Pay me or trade me.....

[SojournerSteel]

Are these athletes fans of Mark Twain?

"Man will do many things to get himself loved; he will do all things to get himself envied."

-Mark Twain

 

[ark steel]

Really. Ok. I will draft Sequon Barkley and you can have the kicker. Running backs don't have value because of the CBA not because of their importance to the game. The belief is because of the nature of the game you are better off with a rookie with nothing on the cap and no tread on the tires than an experienced pro in the prime of his career, but soon to drop off. And there isn't one other position like that. No one goes oh I know he is a top 5 receiver but I'm not going to re sign him. I will go cheap and draft. Ever. The contact a lineman receives is literally nothing compared to a running back. It's one yard apart. Running back contact is two freight trains colliding.
As far as the 6-10 million, do you short change yourself at your job? Who the **** does in this game. Did Ben Roethlisberger take less because he wanted to win a championship?

I disagree with the bolded part. There pretty much has to be head-to-head, head-to-shoulder, etc. collisions on every play. These are huge guys propelling themselves at each other with all of their strength. Only being 1 yard isn't much of a consolation.

 

[Paul G]

I don't think I would use the word sympathy. If all players were in the same boat it would be different. But a workhorse back like Elliot he gets tackled about say 20 times a game. By dline and linebackers and safeties. Then say he has 5 or 6 serious blitz pickups a game with a linebacker at nearly full speed. So now let's say half of the tackles aren't bad. All of the blitz pickups are bad. That is at least 16 serious collisions a game. Compare that to a great wide receiver who catches say 6 or 7 passes a game usually against the smallest opponent. He would be unlucky to be in more than 2 hard collisions. In the end the running back will be lucky to get his big super payday and teams are hedging it on the fact that he is getting used up in his first 4-5 years. The receiver in New Orleans just got 100 million. They need to fix it for running back. Three years. No contract. Team gets an option on the fourth season but it is like the franchise tag. UFA after that no exceptions.
They need to allow and make it desirable for the team to sign a long term deal to the running back in the second or third season to get to about 7 years which is his shelf life.

I like the thought process and agree that RBs are abused early in their career under this system

 

[SteelerSask2]

I disagree with the bolded part. There pretty much has to be head-to-head, head-to-shoulder, etc. collisions on every play. These are huge guys propelling themselves at each other with all of their strength. Only being 1 yard isn't much of a consolation.

It will get you in the long run. Especially down the road when the playing is over. But star tackles, guards and centers make it to their max contract easily. Their market value on that contract isn't effected by tread. They are considered EXPERIENCED. Many make it to a second huge contract.

 

[Paul G]

I don't think he was as good as Bell or Gurley. GM's are now seeing, with the Gurley injury, that it might not be worth it.

I agree with you that Gordon is on a lower level than Zeke, Gurley and the Bell of a couple years ago ( we will see how he fares in NY)
I was surprised when the Gurley contract was announced especially considering injury history but that is all it takes nowadays is for one team to inflate prices drastically and the snowball effect is set in motion around the league

 

[SteelerFan448]

Really. Ok. I will draft Sequon Barkley and you can have the kicker. Running backs don't have value because of the CBA not because of their importance to the game. The belief is because of the nature of the game you are better off with a rookie with nothing on the cap and no tread on the tires than an experienced pro in the prime of his career, but soon to drop off. And there isn't one other position like that. No one goes oh I know he is a top 5 receiver but I'm not going to re sign him. I will go cheap and draft. Ever. The contact a lineman receives is literally nothing compared to a running back. It's one yard apart. Running back contact is two freight trains colliding.
As far as the 6-10 million, do you short change yourself at your job? Who the **** does in this game. Did Ben Roethlisberger take less because he wanted to win a championship?

Ok, since you're kinda changing the narrative on the point I was making, I'll bite. The Steelers did fine replacing Bell with his backup, but missed the playoffs because Boswell went from one of the best kickers in the league to one of the worst.

Of course the point I was making is each position has a limit on earning potential. The best kickers in the league will still always be paid lower than every other starting position other than long snapper and punter. It is what it is.

 

[Paul G]

Again, NO ONE is forcing these guys to play or be a running back. If they don't like the measly 6-10 million they make a season, then quit and go do something else. Or become a WR or a LB or another position.

