Left tackle. Free agency and the draft.

[deljzc]

All I have to say is I trust Munchak. What he has done since he's been here is ******* amazing.

Everything is better. Consistency, pass blocking, run blocking. I know you guys don't think so, but we're even healthier. The week-to-week lineup has been very consistent the last two years. Not a lot of ingame injuries and mixing/matching/moving guys around. I think in like 12-13 games this year, the 5 that started played every snap. And if they didn't it was very minor (a couple of snaps at most). That tells me guys are in the right spots and staying off the ground.

We'll know early if they make a decision to get out of Pouncey (have to decide before March 12th or something). I doubt it.

I think they let Foster and Beachum test free agency but leave the door open for their return at a Steelers type number.

Villanueva just shows how good Munchak is. He's developed him into a very good asset for this team. A potential cheap starter (not a pro-bowler, but good enough) or a very good swing backup. Villanueva was even playing some 6th lineman/TE stuff early in the year before Beachum got hurt.

I think the team needs more depth (just in case), but they still have Adams floating around. They still have Wallace (whose experience only helped). They'll draft a guy. Let free agency play out with Foster/Beachum. Maybe replace Foster in free agency if he moves on at the price the Steelers want to pay and that's that.

 

[F83]

villinueva knee bend is to poor to contain the edge, esp in a div where the top rushers are dunlap suggs, dumervill, upshaw, jhonson, kruger, and next year, I would watch out for nate orchard as I see the clowns to rotate mingo and orchard on both sides. The denver games should that big val, is to slow off the snap, and lacks the knee bend that beachum has to stay low vs these top end pass rushers who can get low and then just twist or bull rush.
Beachum has only gotton better since becoming the starter as swell as add mass, we don't run as often to the strong as to the left, unless they are counters with pouncey and DeCastro pulling. It is more zone read and off tackle with bell, but he can just run any run call.
Back to the LT Beachum gives Ben more time to operate out of the 4 wide and if ben flanks bell/Williams. Villinueva as a starter and letting Beachum walk I would not do, I think Beachum is not worth Lane Jhonson money but more so in the 5.5-6.5 avg per year
5 years 28 mill 6 mill sb max 33 million 8 mill SB.
Foster is a decent but nothing nor replacable, stuggles vs speed penetrating under DT's. If Foster wants to much I would try getting wesley jhonson back from the jets.
Lock up Beachum, re sign Big Val avg vet 2 year deal 2.8, lock DeCastro, ask Pouncey, Ben, Mitchell to take base salary pay cuts , so a possible extension can be worked with Timmons, Then DB's Gay 3 years 5.7 mill, Boyken 2 years 2.5 mill
With Big val on increased from min you can run unbalanced lines for some power run calls or set a good PA for a deep pass to Bryant or Coates.

 

[stillwright]

villinueva knee bend is to poor to contain the edge, esp in a div where the top rushers are dunlap suggs, dumervill, upshaw, jhonson, kruger, and next year, I would watch out for nate orchard as I see the clowns to rotate mingo and orchard on both sides. The denver games should that big val, is to slow off the snap, and lacks the knee bend that beachum has to stay low vs these top end pass rushers who can get low and then just twist or bull rush.
Beachum has only gotton better since becoming the starter as swell as add mass, we don't run as often to the strong as to the left, unless they are counters with pouncey and DeCastro pulling. It is more zone read and off tackle with bell, but he can just run any run call.
Back to the LT Beachum gives Ben more time to operate out of the 4 wide and if ben flanks bell/Williams. Villinueva as a starter and letting Beachum walk I would not do, I think Beachum is not worth Lane Jhonson money but more so in the 5.5-6.5 avg per year
5 years 28 mill 6 mill sb max 33 million 8 mill SB.
Foster is a decent but nothing nor replacable, stuggles vs speed penetrating under DT's. If Foster wants to much I would try getting wesley jhonson back from the jets.
Lock up Beachum, re sign Big Val avg vet 2 year deal 2.8, lock DeCastro, ask Pouncey, Ben, Mitchell to take base salary pay cuts , so a possible extension can be worked with Timmons, Then DB's Gay 3 years 5.7 mill, Boyken 2 years 2.5 mill
With Big val on increased from min you can run unbalanced lines for some power run calls or set a good PA for a deep pass to Bryant or Coates.

