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How Talented is Steeler Defense?

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21STEELERS21

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Everyone wants to hang the coaches, but how talented is the Steeler defense really. We have
1 Pro Bowler, not like the 4 or 5 we had on some of the better Steeler defenses. 2 rookies (Watt & Hilton)
3 second year players (Burns, Davis, Hargrove). Williams a first year starter and Spence (grabbed off the couch)
as our inside linebackers.

Really only 3 seasoned vets as starters: Haden, Heyward, Tuitt. The way Mitchel played he doesn't count.

To me the 2017 defense made some strides, but is still a work in progress. Don't think Butler has the talent or experience level
that other coordinators have had to work with.
 
21STEELERS21 said:
Everyone wants to hang the coaches, but how talented is the Steeler defense really. We have
1 Pro Bowler, not like the 4 or 5 we had on some of the better Steeler defenses. 2 rookies (Watt & Hilton)
3 second year players (Burns, Davis, Hargrove). Williams a first year starter and Spence (grabbed off the couch)
as our inside linebackers.

Really only 3 seasoned vets as starters: Haden, Heyward, Tuitt. The way Mitchel played he doesn't count.

To me the 2017 defense made some strides, but is still a work in progress. Don't think Butler has the talent or experience level
that other coordinators have had to work with.
Click to expand...

Who is responsible for developing players? Heyward and Tuitt were invisible against the Jags. Did they forget how to play overnight or did the scheme not work and make them ineffective? How many drafts have we focused on defense under Tomlin aand what is the outcome? The proof is in the pudding.
 
I do not think their D is that talented and i have seen a drop off in evaluation. Whats the common denominator? I cannot believe the Colbert has all of a sudden forgot how to evaluate and draft
 
21STEELERS21 said:
Everyone wants to hang the coaches, but how talented is the Steeler defense really. We have
1 Pro Bowler, not like the 4 or 5 we had on some of the better Steeler defenses. 2 rookies (Watt & Hilton)
3 second year players (Burns, Davis, Hargrove). Williams a first year starter and Spence (grabbed off the couch)
as our inside linebackers.

Really only 3 seasoned vets as starters: Haden, Heyward, Tuitt. The way Mitchel played he doesn't count.

To me the 2017 defense made some strides, but is still a work in progress. Don't think Butler has the talent or experience level
that other coordinators have had to work with.
Click to expand...


How talented is New England's defense? Where are their Pro Bowlers? Yet their coaching staff still gets enough out of them to put forth a respectable performance when it counts. Enough excuses for these imbeciles. A second-grader knows you don't leave Gronk in single coverage when the money is on the line. How many times did Brady connect with Gronk on that final drive. They looked completely LOST vs Jacksonville. The same Jacksonville team that struggled to put up 10 points against Buffalo just a week earlier. And you want to keep these bums?
 
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The D does have some talent. The D schemes are ridiculous.

LeBeau had Big Snack in the middle to stop the run and collapse the pocket on the pass (not necessarily to get sacks). Butler/Tomlin have NO ONE in the middle. That is one HUGE problem.
 
the only adjustment I saw was after qrt 1 Aluala replaced Hargrave at NT, Heyward, and Tuitt just got pushed around, there was no exotic blitzes.
 
They need to get Vita the NT for Washington.
 
Bigsteel said:
How talented is New England's defense? Where are their Pro Bowlers? Yet their coaching staff still gets enough out of them to put forth a respectable performance when it counts. Enough excuses for these imbeciles. A second-grader knows you don't leave Gronk in single coverage when the money is on the line. How many times did Brady connect with Gronk on that final drive. They looked completely LOST vs Jacksonville. The same Jacksonville team that struggled to put up 10 points against Buffalo just a week earlier. And you want to keep these bums?
Click to expand...

Yep. They win with just any ole body. They're just that good. They have a magic book of xoxoxo. It's amazing. Yeah can you fathom that...10 frigging points vs the bills at home. Amazing stuff.
 
Burns, Davis and Hargrave all regressed in their second year. Dupree regressed as well. I don’t think Gay has a place in the NFL anymore. Williams and Mitchell should be reserve players.

Hilton was a pleasant surprise and Watt contributed but seemed to fade late in the year.
 
The ONLY true playmaker, difference maker on the defense was Shazier.

Nobody else has shown anything to keep their jobs safe. They are all replaceable.
 
Troglodyte said:
Burns, Davis and Hargrave all regressed in their second year. Dupree regressed as well. I don’t think Gay has a place in the NFL anymore. Williams and Mitchell should be reserve players.

Hilton was a pleasant surprise and Watt contributed but seemed to fade late in the year.
Click to expand...

I would look to move Gay to Safety, he doesn't have the speed to cover as a corner, but with his experience and knowledge I bet he would make a solid safety for a few more years.
 
When I talk about talent, I think about pedigree, raw athletic ability, size/speed/etc relative to the best at one's position. We have some freakishly athletic players. For instance, Bud Dupree is 275 lbs of solid muscle and runs like the wind, but accomplishes nothing. Every starter is a 3rd round pick or above except V Williams. There is raw talent all over this defense. But aside from Heyward and Shazier, none of these guys are better players than they were as rookies. They are NOT BEING DEVELOPED.
 
