Jarvis Jones- One sack, one forced fumble
- Thread starter Bigappleyinzer
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Which one? They went through 3 LTs. However, Jarvis' sack came on an inside stunt where he bull rushed the Center into the backfield. The Center, Chris Watt is a second year player who has played in 16 games and started 8.
Or was that the pass that fell just short of Gates because of the pressure? I remember Gates just barely missing a catch because the ball hit the ground just in front of him because Rivers under threw the pass due to pressure.
Papillon
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Jarvis now on pace for 3 sacks this year which would be a career best.
Career sacks
Jarvis 4
Dupree 3
Career sacks
Jarvis 4
Dupree 3
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I need to see more.
At least we can now have this discussion. Sacks, forced fumbles. We will take all of that
It's about damn time.
I hope for Jarvis' sake he can build on this, if for no other reason than people shut the **** up about him. I am so sick of the wah, wahing over Jarvis Jones. Has there been a Dri Archer thread in a while?
Ninjaskrzypek
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There was a play where his pressure caused Rivers to under throw or mistime a throw.
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How is that much better? How good were any of the Steelers OL 8 games into their careers?
Pouncey was considered one of the best 8 games into his career. And, it's not 8 games into Watt's career, it's 16 games he's played in over the first 21 games of his career, with 8 starts. This is his second year. He's not a rookie. The Chargers made him their starting Center. Not because of injury, but based upon their belief that he was their "Starting Center". So, if he was out there as the #1, that's what Jarvis bull rushed into the QB ... The Chargers starting Center. And a player who was a hell of a lot better than what we trotted out at Center last night too.
Jarvis was feeling great that game... I heard he hooked up with Teo's "dead" girlfriend's sister
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No, Chris Watt only played 29/76 snaps out of position at LG because of the injuries to the left side of their line. He was rotating with J.D. Walton, another C, at LG. Career backup Trevor Robinson has been playing C for them for three weeks now.
I stand corrected. Their depth chart had Watt as the starting center. So, you're saying Robinson is a veteran center ... my point would be that if someone bullrushed our career backup center into the QB, the story line would be that our career backup center had his *** handed to him. Not "well so and so only got the sack because it was our second/third team center."
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My initial argument was that Jarvis benefited from the pass rush of his peers which forced Rivers to walk up into the pocket where Jarvis was engaged with Robinson.
According to the PFF stats (the source I used for the snap counts), Jarvis had 1 Sack, 2 Hurries.
Harrison: 1 Hit, 7 Hurries
Dupree: 1 Sack
Moats: -
Jones: 1 Sack, 2 Hurries
Heyward: 2 Hits, 9 Hurries
Tuitt: 1 Hurry
Spence: 3 Hurries
Timmons: -
Our OLBs have all basically rotated about an even amount of snaps the past few weeks, though overall Harrison and Dupree have played more snaps than Moats and Jones on the season.
Jones got a sack that he was simply in the right place for, in my opinion. Overall, Harrison and Heyward had the largest impact in the pass rush, both engaged with the same group of backups and players out of position.
Jarvis had a game exactly like he used to in college. He'd be in the right place for splash plays and legitimately make one or two on top of that, so he jumps out at you on the stat sheet or in hindsight. The reality is that there are others in the front seven doing more and more consistently, just not getting the splash play recognition.
If Jarvis has one sack and one strip every week I'll be thrilled.
We disagree. I saw, and see when I rewatch the play, Jarvis bull rush caused the sack. It's not like he was just sitting on the edge and Rivers got flushed to him. He bullrushed/walked the Center back and then reached out and pulled Rivers down. That's unlike any of the sacks that we've seen from Jarvis in the past; be it college or the NFL.
And from the stats you provide, Jarvis tied for the lead in sacks this game and had the second most hurries out of our OLBs.
And as Steelerfan81 said, a sack and a strip? I'll take it. If, as you say, it's caused by someone else's pressure ... I'll take that too. But this time it wasn't. That sack was Jarvis Jones dominating the man in front of him and registering a sack.
Its funny you mention that because during the game when it happened I kept wishing that James was 1/2 step quicker or faster whichever he would need. He was right there, but Rivers made a couple nice throws.
Papillon
I'm sorry, but you seem to be working extremely hard not to give credit where credit is due. Sacks are often the result of several players doing their job (pushing the pocket etc.) yet only with Jarvis Jones do people mentally deduct the sack from him and give it to someone else.
A comment was made after the Pats game that was absolutely spot on --- the board was really excited that Bud Dupree chased down Brady for a sack but if that had been Jarvis Jones the same people would have called it a Gildong sack and given credit to other players.
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I'll give you Pouncey but the rest weren't close to good. And as has been mentioned Watt wasn't the center anyway. Also the entire left side of their OL were playing their first game together. Again, you give excuses for Steeler players (like waiting 3 years for Jones whose played in a ton of games) but think an OL like SD is suppose to be good because "He's started 8 games".
I don't give excuses for anyone. What I stated is actually a point made often by those who bash Jarvis with a passion. If a player is placed on the field as a starter, you expect at least average professional level production from them. So, since the Chargers put those guys on the field, I suspect that they felt they would get at least average production from them. Does it always happen. No, of course not. But, I'm sure that's the expectation.
So, in the case of Jarvis v. whomever the Chargers put at Center, OT or G ... He beat the guy that was in front of him. Bull rushed the **** out of him as a matter of fact and made a sack. Against a player that the Chargers expected would give them adequate protection for their QB. That's it .. that's all .. at least for me.
I'm not saying this one sack makes Jarvis the second coming of LT. In fact, I'm pretty disappointed that he only has one sack on the year. And, you will see that disappointment reflected in the game thread; where, at the time Jarvis made his sack, I stated: "Blind squirrel .... meet nut." But, just because I'm disappointed with his overall production, doesn't mean that I'm going to discount or pooh pah EVERY play that the guy makes. Nor does it mean that I will make obviously false statements like "he only got the sack because of pressure applied by others."
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Nobody expects a backup to play like a starter. That's coach speak and nobody believes it. Vick isn't 10000th the QB Ben is right now. Asking him or expecting him to do the same thing is ignorant and the reason why Haley doesn't use him like Ben. Asking a backup center to play LT and some other nobody to play LG (or however they did it) doesn't mean they can get the job done.
Jones has two moves. Run around the end or bull rush. That's it. It's good to see him finally touch the QB but it is still against a backup. It is what it is. He's ok against sub par players. He doesn't do well against real NFL starters not guys playing out of position and that are backups. He didn't dominant the backups. He got 1 sack when the QB stepped up. Ok? I expect a bit more than 1 sack in 5 games for a #1 draft pick.
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Not really, no, I'm trying to give credit to the other players that did more in the pass rush department. I saw a comment along the lines of, "Jarvis had a sack, but what did sack leader Tuitt do? What about Harrison and Heyward? Nothing".
Jarvis showed up on the "official" stat sheet, but the impact of Harrison and Heyward was far greater overall. And I did give him credit for the forced fumble, that was a nice wrap up and he punched the ball out. I just don't like the misconception that Jarvis worked his *** off for a sack and James/Cam did nothing.
I didn't say he only got the sack because of the pressure of others, I said he benefited from it. I didn't see him walk the center back, it looked to me like they were engaged and having a stalemate and Rivers stepped up into his grasp. He still held on and made the play, it's just not like he blew his man up and made the sack.
^Yeah, exactly.