I think Beachum will sign for a one year deal before taking this contract. Which is the way I see it folding out anyways....

 

[antdrewjosh]

Only on here and with fans is Pouncey even considered to be let go or traded. Rooney has already said he isn't going anywhere and they expect the same All-Pro when he gets back..

 

[stillwright]

Only on here and with fans is Pouncey even considered to be let go or traded. Rooney has already said he isn't going anywhere and they expect the same All-Pro when he gets back..

Well he isn't going anywhere that is for sure(cap hit). It still doesn't mean he wasn't over paid and isn't a tad over rated.

 

[SteelerFan448]

I'm not as sold on Villanueva as the rest of you... if he was an average guy and didn't have the story he has, he would be getting roasted here. Lets call a spade a spade, he is at best a try-hard backup right now... much like Wallace... Beachum is much better. I think with a year of tape we will see more breakdowns like we did later in the year if we go into next season with him as the starter... yes he is very raw at the position, but that does not mean he will certainly get better either... I think shoring up LT is a must in case the guy doesn't improve and takes a step back... its too important a position to leave it up to a guy who's claim to fame is a really nice backstory with good size, but a rather mediocre statistical season. If anything his tendency to allow speed rushers to get behind him helped in the run game , as the Steelers used that to their advantage often when rushing over LT... a scheme I am not sure will hold up next year...

I like the guys potential... I really don't like his play right now, and I don't want Ben hurt on a stupid sack he gives up because we went cheap and inexperienced at one of the Key offensive positions...

Which player present the better production to performance value moving forward? Is Beachum at a big payday better for the team than Villanueva making the minimum and providing them with the flexibility to add other players, whether it is keeping Foster or adding a FA? I would love for the Steelers to retain Beachum, but I'm not sure if they do and I can understand why from the financial point of view.

 

[F83]

ok lets retain beachum 1 yr, either fa lg or foster back at vet avg cash, lock up DeCastro, then add 1 CB add SS Weddle while drafting a long term replacement for gay and weddle ala Cravens.
Retain Boykin and let him and Golsen duel out for the nickel job loser comes in plays when we go 6 DB's.

if retaining Beachum on a 1 yr deal, should help with shedding some of the dead cap money paying woodley @ Troy, ask ben, pouncey and mitchell the only high paid guys to take a pay cuts and space out the money after Decastro extension for a 2-4 year extension for Timmons and then whats left over offer Bell a extension or wait n tag him by then more cap money should open up, with nothing - little left on the books for troy and woodley.
FA CB Sean Smith,
Leon hall (would fit the price and be better than blake) Hall has cashed in already best years behind but short term can offer 1-2 good years), would cost likely 1/2 of what Sean Smith will command, a qtr of what Josh Normsn is going to ask for.
Prince Amukamara iffy.

 

[swal75]

villinueva knee bend is to poor to contain the edge, esp in a div where the top rushers are dunlap suggs, dumervill, upshaw, jhonson, kruger, and next year, I would watch out for nate orchard as I see the clowns to rotate mingo and orchard on both sides. The denver games should that big val, is to slow off the snap, and lacks the knee bend that beachum has to stay low vs these top end pass rushers who can get low and then just twist or bull rush.
Beachum has only gotton better since becoming the starter as swell as add mass, we don't run as often to the strong as to the left, unless they are counters with pouncey and DeCastro pulling. It is more zone read and off tackle with bell, but he can just run any run call.
Back to the LT Beachum gives Ben more time to operate out of the 4 wide and if ben flanks bell/Williams. Villinueva as a starter and letting Beachum walk I would not do, I think Beachum is not worth Lane Jhonson money but more so in the 5.5-6.5 avg per year
5 years 28 mill 6 mill sb max 33 million 8 mill SB.
Foster is a decent but nothing nor replacable, stuggles vs speed penetrating under DT's. If Foster wants to much I would try getting wesley jhonson back from the jets.
Lock up Beachum, re sign Big Val avg vet 2 year deal 2.8, lock DeCastro, ask Pouncey, Ben, Mitchell to take base salary pay cuts , so a possible extension can be worked with Timmons, Then DB's Gay 3 years 5.7 mill, Boyken 2 years 2.5 mill
With Big val on increased from min you can run unbalanced lines for some power run calls or set a good PA for a deep pass to Bryant or Coates.