I get that you don't sympathize with these guys in the money department because it is more than what most earn in a lifetime compared to one season of work.
However these guys don't just come out of highschool and pick football as a career choice. They start honing their skills at an early age and make sacrifices just for the opportunity to play highschool, then hope to be prepared enough to receive a scholarship to a decent college. Many times it will never be their choice at which position to play due to their physical make up, mental processing, skills and where ever a coach decides to use them. Even at the college level guys are shifted around constantly and some even do it to gain a chance in the NFL. We all want to obtain the most money we can garner, balanced against things like playing for a hometown team or potential Superbowl contenders. Only the elite players can manipulate their way around the league like AB did. They roll the dice and take the chance it might not work in their favor. I don't have any problem with a player wanting more money as they see salary caps rise and most sports have guaranteed money so that is an issue that is surfacing in the NFL. The only problem I have is the manner in which some guys and their agents go about this process. AB *******'s way ---- Demarcus Lawrence mad respect--- continue to work, maintain positive attitude and get rewarded.

 

[Coryea]

I get that you don't sympathize with these guys in the money department because it is more than what most earn in a lifetime compared to one season of work.
However these guys don't just come out of highschool and pick football as a career choice. They start honing their skills at an early age and make sacrifices just for the opportunity to play highschool, then hope to be prepared enough to receive a scholarship to a decent college. Many times it will never be their choice at which position to play due to their physical make up, mental processing, skills and where ever a coach decides to use them. Even at the college level guys are shifted around constantly and some even do it to gain a chance in the NFL. We all want to obtain the most money we can garner, balanced against things like playing for a hometown team or potential Superbowl contenders. Only the elite players can manipulate their way around the league like AB did. They roll the dice and take the chance it might not work in their favor. I don't have any problem with a player wanting more money as they see salary caps rise and most sports have guaranteed money so that is an issue that is surfacing in the NFL. The only problem I have is the manner in which some guys and their agents go about this process. AB *******'s way ---- Demarcus Lawrence mad respect--- continue to work, maintain positive attitude and get rewarded.

They don't sacrifice anything in High School, they play a game and have fun doing it in Highschool. These guys have their ***** kissed from highschool and onto the pros, excuse me if I don't care about them or their money they aren't making. Again, use that free school and go get a job where you don't get hit. The system is what it is, to damn bad. No one gives two ***** about the kids that struggle to pay for their education, have to work a full-time job on top of their classes, while these athletes get a full ride and have all their school paid for.

 

[Stryker]

Running back is a byproduct of the position. These kids grow up in HS and College carrying the ball 20-40 times a game and are comfortable with the ball in their hands, and getting the ball. When they hit the league, they are thrust into action early. All RBs play their rookie years, unlike other positions where you learn for a year or 2 before playing/starting. RBs get hurt a lot, because of the amount of time they touch the football, as a result few get second contracts and even less get a third. This devalues the position. Not the importance of the position.

 

[Paul G]

Running back is a byproduct of the position. These kids grow up in HS and College carrying the ball 20-40 times a game and are comfortable with the ball in their hands, and getting the ball. When they hit the league, they are thrust into action early. All RBs play their rookie years, unlike other positions where you learn for a year or 2 before playing/starting. RBs get hurt a lot, because of the amount of time they touch the football, as a result few get second contracts and even less get a third. This devalues the position. Not the importance of the position.

Good points Cope
There are not many guys like Frank Gore's holding on to a RB position ....rightfully so as it is hard to maintain that competitive edge and good health past the 32 year old range.

 

[SteelerFan448]

Running back is a byproduct of the position. These kids grow up in HS and College carrying the ball 20-40 times a game and are comfortable with the ball in their hands, and getting the ball. When they hit the league, they are thrust into action early. All RBs play their rookie years, unlike other positions where you learn for a year or 2 before playing/starting. RBs get hurt a lot, because of the amount of time they touch the football, as a result few get second contracts and even less get a third. This devalues the position. Not the importance of the position.

I don't think that's what devalues the position, I think it's because a guy like Willie Parker can come out of nowhere and put up huge numbers. Look at Kansas City, they lose guys left and right and don't miss a beat. Injuries and wear and tear play a part in the contracts, but there are just a ton of capable players ready to step in who will make a ton less money.

