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Harrison

black and gold apex said:
Jones may have out played James in first three years but he still shows no desire, he would rather play basketball in his own words.
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I have never heard him say this; however I am NOT disputing you with it. The only reason I bring it up -- quite frankly James Harrison is a once in a generation player.

Although you do have to remember, he almost quit on football to drive trucks. So there is a maturity thing in there.

Fact is -- Harrison had ALL THE ALTHETIC TALENT NECESSARY to play in the NFL right away. He simply did not understand how to play at that level. Sitting the bench, practice squadding it, getting cut, getting one last chance and that start in 2004 showed he could play.

His work ethic became top 5% of all time, that's why he still can do what he does. Harrison was a Hall of Fame player if only he "got it" earlier in his career. He developed over time and just got more dominant. Despite an impressive stat line in 2007 -- he wasn't a dominant LB all year long, but in spots. The all year long came in 2008. Since then, his work ethic is incredible and he'll sacrifice, out work, out prepare, out train 99% of the league.

Jarvis probably doesn't have that same desire, but heck, neither did Porter or Lloyd by comparison!
 
Lets pull for James to get THREE MORE FULL SACKS so to own the official Steelers all time Sack record -- 74.5 to Jason Gildon at 77.
 
3 more sacks? damn i didn't know he was so close. I think he's going to get it.
 
FSF said:
I have never heard him say this; however I am NOT disputing you with it. The only reason I bring it up -- quite frankly James Harrison is a once in a generation player.

Although you do have to remember, he almost quit on football to drive trucks. So there is a maturity thing in there.

Fact is -- Harrison had ALL THE ALTHETIC TALENT NECESSARY to play in the NFL right away. He simply did not understand how to play at that level. Sitting the bench, practice squadding it, getting cut, getting one last chance and that start in 2004 showed he could play.

His work ethic became top 5% of all time, that's why he still can do what he does. Harrison was a Hall of Fame player if only he "got it" earlier in his career. He developed over time and just got more dominant. Despite an impressive stat line in 2007 -- he wasn't a dominant LB all year long, but in spots. The all year long came in 2008. Since then, his work ethic is incredible and he'll sacrifice, out work, out prepare, out train 99% of the league.

Jarvis probably doesn't have that same desire, but heck, neither did Porter or Lloyd by comparison!
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Lloyd's knees betrayed him.
 
He'll get those sacks in the last couple games of the season. It's only right for him to be ahead of Gildon...each player at his peak, Harrison was a far better pass rusher.
 
4 games to get 3 sacks. He only had two sacks going into last week. Hope he can pull it off.
 
obxsteeler said:
Jones has outplayed Harrison in his first 3 years. Be patient.
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Do you mean compared to Harrison's first three years? Well, let's see:

Harrison: 32 games, 7 starts: 4 sacks, 72 tackles, 18 assists, 1 INT for 25 yards, 2 fumble recoveries 1 TD, 6 pass defenses
Jones: 32 games, 22 starts: 5 sacks, 51 tackles, 31 assists, 1 INT for 5 yards, 2 fumble recoveries, 5 pass defenses
 
Steel G said:
Do you mean compared to Harrison's first three years? Well, let's see:

Harrison: 32 games, 7 starts: 4 sacks, 72 tackles, 18 assists, 1 INT for 25 yards, 2 fumble recoveries 1 TD, 6 pass defenses
Jones: 32 games, 22 starts: 5 sacks, 51 tackles, 31 assists, 1 INT for 5 yards, 2 fumble recoveries, 5 pass defenses
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To be fair, Harrison's first three years are:
17 games 1 sack 45 tackles 9 assists 0 Int 0 FF 1 FR for a TD 2 PDs I'm not sure if he had any starts in 2002-2004, so the tackles project very well, though I assume most are special teams tackles from those years.
 
Lets pull for James to get THREE MORE FULL SACKS so to own the official Steelers all time Sack record -- 74.5 to Jason Gildon at 77.
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Amen.

However, let me just point out that for all the **** he got, Gildon wasn't too shabby.

Secondly, in the end, it was Lloyd's ankle that ended his career if I remember correctly. The ankle and dreaded "staph infection."
 
Hines57 said:
4 games to get 3 sacks. He only had two sacks going into last week. Hope he can pull it off.
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You do realize we have left:

1. Andy Dalton
2. Brock Oswiler/Peyton Manning
3. Matt Schaub
4. Johnny Manziel

I see about six sacks for Silverback...
 