Your contact figures are way off. Boykin ain't signing for 1.25m. That's basically the vet minimum. Gay will get something like 3-4M/year. I doubt Beachum would sign such a long and low deal either. Beachum's move is to sign a 1 year deal for 5-6M. Or perhaps a 2 year deal with a very large fictitious second year(10M+) so we can prorate a 1 year salary spread over 2 seasons.

 

[antdrewjosh]

Well he isn't going anywhere that is for sure(cap hit). It still doesn't mean he wasn't over paid and isn't a tad over rated.

Like I said only on here and by fans is he considered over rated and most of the nonsense stems from him wearing a hat

 

[Vincent]

Gay is our best corner. WTF would we move him to Safety for? I swear, do some of you people even think before you post?

21 doesn't think. He emotes.

 

[Steel Vanguard]

Like the rest of the Vets in here, I'm all about Allejandro. I hope he stays there 10 years.

 

[madinsomniac]

Like the rest of the Vets in here, I'm all about Allejandro. I hope he stays there 10 years.

Right but you are basing that off of him being an Army Ranger, not his performance. Its like a SEC guy rooting for an SEC player... its not football based... its fandom from something else. the guy seems like a hard worker and he is very much improving, but he still isn't the guy you want starting on this offense with this QB right now.

Beachum has a weird body type. his torso doesn't match his arms and legs. His technique is sound, and he has ample leverage, but teams will shy away from him due to the injury and that he isn't 7'8 inches tall or whatever their prototype for that position is these days... The way I see it you cannot afford to skimp at the second most important position on offense and fill it with a raw guy who had a pretty mediocre close to the season. If Beachum isn't resigned you still have to bring someone else in unless you somehow believe that Adams is suddenly going to be a good LT.

 

[stillwright]

Like I said only on here and by fans is he considered over rated and most of the nonsense stems from him wearing a hat

Well the truth be told us fans watch him week in and week out.....that is when he plays anyways. Half his career seems to have been on the side line. That said he is able to get to the next level blocking with the best of them but seems to be pushed around just as much as his replacements have.

 

[antdrewjosh]

Well the truth be told us fans watch him week in and week out.....that is when he plays anyways. Half his career seems to have been on the side line. That said he is able to get to the next level blocking with the best of them but seems to be pushed around just as much as his replacements have.

Well the only guy I remember giving him trouble was Haloti and he does have about 40 pounds on Pouncey and is almost just as quick..

 

[slashsteel]

Right but you are basing that off of him being an Army Ranger, not his performance. Its like a SEC guy rooting for an SEC player... its not football based... its fandom from something else. the guy seems like a hard worker and he is very much improving, but he still isn't the guy you want starting on this offense with this QB right now.

Beachum has a weird body type. his torso doesn't match his arms and legs. His technique is sound, and he has ample leverage, but teams will shy away from him due to the injury and that he isn't 7'8 inches tall or whatever their prototype for that position is these days... The way I see it you cannot afford to skimp at the second most important position on offense and fill it with a raw guy who had a pretty mediocre close to the season. If Beachum isn't resigned you still have to bring someone else in unless you somehow believe that Adams is suddenly going to be a good LT.

Yeah they need two capable experienced vets no matter how you slice it

I am pulling for Allejandro as well, but not sure he doesn't need help at LT at times still.... maybe he will continue to improve. But let the Steelers be smart about it just in case he doesn't.

I would prefer Beachum or a LT brought in for competition.

