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The Epstein Problem

Troglodyte said:
THIS is being objective about Trump and his administration. Unfortunately for this country, the type of people that can never admit they are wrong are allowed to vote and are inclined to vote for an antagonistic, narcissistic sociopath.
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How come the Democrats weren't this mad about Biden and Merrick Garland doing nothing with the Epstein files for four years?
 
The biggest issue I have is that Trump ran on releasing the whole damn thing. Seems like once he found out what was in it he changed his tune a bit. Now look, I don't know if he is protecting himself, friends, donors or all of the above, but waffling about it and leaving Pam Bondi to take the heat rounds is weak. Do what you said you would do. Release it all, unredacted. Everyone agrees that pedophilia is abhorrent and gross and these offenders need held to account.

Between that and no one talking that could blow the lid off of it, it's frustrating and yet just another example of our government failing us and people with money being above the law and getting off scot free.
 
Troglodyte said:
THIS is being objective about Trump and his administration. Unfortunately for this country, the type of people that can never admit they are wrong are allowed to vote and are inclined to vote for an antagonistic, narcissistic sociopath.

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You don’t get it. I don’t like him but the alternatives were a senile guy with a crackhead son who took millions from foreign interests while having zero qualifications, and a complete bubblehead who never received a single vote in a primary. Both of whom believe in unfettered illegal immigration, paying and housing illegal immigrants, men in women’s sports and locker rooms, abortion til birth, stacking the Supreme Court because it made rulings they don’t like, confiscating what my family has worked for and throwing it into the huge black hole of federal government bureaucracy. I mean the list goes on and on. I voted on policy (and trust me there’s a lot in that arena I don’t like about Trump, the reckless spending, the anti-vax ****, to name a couple). All of the made up **** and illegal lawsuits and prosecutions you all flung at Trump only made me more determined that as corrupt and ****** of a person as he might be, your side is 10 times more corrupt and ******. Y’all literally passed a new law on statute of limitations for the sole purpose of suing him for a made up rape story from Law and Order SVU. You turned bookkeeping errors into felonies by twisting the rules. You screamed about Russian collusion for years based on a lie and never produced a shred of evidence. When that didn’t work you moved on to something else. Lather, rinse, repeat.

It was the lesser of two evils. It usually is. Trump isn’t president because he’s a great man. He’s president because your side sucks and has nothing to offer.
 
Sarge said:
The biggest issue I have is that Trump ran on releasing the whole damn thing. Seems like once he found out what was in it he changed his tune a bit. Now look, I don't know if he is protecting himself, friends, donors or all of the above, but waffling about it and leaving Pam Bondi to take the heat rounds is weak. Do what you said you would do. Release it all, unredacted. Everyone agrees that pedophilia is abhorrent and gross and these offenders need held to account.

Between that and no one talking that could blow the lid off of it, it's frustrating and yet just another example of our government failing us and people with money being above the law and getting off scot free.
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Releasing it unredacted is illegal. You think they won’t all be screaming about that if he did that?
But I agree that it all should have been released long ago.
 
Badcat said:
Okay. I can't promise you that others will treat you well up front in this journey, as your remarks have scorned many for many a year. But you'll get good treatment from me as long as it's reciprocated. Deal.
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i'll do the same. but, i also know that historically Tibs has tried to refrain from being outrageously insulting only to devolve and hurl insults soon thereafter. its a never-ending cycle.
 
oneforthebus said:
You don’t get it. I don’t like him but the alternatives were a senile guy with a crackhead son who took millions from foreign interests while having zero qualifications, and a complete bubblehead who never received a single vote in a primary. Both of whom believe in unfettered illegal immigration, paying and housing illegal immigrants, men in women’s sports and locker rooms, abortion til birth, stacking the Supreme Court because it made rulings they don’t like, confiscating what my family has worked for and throwing it into the huge black hole of federal government bureaucracy. I mean the list goes on and on. I voted on policy (and trust me there’s a lot in that arena I don’t like about Trump, the reckless spending, the anti-vax ****, to name a couple). All of the made up **** and illegal lawsuits and prosecutions you all flung at Trump only made me more determined that as corrupt and ****** of a person as he might be, your side is 10 times more corrupt and ******. Y’all literally passed a new law on statute of limitations for the sole purpose of suing him for a made up rape story from Law and Order SVU. You turned bookkeeping errors into felonies by twisting the rules. You screamed about Russian collusion for years based on a lie and never produced a shred of evidence. When that didn’t work you moved on to something else. Lather, rinse, repeat.

It was the lesser of two evils. It usually is. Trump isn’t president because he’s a great man. He’s president because your side sucks and has nothing to offer.
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Isn’t a great man? Understatement of the century. I fully get it. You voted for a corrupt, narcissistic, sociopath when you knew he was such. That’s voting for the greatest of all evils.
 
Consider hypothetically that 100 Republicans and 100 Democrats were identified and indicted. Who goes first? Does the same court hear every case? What happens when one clan gets demonstrably harsher sentences than the other. Would every jury have to be vetted for their political beliefs, and the jury made up of equal proportions of Democrats and Republicans? We've all seen how biased juries are, and what happens.
The bottom line is that such trials cannot be conducted fairly. The fallout from that would further divide the country.
Only the principals should go to trial, however, there is much to be gained by publishing the client list. Then let the court of public opinion take their cases.

