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So .........

Coryea

Coryea

Nothing left to do but win the whole ******* thing
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If Isaac Bruce is a HOFer, and alot of talking heads said he was a lock. How is Ward not?
Ward played in less games, had 24 less catches, 2,000 less yards, and 5 less TDs. Had the same number of probowls, 2 super bowls, and an MVP. Also he played in a run first team with garbage QBs until he was 28. Was a game changer and rule changer as a blocker.

Yet I hear people say Ward isn't a HOF player, but Bruce was a lock?????

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I look at the total stats over guys the media says should be in the Hall of Fame and look at Ward's and he's right there with them. More importantly, his playoff stats are outstanding. I get he wasn't the biggest or fastest, but he got it done and embodied everything it meant to be a member of those great Steeler teams.
 
I have been saying this now, literally for decades, its the HALL OF FAME, not the hall of stats. Unfortunately, modern voters only seem to look at the inflated numbers from the modern rules and less as to the impact a player had on the game.
 
Bruce has 3,000 more receiving yards than Hines and he put up 8 1,000 yard seasons and some mind numbing stats for the era , BEFORE, Kurt Warner with 119 catches for 1,781 yards with Chris Miller and Mark Rypien as his QBs in 1995. He was freakishly good and deserves to be in the hall. He was considered to be the best WR in football at on time and top 5 every season in something Hines never was.
 
Beuce was definitely a hof player... he is something like fifth in wr yards...

Hines will get in, he just will have to wait a long time like stallworth or swann did ....

Hines was a complete football player who played on one of the last true run first teams and for a portion of his prime with crap qbs...
 
Bruce is only behind sluffs like Moss, Owens, Fitzgerald and Rice in the yardage department.
He was a smooth route runner and part of the greatest show on turf ..... had Kurt Warner not got injured that offense was on pace to put up numbers for a season that would not likely get touched even in todays pass happy league. He put in 16 years in the league and had to wait his turn for the hall because guys like Owens and Moss put up higher TD totals. He was never a diva ******** either.
He did earn his place in the Hall.

Hines was a totally different type of receiver. He put up decent numbers over his career and contributed in other areas like blocking. He should eventually get in but like Mad.. said ...it will take a while
 
Siebert said:
Bruce has 3,000 more receiving yards than Hines and he put up 8 1,000 yard seasons and some mind numbing stats for the era , BEFORE, Kurt Warner with 119 catches for 1,781 yards with Chris Miller and Mark Rypien as his QBs in 1995. He was freakishly good and deserves to be in the hall. He was considered to be the best WR in football at on time and top 5 every season in something Hines never was.
Click to expand...
Some of you are playing fantasy football with your viewpoints. What is the ultimate measure for a player? Regular season production? But isn't the ultra measurement a players postseason production and impact? Hines is up pretty high on the leader boards for postseason TDs and yards. Yes more than Bruce. More than some HOFers. Throw in SB MVP and devistating blocking and I will show you a player seriously underrated by fans and by the HOF committee.

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Ward had more than 90 catches 4 times, Bruce had more than 90 catches one time.
Wards catch % was 64.7% Bruce 57%, for comparison Rice's catch % is 62%.
Ward had double digit TDs 3 times, Bruce 2 times.
Ward has double the catches, over twice as many TDs, and 400+ more yards in the post season, and a Super Bowl MVP.

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Coryea said:
Ward had more than 90 catches 4 times, Bruce had more than 90 catches one time.
Wards catch % was 64.7% Bruce 57%, for comparison Rice's catch % is 62%.
Ward had double digit TDs 3 times, Bruce 2 times.
Ward has double the catches, over twice as many TDs, and 400+ more yards in the post season, and a Super Bowl MVP.

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Click to expand...
I want to say a Ward and say a Reggie Wayne had solid arguments for being more deserving.

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A.) Wrs are incredibly backlogged... there is a fifteen to 20 year wait for non first tier wrs, and around a five for first tier...
B.) Ward played in the expansion of Wr importance, but played on a team that still was heavily run first until ten years into his career... other less complete guys like Jimmy Smith have flashy numbers too, so he gets lost in the wash easier
C.) a lot of Steelers got in in the past 30 years so it is harder on borderline guys... like Shell, for instance

There are models that predict Hall of fame eligibility... Ward is a third tier HOF worthy WR, slightly ahead of the much more dynamic Calvin Johnson, but significantly behind guys like Torry holt and Reggie Wayne...

