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Spence over Shazier

Punxsutawney said:
We have people comparing Timmons to Farrior here? Really?

Farrior was an MVP-caliber player in the 2004 and 2005 seasons. Timmons has never been in such conversations.

Farrior was also among the greatest leaders the Steelers have ever had.

I've grown to like Timmons, but come on now.
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Wonder what Farrior's play would be like with the talent of this team playing around him? Probably would make a difference. At least a smidg'n anyways.
 
insaniti said:
Funny, Farriors best year was actually his last in NY as far as tackles go. I stated in my post that people ignore the impact plays that Timmons makes and only concentrate on the plays he doesn't make. Farrior was burned A LOT by RB's that he never could cover, even in his prime. But he wasn't drafted in the first round, by a coach that most don't like, for a position that he was moved from.

Timmons does make impact plays, and some of his tackles might be "downfield" but he is usually coming from the other side of the formation to make that tackle, and usually it's still enough to keep them from getting a first down.

I'm not trying to minimize Farriors impact on one of the best defensive units we've had since the 70's, I'm merely pointing out that Timmons is making every bit the impact, just on a defensive unit that isn't quite so dominant. Yes I do think he deserves to be in the Bowman, Keuchley category as I don't see either of those two carrying their defenses. In fact SF defense is pretty bad at the moment, and Keuchley has missed several games this year due to a concussion, yet the Panthers are still undefeated.

The problem is, this is the Steelers, and every player on our team gets held to a higher standard than most. Each player MUST be a perennial All Pro, and future HOFer or else...but other players around the league, they just need to put up stats.

As for context argument, are you seriously trying to compare a 3-4 ILB to a QB as far as impact? Timmons doesn't make anyone around him better? Well, we honestly don't know that answer because Timmons hasn't missed a game since becoming a starter. We don't know what this defense would be like without him on the field. Timmons has earned every penny of his contract, he's had every bit the impact that Bowman or Keuchley have for their defenses. Remember when everyone was all over Patrick Willis jock, then Bownman went down and Willis became pretty pedestrian. Timmons hasn't had a player like that next to him SINCE Farrior was here. Foote was brought back and got hurt immediately, and since they've been playing a Spence/Shazier/Williams combo next to Timmons since...all three lack experience.

But by all means, keep thinking that Timmons is just a guy, we'll find out sooner or later how much he's actually meant to this defense.


Farrior was never a DPOY candidate anywhere outside the Steelers fanbase, he had solid years for us, and I'm certainly glad we had him. Was huge for us, but lets not get carried away. Farrior was a solid leader for us, and that somehow makes it impossible to compare Timmons to him as far as their impact on the field?
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Maybe you should check who finished second in voting in 2004
 
Just read today that Timmons ranks 54th out of 57 ILBs, according to PFF. Shazier is ranked 38th. Didn't see what Spence was ranked.
 
SteelerFan448 said:
Just read today that Timmons ranks 54th out of 57 ILBs, according to PFF. Shazier is ranked 38th. Didn't see what Spence was ranked.
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What exactly are these rankings based off of? Timmons is a lot better than 54th rated ILB in the league.
 
They are based on some European guy's opinion without knowing the players assignments on the plays...basically no better than anyone's opinion here
 
insaniti said:
They are based on some European guy's opinion without knowing the players assignments on the plays...basically no better than anyone's opinion here
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If anyone thinks Timmons is the 54th best ILB in the NFL, their grading system is flawed.
 
mdk2 said:
What exactly are these rankings based off of? Timmons is a lot better than 54th rated ILB in the league.
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Pro Football Focus guys watching game film and using their mysterious grading system..
 
Punxsutawney said:
We have people comparing Timmons to Farrior here? Really?

Farrior was an MVP-caliber player in the 2004 and 2005 seasons. Timmons has never been in such conversations.

Farrior was also among the greatest leaders the Steelers have ever had.

I've grown to like Timmons, but come on now.
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MVP? Really?

Surely you mean Team MVP or DPoY.
 
ark steel said:
If anyone thinks Timmons is the 54th best ILB in the NFL, their grading system is flawed.
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Yeah those guys have their little grading algorithm.. it should, in no way, be used as a definitive ranking system

That being said, if any objective ranking system puts you near the bottom at your position, you have a lot of room for improvement.
 
AggieSteel said:
Yeah those guys have their little grading algorithm.. it should, in no way, be used as a definitive ranking system

That being said, if any objective ranking system puts you near the bottom at your position, you have a lot of room for improvement.
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Regardless of whether Timmons could make some improvements, any objective system that even puts him in the bottom half of ILBs is ridiculously flawed.
 
Shazier didn't practice today...
 
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