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Hargrave left the game as his back was bothering him. I think that was a factor with his play most of the year. Like Dupree, he didn't seem to improve this year.
 
If you look back a lot of Steelers took quite awhile to develop. It took Ike Taylor 5 years to become a decent CB. Harrison
didn't start until he was 28/29.

If they draft IL and FS in the first 2 rounds in the draft, they could start the year next year with 8 defensive starters at 3 years or less.
The Pats defensive starters this year average over 6 years of experience and they finished the year ranked 28th.
 
Steeler Pride said:
I would look to move Gay to Safety, he doesn't have the speed to cover as a corner, but with his experience and knowledge I bet he would make a solid safety for a few more years.
Click to expand...

I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s running a sub 4.8 forty. Sometimes experience isn’t enough.
 
F83 said:
the only adjustment I saw was after qrt 1 Aluala replaced Hargrave at NT, Heyward, and Tuitt just got pushed around, there was no exotic blitzes.
Click to expand...

They were planning on saving the good stuff for NE the following week. They were cocky and thought they could just play with a half assed plan so they wouldn't tip their hands and let NE see things.

How well did that work out?
 
I think playing favorites with the defensive coaching staff - (I'm looking at you, Joey Porter) - hurts more than helps the team.

While it's great that former players are getting an opportunity to learn their craft, I think they're too close to the players.
 
21STEELERS21 said:
If you look back a lot of Steelers took quite awhile to develop. It took Ike Taylor 5 years to become a decent CB. Harrison
didn't start until he was 28/29.

If they draft IL and FS in the first 2 rounds in the draft, they could start the year next year with 8 defensive starters at 3 years or less.
The Pats defensive starters this year average over 6 years of experience and they finished the year ranked 28th.
Click to expand...

The problems with Tomlin's defenses are ongoing (regardless of the experience). Experience is not an excuse. NE has 9 more years of experience than the Steelers (combined) on their defense. That is less than 1 year of experience per player. New England coaching staff consistently gets the most out of their players when it counts. Any coaching staff that allows continuous single coverage on Gronk to lose the game and allows 38 points to the Jaguars anemic offense does not deserve to be coaching in the NFL. I won't even mention the many other times Tomlin defenses have been throttled when it counts.
 
WE have over rated this defense. Our positions on defense lack something because we have seen very little improvement against the run as well secondary desire to tackle or play any consistency of man coverage. No leaders on defense and to many games lack luster energy on third downs to get off the field. Tomlin has to much influence on Butler and is obvious why he got rid of Lebau.
 
On a 1-10 scale

DL: 8. Very good overall and with some depth. NT/DT is an issue.

10. Heyward - All-Pro

5 Hargrave, a part-time player. Can't play the run

7.5 Tuitt - When healthy I think he's very good. Needs to be more consistent

Top Reserve:

6. Alualu - A quality reserve who could start.


LB: 8 with Shazier, 6 without him. Depth is an issue here, and with Shazier out, we lost our coverage underneath.

7 Watt. Had a very good rookie year as a pass rusher, coverage man, and run stopper.

5.5 Williams - Good with Shazier in our system. Without him, he's limited and too slow.

4. Spence - Might not even make the team next season. Small, and slow.

5.5. Dupree - Very inconsistent as a pass rusher, limited vs the run.

Top Reserves:

5.5 Chickillo - A solid reserve type. Better than Dupree on some weeks..

5 Fort. I like what I saw in pass coverage. Limited vs. the run

4.5 Dirty Red. More of a special teams player. Too slow on D


DB:

7 Burns - A solid coverage man with excellent hands, Burns is sometimes is a little soft vs. the run

7.5 Haden. A very good player. Our best corner

5.5 Davis - Too many mental mistakes, and blown plays. Not very good in coverage either. Best on the Blitz or in the box.

4 Mithcell - Had a terrible season, and he's bulletin board material. Likely replaced next season.

Top Reserves:

7 Hilton - A excellent 3rd corner

5.5^ - Sutton, looked pretty good for a rookie with limited experienced. Might rate higher next season.


The loss of Shazier hurt. He was our Most valuable player, and a key to pass coverage. A true three-down type of impact player. Without him, the defense is just better than average,

I think we are two good players away from having the type of defense we expect and they need to be a Saftey and Inside Linebacker. An NT who can stay on the field would also be a nice plus And Dupree and Tuitt need to stay healthy and play close to their potential.
 
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coolshark said:
I do not think their D is that talented and i have seen a drop off in evaluation. Whats the common denominator? I cannot believe the Colbert has all of a sudden forgot how to evaluate and draft
Click to expand...

I think Colbert possibly has a hard time evaluating in response to the current trend of the league.

Offense seems to be catching on.
But our defensive philosophy may have worked a decade ago. Now pass happy dink and dunk teams give us fits.
 
Our defense was pretty good this year until Shazier went out. Every one on here ******* about not getting pressure on the qb, but I believe we led the league in sacks this year.
 
It is also an indictment on the coaches that removing ONE PLAYER from your defense completely handicaps it. I'm sorry but a defensive scheme and roster should be strong enough that you don't look like two entirely different teams just because your best player went out. Not saying it should have 0 impact, but you shouldn't look completely inept at any and all things having to do with defending just because one guy is absent
 
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