Cope said:
To be fair, Harrison's first three years are:
17 games 1 sack 45 tackles 9 assists 0 Int 0 FF 1 FR for a TD 2 PDs I'm not sure if he had any starts in 2002-2004, so the tackles project very well, though I assume most are special teams tackles from those years.
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http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HarrJa23.htm

He was not in the league in '03 so actually, to be fair, you can't count it. His first three years therefore are '02, '04 and '05. And yes, I'm sure there were special teams tackles in there for '04 and '05. He had 4 starts in '04, one for Porter (the Cleveland game were Joey got tossed for fighting during the warmups) and the last three subbing for Haggans.
 
wig said:
Secondly, in the end, it was Lloyd's ankle that ended his career if I remember correctly. The ankle and dreaded "staph infection."
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He blew out his knee in the first game of the season against Jacksonville. I think that was 1996. The ankle injury came just as he was rounding back into form in 1997. It didn't seem that major at first but the staph infection really ravaged the ankle. And didn't he miss most of his first two seasons with knee injuries too?
 
Steel G said:
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HarrJa23.htm

He was not in the league in '03 so actually, to be fair, you can't count it. His first three years therefore are '02, '04 and '05. And yes, I'm sure there were special teams tackles in there for '04 and '05. He had 4 starts in '04, one for Porter (the Cleveland game were Joey got tossed for fighting during the warmups) and the last three subbing for Haggans.
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To be accurate -- he couldn't make an active roster in 2003. An accurate comparison is from when you enter the league and what you do from day 1.
 
To be the most accurate, he was on the Ravens roster in 03 and was allocated to the Rein Fire NFL Europe. He's still in the NFL system playing in training camps, so it works against him in his first 3 years if he fails to make a roster.
 
Cope said:
To be the most accurate, he was on the Ravens roster in 03 and was allocated to the Rein Fire NFL Europe. He's still in the NFL system playing in training camps, so it works against him in his first 3 years if he fails to make a roster.
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How about just compairing his year three to Jarvis Jones' year three???




Salute the nation
 
Cope said:
To be the most accurate, he was on the Ravens roster in 03 and was allocated to the Rein Fire NFL Europe. He's still in the NFL system playing in training camps, so it works against him in his first 3 years if he fails to make a roster.
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Well, to be the most accurate, he wasn't signed by the Ravens in '03 till late in the season, which is how he wound up with the Rein Fire. And let's also not forget we are comparing an undrafted rookie to a first round pick.
 
On the subject of the Steelers and outside linebackers:

A Jehovah's Witness knocked on our door recently. He looked like an ex-athlete - tall, black, physically fit, etc.

I talked to him for a while. Very friendly guy. I asked him if he knew, or knew of, Jason Worilds. He said yes. I asked him what he thought about Worilds retiring this year to work as a Jehovah's Witness.

His response: "I admire him for that. But I think he'll be back in the NFL next season."

Interesting. I hadn't read a word about him - and his Twitter acount is inactive - since March.

I wonder if the Steelers have kept in touch in him? If this guy is saying that, maybe it's known in NFL circles that Worilds might come back. He had become a pretty good player by the time he walked away.
 
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Cope said:
How about comparing this year to this year?
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I agree, but many were trying the "FIRST 3 yrs" syndrone. JAMES is a beast and has been showing it as of late. For jones, he seems to be coming on a little too. Currently, I take Harrison, hands down!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




Salute the nation
 
Cope said:
How about comparing this year to this year?
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How about not comparing at all. Fact is the only LBs in team history that are in Harrison's league are Greg Lloyd, Jack Ham and Jack Lambert -- in my book only injuries and shorter career prevents #92 & #95 from the Hall of Fame

So you really have to go through Andy Russell, Levon Kirkland, James Farrior, Jason Gildon and Joey Porter first, Jones still has to prove he can play as good as Timmons or even Woodley during his nice run.
 
Does anyone remember the game against the gayvens, where he absolutely took over the game???? Until jones can turn in a performance of that nature and then some, he isn't even in the same conversation.



Salute the nation
 
To be the most most most accurate #92 is one bad dude, and I'm still mad that someone let him go to the bungles. His passion is what fans crave. He doesn't take plays off and he wants to win more than anyone else out there.
 
He will get va Baltimore
 
Jones will never have the motivation that Harrison has and had. Comparison years to Jones doesn't even come into the conversation, high draft choice, shown no talent for this position.
 
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