornings. I'll be sleeping in while you're getting stared at.
I know, I know. Sorry. You've got a big day ahead of you. Your precious time will be much better spent getting up and down off your knees and looking for guidance from the invisible. Especially after you just agreed with my entire argument.
Go Steelers and God Bless!
No you are the missing the point. The only person I know who even took his comments past he just calling Bradshaw dumb without actually saying it. Everyone else in the world got that except the super duper smart Topseed. Everyone knows the steelers won and Henderson was a idiot. But funny everyone else took the it at face value with out digging all deep but you. Everyone else laughed and moved on..you still talking about it trying to make it way more then it was
Mike made a smart jab at Terry for his dumb comment. Though I honestly agree in part with what Terry said (there are many different coaches and skill sets). There is no way Mike Tomlin is on a level with Bill Belichek on the X's and O's strategy front. Sorry, watched his entire career and nothing would lead me to believe that. However, Belichek has the people skills of a box of Captain Crunch. Mike is a very smart guy, well spoken who seems to have an excellent rapport with his players and coaches. If you have the right x's and o's guys in place the HC doesn't have to be a genius at that. (Though I'd argue that Haley is not either). Terry's comment though probably having some basis in fact, was WAAAAAAAAAAY to simplistic and looked stupid considering Tomlin's record.
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I hate these threads. It seems we can't praise one Steelers legend without tearing another down.
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In my life time there have been 3 Steeler Eras, The Noll Era, The Cowher Era, and The Tomlin Era.
Each era has had their peaks and valleys, many more peaks than long valleys.
Each era has had a different starting point on the timeline, each starting point had different challenges, each coach met those challenges with great success.
Each era on the timeline had teams that were built and rebuilt. Each era on the timeline (Noll,Cowher,Tomlin) had good drafts and bad drafts. Each era had a HOF QB.
NFL history dictates that a HOF QB is a necessary ingredient to win a Championship, not every time, but most certainly nearly every time.
A teams chances of hoisting the Lombardi are greatly enhanced with a HOF QB. However a HOF QB does not guarantee anything, the sum of the parts are what makes a championship team. If the Sum of The Parts is inadequate the team will fail. The record of a bad team could be 8-8 with a HOF QB, and 6-10 with an inferior QB. I use Big Ben as an example, as he has never had a losing record.
A couple of years ago at a conference that I was attending Terry Bradshaw was a featured speaker, I can see why he drove Noll crazy. He didn't prepare, he just winged it, the result was an embarrassing speech that was mostly a meandering mess with no point at all, just TB trying to tell funny stories mostly about his hands and Mike Websters butt.
One of the "funny" stories he told as how the Steelers had just resigned Ben Roethlisberger and Terry just could NOT understand why. The point is before he criticized Tomlin he was criticizing Ben. Just as he criticized Noll, just as he criticized Pittsburgh and its fans.
When it comes to grading out coaches Terry Bradshaw is about the last person I would got to for comment. He rarely ever listened to them.
But Thank you for your part in 4 SB's TB! The sum of those parts were as exceptional as they were legendary.
Each era has had their peaks and valleys, many more peaks than long valleys.
Each era has had a different starting point on the timeline, each starting point had different challenges, each coach met those challenges with great success.
Each era on the timeline had teams that were built and rebuilt. Each era on the timeline (Noll,Cowher,Tomlin) had good drafts and bad drafts. Each era had a HOF QB.
NFL history dictates that a HOF QB is a necessary ingredient to win a Championship, not every time, but most certainly nearly every time.
A teams chances of hoisting the Lombardi are greatly enhanced with a HOF QB. However a HOF QB does not guarantee anything, the sum of the parts are what makes a championship team. If the Sum of The Parts is inadequate the team will fail. The record of a bad team could be 8-8 with a HOF QB, and 6-10 with an inferior QB. I use Big Ben as an example, as he has never had a losing record.
A couple of years ago at a conference that I was attending Terry Bradshaw was a featured speaker, I can see why he drove Noll crazy. He didn't prepare, he just winged it, the result was an embarrassing speech that was mostly a meandering mess with no point at all, just TB trying to tell funny stories mostly about his hands and Mike Websters butt.
One of the "funny" stories he told as how the Steelers had just resigned Ben Roethlisberger and Terry just could NOT understand why. The point is before he criticized Tomlin he was criticizing Ben. Just as he criticized Noll, just as he criticized Pittsburgh and its fans.
When it comes to grading out coaches Terry Bradshaw is about the last person I would got to for comment. He rarely ever listened to them.
But Thank you for your part in 4 SB's TB! The sum of those parts were as exceptional as they were legendary.
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Well, that about sums it up.
No Archer record here. lol
No Archer record here. lol