Will he get in? Most likely, but don’t be surprised if its closer to 2030 than 2020
 
Do I want Ward in,......HELL YEA but also see the back log and The hesitance due to STEELERS over populace of the Hall. I don't agree with the rational of to many STEELER'S players there because if the voters are ho;ding that as an excuse, the system has failed all along. MERIT should be the only criteria that determines induction.

The HOF started becoming the "pro-bowl" once they voted Warren Sapp in, it shows the deteriation of the level of induction. He made it due to his nation exposure as an analysist as his play was below what should be HOF STANDARDS. GET READY FOR NORE substandard inductees and look no further than who got in VS Alan Fanica, to prove my point.

The NFL total package he's deteriation as a whole and we will never see the TRUE likes of it again. The participation culture is continuing to devour integrety along the way.




PS **** the CHEATRIOTS and their current DPOY as the world knows who that should have been !!!!


RED
HOT
POKER

Time for the ******** and MASSholes






Salute the nation
 
Hines unfortunately is going to have a longer wait. **** he may even need to get in further down the road with the veterans committee. He's definitely a HOF player.
 
Stats are one thing but the other argument I hear often against Hines is he was never the best WR (or even top 3 WR) in any given season he played. So, if he was never considered the best, how can he be a HOF'er. I think he should get in because of his very good (not great) stats (on a running team) and the fact he was the best blocking WR probably ever. If he gets in, he will definitely have to wait quite a while.
 
Drink IRON City said:
Do I want Ward in,......HELL YEA but also see the back log and The hesitance due to STEELERS over populace of the Hall. I don't agree with the rational of to many STEELER'S players there because if the voters are ho;ding that as an excuse, the system has failed all along. MERIT should be the only criteria that determines induction.

The HOF started becoming the "pro-bowl" once they voted Warren Sapp in, it shows the deteriation of the level of induction. He made it due to his nation exposure as an analysist as his play was below what should be HOF STANDARDS. GET READY FOR NORE substandard inductees and look no further than who got in VS Alan Fanica, to prove my point.

The NFL total package he's deteriation as a whole and we will never see the TRUE likes of it again. The participation culture is continuing to devour integrety along the way.




PS **** the CHEATRIOTS and their current DPOY as the world knows who that should have been !!!!


RED
HOT
POKER

Time for the ******** and MASSholes






Salute the nation
Click to expand...

Sapp was widely regarded as the best DT in the game for several years from the late 1990s to the early 2000s. He was going into the HOF whether he did TV after his career or not.
 
The guy who is getting shafted is Faneca, not Ward... Faneca has better HOF ratings than Troy... hell most of the stat sites give him a decisive edge on Hutch, who just got in... he had FIRST ballot type ratings and yet is still waiting...
 
Steelerfan81 said:
I don't believe Bruce should be in. I don't believe James should be in either. It's the hall of pretty good.
Click to expand...

Bruce was borderline for me. I never thought of James was a Hall of Famer and was actually surprised when I saw he was a finalist this week. My biggest gripe making the Hall of Fame in recent years was Terrell Davis. One good year, three great years and that's it. I know he was the best, but it was for such a short period of time you could really double how many players you put in the Hall if you're only looking at 3-4 year stretches of their careers.
 
TDX27 said:
Stats are one thing but the other argument I hear often against Hines is he was never the best WR (or even top 3 WR) in any given season he played. So, if he was never considered the best, how can he be a HOF'er. I think he should get in because of his very good (not great) stats (on a running team) and the fact he was the best blocking WR probably ever. If he gets in, he will definitely have to wait quite a while.
Click to expand...

Ward's numbers were definitely deflated by the offenses he played in during his prime, but he never really dominated his position, which to me, is key for a HOF case.
 
Punxsutawney said:
Ward's numbers were definitely deflated by the offenses he played in during his prime, but he never really dominated his position, which to me, is key for a HOF case.
Click to expand...

Lots of HOFers didn't dominant their position. Swann didn't dominate anything. He had great catches in the SB but his numbers weren't that great. How about Joe Namath? He had 47 more Ints than Tds. What about Bob Griese? Never threw for over 2500 yards and basically handed the ball off to Csonka. He averaged less than 100 yards a game during their SB runs. Hardly anywhere near the top of the Qbs of the day. Heck even Stallworth wasn't a numbers guy. You could easily make the argument for him to be left out.
 
Punxsutawney said:
Ward's numbers were definitely deflated by the offenses he played in during his prime, but he never really dominated his position, which to me, is key for a HOF case.
Click to expand...

His postseason stats dominate over a lot who dominated during the regular season. Again add in that MVP and his blocking and he is well deserved.
 