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

Yeah if you have a decent O line that can open holes.. you don't need a veteran. Plus.. with the cap.. The money has to fall somehow, some way. Guards get less than tackles.. Guess what they play right beside each other.. But that's how it goes.

 

[Paul G]

They don't sacrifice anything in High School, they play a game and have fun doing it in Highschool. These guys have their ***** kissed from highschool and onto the pros, excuse me if I don't care about them or their money they aren't making. Again, use that free school and go get a job where you don't get hit. The system is what it is, to damn bad. No one gives two ***** about the kids that struggle to pay for their education, have to work a full-time job on top of their classes, while these athletes get a full ride and have all their school paid for.

Grouping everyone into the same basket is rather unfair. You have the choice to feel towards these athletes anyway you choose and the same towards kids that don't receive scholarships. The USA colleges provide athletic and academic scholarships on a scale not seen anywhere else in the world. These institutions thrive monetarily off of this situation so I would expect them to provide schooling to athletes as they contribute to the success of the programs. Other students are not expected to be in the weight room at 5am ,go to classes, study the playbook, come to practice and games, respect curfew, etc.
I agree with you that for the most part highschool football is a fun time and a good part of kids that play do not sacrifice greatly. However the top tier athletes and their families are subjected to sacrifices on many levels. Amateur athletes wishing to participate in Olympics or world championships are supported mostly by family alone here in Canada. Young hockey players are shipped off in their early teens for a chance to play in a program that could further their career. Young athletes up here have to be good enough to gain recognition to a US school (NBA draft had 6 Cdn kids drafted this year) to be rewarded with free schooling. I am not saying scholarships don't exist up here but they are minimal in comparison. As an example my eldest daughter maintained the highest grade average of any student in her highschool for all 4 years she attended the school. She received 11 awards at graduation that amounted to approximately $26000. That kid made many sacrifices as she grew up to achieve those results. Sometimes to the point where I feared she was suffering socially but I supported her drive and determination. Today she is an editor of a magazine and will be enrolling her daughter into private school soon to further her learning opportunities. As far as nobody caring about kids that have to pay their way through school. See Robert F. Smith story where he committed to paying for the entire 2019 graduation class student loans at Morehouse. Rare eg I know, but there are people who care.

 

[SteveA]

The linemaen will not get paid as well as playmakers EVER....Guys that score points should get paid higher...QB's, WR's And RB's do that. To a lesser extent TE's...

It's like in sales ...The salesman get paid top dollar and support staff gets stiffed. Sad to say I make 4-5 X what my support staff makes becasue I bring in all the $$$$. They do ALL THE WORK.

I GET THE GLORY AND MAKE ALL THE $$$$...My job is to get people to say yes, and I do that alot.....

 

[stevielee]

The linemaen will not get paid as well as playmakers EVER....Guys that score points should get paid higher...QB's, WR's And RB's do that. To a lesser extent TE's...

It's like in sales ...The salesman get paid top dollar and support staff gets stiffed. Sad to say I make 4-5 X what my support staff makes becasue I bring in all the $$$$. They do ALL THE WORK.

I GET THE GLORY AND MAKE ALL THE $$$$...My job is to get people to say yes, and I do that alot.....

Can you talk to Tomlin and see if he'll stop using the 2D line set.

Sent from my VS988 using Steeler Nation mobile app

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

Jarvis Jones was never in the weight room at 5 am.. Please,,,

 

[Drink IRON City]

Really. Ok. I will draft Sequon Barkley and you can have the kicker. Running backs don't have value because of the CBA not because of their importance to the game. The belief is because of the nature of the game you are better off with a rookie with nothing on the cap and no tread on the tires than an experienced pro in the prime of his career, but soon to drop off. And there isn't one other position like that. No one goes oh I know he is a top 5 receiver but I'm not going to re sign him. I will go cheap and draft. Ever. The contact a lineman receives is literally nothing compared to a running back. It's one yard apart. Running back contact is two freight trains colliding.
As far as the 6-10 million, do you short change yourself at your job? Who the **** does in this game. Did Ben Roethlisberger take less because he wanted to win a championship?

Tommy B*y does......................... Oh wait, maybe





Salute the nation

 

[SteelerSask2]

Ok, since you're kinda changing the narrative on the point I was making, I'll bite. The Steelers did fine replacing Bell with his backup, but missed the playoffs because Boswell went from one of the best kickers in the league to one of the worst.