I'd like to see every guilty party punished as much as anyone. What I envision happening is senators and congress members will huddle into teams to protect their own to hold onto or obtain power. They are otherwise perfectly willing to look the other way if it works to their political advantage. Rich billionaires not in congress will lawyer up and delay and stall for all of eternity. A few people will get thrown under the bus to satisfy public outrage, but most of them are likely to walk in the end.
 
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ZonaBurgh said:
Consider hypothetically that 100 Republicans and 100 Democrats were identified and indicted. Who goes first? Does the same court hear every case? What happens when one clan gets demonstrably harsher sentences than the other. Would every jury have to be vetted for their political beliefs, and the jury made up of equal proportions of Democrats and Republicans? We've all seen how biased juries are, and what happens.
The bottom line is that such trials cannot be conducted fairly. The fallout from that would further divide the country.
Only the principals should go to trial, however, there is much to be gained by publishing the client list. Then let the court of public opinion take their cases.

I'd like to see every guilty party punished as much as anyone. What I envision happening is senators and congress members will huddle into teams to protect their own to hold onto or obtain power. They are otherwise perfectly willing to look the other way if it works to their political advantage. Rich billionaires not in congress will lawyer up and delay and stall for all of eternity. A few people will get thrown under the bus to satisfy public outrage, but most of them are likely to walk in the end.
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What I see is there's a whole lot of evidence that people were friendly with Epstein but little to no evidence that most of them had sex with kids. I'm not saying they didn't, just saying there's been little to no evidence produced, and there probably won't be. You can't put someone on trial for having lunch with Epstein or flying on his plane, even for lying about it (unless they were under oath).

There are however people who know that they were raped as kids, and know who did it. They should speak up. Or go to the police and provide sworn statements. Otherwise I don't see any of this going anywhere, except to be used as a political hot potato for both sides of the aisle.
 
Tibs said:
Sorry that I responded directly, and very specifically, to Confluence, and Superman, just two of those who insult me at every turn. It's funny to me how none of you EVER find it in you to call out those who lodge personal attacks against me, thread after thread. The second I respond, I get a spotlight on me and everyone clutches their pearls. Post after post, I'm attacked by a handful of members here, which I ignore best I can, as I have for years. Then again, I respond to a single one of these personal attacks, the way I would at a bar, if someone said something like this to my face, and everyone throws a yellow flag. I guess you see what you want, and speak up, when you feel like it. It's cool, I guess, it's been this way forever.

And yes, there are plenty of folks on this board who are civil, normal, and engage in kind. Then there are those who are hellbent on chasing me off, time and again, which is unfortunate.

Edit - And it seems most of you missed why I called out Superman. It had nothing to do with politics. It was that as a mod, he brought back a post I had deleted this morning. He quoted it, as if the post was still on the board, some six hours after I had deleted it. It was a deleted post, which only he saw as an admin, and decided to bring it back onto the board, after I had deleted it. That's a pretty sh*tty move by a moderator on a message board, and the sole reason he did that, was to take a dig at me. I don't think it's ethical from a board moderator to do that, and I said so. Especially from a moderator who goes out of his way to insult and attack me at every turn, along with a few of his cohorts. So again, it's not a political thing, a pro-Trump or anti-Trump thing, just a lack of basic board etiquette that I think has been a part of SN since I've been here for two decades or so. Then Confluence comes along and just takes a personal swipe at me, for no reason, having nothing to do with anything. So I called him a c*nt, which I think was warranted, and would have done that to his face, if he had said what he did to my face. Again, none of this has to do with politics. But who cares, really.
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I'm confused as to why you're so upset that he replied to an innocuous post that you had for some reason deleted. I don't even disagree with your post. Their actions are indeed making them look guilty. Even many of Trump's strongest supporters (MTG?) agree with that.
 
oneforthebus said:
What I see is there's a whole lot of evidence that people were friendly with Epstein but little to no evidence that most of them had sex with kids. I'm not saying they didn't, just saying there's been little to no evidence produced, and there probably won't be. You can't put someone on trial for having lunch with Epstein or flying on his plane, even for lying about it (unless they were under oath).

There are however people who know that they were raped as kids, and know who did it. They should speak up. Or go to the police and provide sworn statements. Otherwise I don't see any of this going anywhere, except to be used as a political hot potato for both sides of the aisle.
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Not being a lawyer myself, the only logical explanation is non-disclosure agreements with a boatload of cash exchanging hands.
Having said that, I am a parent and I'm not sure that any amount of money would keep me from pursuing legal or even vigilante action.
 
oneforthebus said:
Releasing it unredacted is illegal. You think they won’t all be screaming about that if he did that?
But I agree that it all should have been released long ago.
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Do you think any of them care about the law outside of when it can be used as a cudgel to beat their political opponents over the head with? Their actions certainly say otherwise. Who cares if people complain about it? And I don't want to hear about protecting victims when they are out making PSA's for the government to tell everyone what the victims could have told everyone a long time ago.

This nation truly missed it's moment with this. This could have brought about a reset so many clamor for. We could have exposed and rounded up a whole lot of corruption from not only our government, but our society too. Instead, people are still running around pointing fingers at Trump or Clinton or whoever taking political sides in an issue that shouldn't have any sides other than pedophiles and those that aren't.
 
Badcat said:
Why didn't he order them to be unsealed?
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The AutoPens were too busy having gay buttsex in the Senate Judicial Hearing Room.
 
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