 

[slashsteel]

Only on here and with fans is Pouncey even considered to be let go or traded. Rooney has already said he isn't going anywhere and they expect the same All-Pro when he gets back..

yeah with the trade this player or that player

besides a extra kicker, you don't trade away someone worthwhile


you try to build depth not trade it away

 

[Steel Vanguard]

yeah with the trade this player or that player

besides a extra kicker, you don't trade away someone worthwhile


you try to build depth not trade it away

I'd trade Bryant if I could get a 1st for him. I like Coates enough that the risk of a Bryant meltdown vs the reward of two 1st rounders is an easy decision for me. We could really stock that defense this year with a premium pass rusher and a playmaker for the secondary.

 

[SteelerFan448]

I'd trade Bryant if I could get a 1st for him. I like Coates enough that the risk of a Bryant meltdown vs the reward of two 1st rounders is an easy decision for me. We could really stock that defense this year with a premium pass rusher and a playmaker for the secondary.

This isn't a move that a team that is favored to win the Super Bowl next season makes. This leaves you with Brown, a marginal No. 2 in Wheaton, a depth guy in DHB (if re-signed) and a relative unknown with questionable hands in Coates.

 

[Steel Vanguard]

This isn't a move that a team that is favored to win the Super Bowl next season makes. This leaves you with Brown, a marginal No. 2 in Wheaton, a depth guy in DHB (if re-signed) and a relative unknown with questionable hands in Coates.

We didn't get bounced from the playoffs because of our offense.

 

[slashsteel]

We didn't get bounced from the playoffs because of our offense.

Well actually they did. As that final opportunity they failed to convert a 3rd and a 4th down.


It wasn't the only reason, but hey let us get rid of the WR who filled in well with Antonio out.

 

[SteelerFan448]

We didn't get bounced from the playoffs because of our offense.

So you want to weaken your best unit by removing a significant piece that has to be replaced either through the draft or free agency. Got it.

 

[Ghost of Frenchy Fuqua]

Interesting item about Mike Adams not being an unrestricted free agent because he missed all of this past season:

http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.co...kle-depth-could-be-solved-due-to-little-known

 

[madinsomniac]

http://football-players.pointafter....utm_campaign=ao.sp.fb.dt.9431#32-Tyson-Alualu

Going to put this here (might be copied from the end of the article...

Going solely on the AV ratings of players, this site redrafts every year. Interesting that 3 players rated first round picks from the 2010 draft class the Steelers obtained that year... Brown, Sanders, and Pouncey, and Pounceys value actually has him drafted at 13... and that's with a penalty for his injury issues...

I have long said many Steelers fans don't understand the value of draft picks contributions to a team ... or how frequently they actually bust for every team. there is some misconception here that we are a bad drafting team lately, when we overall are fairly average with a higher than normal ability to find elite guys later or even undrafted. In a previous one of these our first round pick was projected to be Nate Washington over Heath Miller... Washington has had a great career and we got him undrafted... A first rounder isn't a surefire pro bowler... a second or third rounder isn't assured to see a second contract with a given team... much less become a starter...


The draft is a highly flawed system of determining who will work out or not, complicated by constantly changing variables, like talent levels of drafts, and compounded by the ability (or lack thereof) of a staff to develop players at each position...

There is no guarantee if the steelers drafted the top 4 CBs coming out that any of them will contribute this year or ever... something to think about when deciding to advocate dumping talent like some do...

 

[obxsteeler]

Our biggest problem as a Board is to demand instant results from high draft choices - especially when we rarely draft in the top 15.

 

[Coryea]

Which player present the better production to performance value moving forward? Is Beachum at a big payday better for the team than Villanueva making the minimum and providing them with the flexibility to add other players, whether it is keeping Foster or adding a FA? I would love for the Steelers to retain Beachum, but I'm not sure if they do and I can understand why from the financial point of view.

That's the difficult part, especially with the attention that needs to be paid to the Secondary as well. Also no one knows how well Beachum is going to be coming of that knee injury. I think if they think Munchak can really improve Al in the offseason, they will let Beachum go and test the market, if he doesn't get alot of interest and Foster does, Beachum may be back as our LG.