Of course the point I was making is each position has a limit on earning potential. The best kickers in the league will still always be paid lower than every other starting position other than long snapper and punter. It is what it is.

Here is the narrative. When the CBA treated the drafted player the same as the veteran and hold outs by rookies and massive rookie contracts were the rule the Running Back held a certain position. Probably right behind the qb in pay. So under the new CBA the club holds the cards on the player. He gets a slotted contract really no way to negotiate around it. Which I agree is fine. The thing is most players appreciate in value because of experience. Problem is that experience at running back means huge wear and tear. So while everyone knows a tackle makes more than a guard and a corner makes more than a safety. The player can still make full bank on the second contract. At running back you play your 4 years and then its franchise tag. You take the full risk because it isn't even close to the guarenteed money the receiver gets. Then you are a free agent. Jerome Bettis would have been completely ****** over in this system.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Then the contracts and salaries should come into better line with reality. The absurdity exists, in part, because teams looked for ways to "manipulate" the cap.

The other thing is players want guaranteed money. You know who else does - me.

If your ego demands that you be the highest paid player at your position then don't sign contracts longer than one or two years. That's what bugs me and most other people, guys want guaranteed money but then ***** and sulk when someone else gets paid more in a year or two. That said, NFL contracts are pretty one-sided because a team can cut someone any time. They should have a hard cap and guaranteed contracts IMO.

Jarvis Jones was never in the weight room at 5 am.. Please,,,

I don't think he was in there at 5 pm either. ^^^Post Of The Week^^^

 

[SteelerFan448]

Here is the narrative. When the CBA treated the drafted player the same as the veteran and hold outs by rookies and massive rookie contracts were the rule the Running Back held a certain position. Probably right behind the qb in pay. So under the new CBA the club holds the cards on the player. He gets a slotted contract really no way to negotiate around it. Which I agree is fine. The thing is most players appreciate in value because of experience. Problem is that experience at running back means huge wear and tear. So while everyone knows a tackle makes more than a guard and a corner makes more than a safety. The player can still make full bank on the second contract. At running back you play your 4 years and then its franchise tag. You take the full risk because it isn't even close to the guarenteed money the receiver gets. Then you are a free agent. Jerome Bettis would have been completely ****** over in this system.

When the previous CBA was signed the offenses weren't quite as passing focused as they are today either. An ILB wasn't a premium position back then and now we had two being selected in the top 10 and running backs aren't first-round locks like they used to be. They could go back to the old rules and teams still wouldn't cave to give running backs big money.

 

[SteelerSask2]

Elliot averages 20 Carrie's a game and has 135 receptions in his career. I think he is pretty important to them. If they had to choose between paying a unproven first round back huge money or a four year back with a great track record, they are going with the vet.

 

[Stryker]

Elliot averages 20 Carrie's a game and has 135 receptions in his career. I think he is pretty important to them. If they had to choose between paying a unproven first round back huge money or a four year back with a great track record, they are going with the vet.

The other thing the Cowboys have to manage, is do they want to keep Dak, their franchise QB? That's what makes this decision tough.

 

[Vader]

In today's NFL I'd never break the bank for any RB. Which is why the Steelers should have traded Bell 2 years ago. There are too many good RBs coming out of college to deprive the rest of the team of skilled players in order to pay them. Having said that I hope Dallas pays him $30 million a season.

 

[Stryker]

In today's NFL I'd never break the bank for any RB. Which is why the Steelers should have traded Bell 2 years ago. There are too many good RBs coming out of college to deprive the rest of the team of skilled players in order to pay them. Having said that I hope Dallas pays him $30 million a season.

A bad move not making the franchise tag non exclusive. That was a failure.

 

[Drink IRON City]

A bad move not making the franchise tag non exclusive. That was a failure.

VERY true Cope. I know the STEELERS fully thought, in good faith, LeMEon would negotiate in real. Turns out bell bucked the system and the STEELERS were left holding the bag.

In hind sight I'm sure the STEELERS regret the tag designation but in the end, it's over and he is gone and NOW we are more of a team without the distractions.

I also agree that RB isn't the high $$$coin$$$ it once was. I know Bell was a very good talent but we also witnessed what a fresh drafted RB can do as well. I think with the "pass" NFL of today, the pure RB p[osition has waned away.


Salute the nation