Vader said:
Lots of HOFers didn't dominant their position. Swann didn't dominate anything. He had great catches in the SB but his numbers weren't that great. How about Joe Namath? He had 47 more Ints than Tds. What about Bob Griese? Never threw for over 2500 yards and basically handed the ball off to Csonka. He averaged less than 100 yards a game during their SB runs. Hardly anywhere near the top of the Qbs of the day. Heck even Stallworth wasn't a numbers guy. You could easily make the argument for him to be left out.
Click to expand...

I think Stallworth actually had a better argument than Swann in some aspects. But yeah Ward really stacks up well against those two loved WRs......All three really had some beautiful SB moments....................
 
Vader said:
Lots of HOFers didn't dominant their position. Swann didn't dominate anything. He had great catches in the SB but his numbers weren't that great. How about Joe Namath? He had 47 more Ints than Tds. What about Bob Griese? Never threw for over 2500 yards and basically handed the ball off to Csonka. He averaged less than 100 yards a game during their SB runs. Hardly anywhere near the top of the Qbs of the day. Heck even Stallworth wasn't a numbers guy. You could easily make the argument for him to be left out.
Click to expand...

I don't think Swann and Stallworth belong in the HOF, as unpopular as that opinion is here.

I feel the same way about Namath and Griese.

I think the bar is set too low with too many inconsistencies.

It's gotten ridiculously bad over the past 20 years or so, as the league views the HOF ceremony as merely another cash grab that can be maximized by lowering the bar and letting more players in.

Baseball's HOF process is much more legit.
 
Punxsutawney said:
I don't think Swann and Stallworth belong in the HOF, as unpopular as that opinion is here.

I feel the same way about Namath and Griese.

I think the bar is set too low with too many inconsistencies.

It's gotten ridiculously bad over the past 20 years or so, as the league views the HOF ceremony as merely another cash grab that can be maximized by lowering the bar and letting more players in.

Baseball's HOF process is much more legit.
Click to expand...

Professional football career

Swann waves the Terrible Towel.
Swann was selected by the Pittsburgh Steelers with the 21st pick of the first round in the 1974 NFL Draft. The Steelers draft class of '74 is considered one of the best in NFL history and included four eventual Hall of Famers: Swann, John Stallworth, Mike Webster, and Jack Lambert.

Swann spent his entire NFL career with the Steelers and wore the jersey number 88. As a rookie, he led the NFL with 577 punt-return yards, a franchise record and the fourth-most in NFL history at the time. He went on to win a championship ring with the Steelers in Super Bowl IX but did not record any receptions in the tough defensive struggle (Pittsburgh quarterback Terry Bradshaw completed only nine passes in the game). However, he returned three punts for 34 yards.


Swann with Steelers fans before a game in 2006
The following season became the highlight of Swann's career. He caught 49 passes for 781 yards and a league-leading 11 touchdowns. In the AFC title game against the Oakland Raiders, George Atkinson knocked Swann out of the game with a very hard but legal hit. He suffered a severe concussion that forced him to spend two days in a hospital, but surprised many by returning to play for Super Bowl X. Swann recorded four catches for a Super Bowl-record 161 yards and a touchdown in the game, assisting the Steelers to a 21–17 win and becoming the first wide receiver to earn Super Bowl MVP honors.

Swann was unique among football players in that he credited his experiences in dance earlier in life with contributing to his aptitude on the football field. A 1981 interview which aired on Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood showed him on the field, and then in the Pittsburgh dance studio where he later underwrote scholarships.[3]

Three seasons later, the Steelers made it to Super Bowl XIII. In the game, Swann caught seven passes for 124 yards and scored the final touchdown for Pittsburgh in their 35–31 win over the Dallas Cowboys. The Steelers made it back to the Super Bowl again in the 1979 season, and Swann caught five passes for 79 yards and a touchdown in Pittsburgh's 31–19 win in Super Bowl XIV. Overall, Swann gained 364 receiving yards and 398 all-purpose yards in his four Super Bowls, which were both Super Bowl records at the time.

Swann retired after the 1982 season with four Super Bowl rings. In his nine-year career, he amassed 336 career receptions for 5,462 yards and 51 touchdowns, 72 rushing yards on 11 attempts and a touchdown, and 739 punt return yards and a touchdown. He was a Pro Bowl selection three times 1975, 1977, and 1978, and was selected on the 1970s All-Decade Team.



MY two and a half cents:

I think he did enough to deserve the HOF. I am not a fantasy league fan.
 
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