any of us could have written this article

[steelhurt]

Coryea is correct imo! Ben never had the power of who stays and who goes. Now if you want to suggest Ben had his preferences and made it known what his preferences were, ok I can buy into that but no way was it you better hire this guy or fire that guy. Ben is like most of us in that he has or had his comfort zones and of course he felt comfortable with Bruce Ariens and Randy Fitchner but on the other hand a Todd Haley was an unknown to him and would think he may have had some anxiety there. Hell, we're all like that in our jobs so why would Ben be any different?

 

[Coryea]

Coryea is correct imo! Ben never had the power of who stays and who goes. Now if you want to suggest Ben had his preferences and made it known what his preferences were, ok I can buy into that but no way was it you better hire this guy or fire that guy. Ben is like most of us in that he has or had his comfort zones and of course he felt comfortable with Bruce Ariens and Randy Fitchner but on the other hand a Todd Haley was an unknown to him and would think he may have had some anxiety there. Hell, we're all like that in our jobs so why would Ben be any different?

also, don't forget, Fichtner was Tomlin's very first hire here as head coach. He and Randy are old friends that coached together in college, so Fichtner was a Tomlin guys from the start, not a Ben guy.

 

[steelhurt]

I've said before that Kevin and Cowher worked so well together with the draft and bringing in FA's. I remember when Jerome became a FA in Pittsburgh and he got a call from Coach Cowher telling him not to do anything that they wanted him back in Pittsburgh. That call didn't come from Kevin meaning Bill had more input than people think at the time. Not suggesting that Colbert didn't but that Cowher had as much input. Notice the FA acquisitions when Cowher and Colbert worked together? Much better wasn't it?
The last several years they've been a train wreck and they have Tomlin's stamp all over them. The TE they signed from the Chargers who was damaged goods, Butterfingers Moncrief, Eric Ebron who was pretty much worthless save for a handful of plays, Joe Haeg, Turnstile Trai Turner, Dwayne Haskins, and there is more. Then the trades: TE Nick Vennet, Joe Shoebert, Vance McDonald, etc.
The time to move on from Tomlin was after the Jacksonville playoff loss and there were those minority owners that felt the same but Rooney intervened.

 

[steelhurt]

Let me please reiterate that there is no hate from me toward Tomlin as someone had suggested. I just can't continue to have any hope that things will get better. Will I support him? Of course I will. As long as he remains the HC of this football team I will support him and I will give him accolades when he deserves them but I will be critical when he deserves it as we all should do. I just think what he's selling has gotten very stale and we keep chasing our tails every year. He trots out the same BS defense every year and thinks it will work even though its been figured out years ago. Hell, we've been running the same defense since Patrick Mahomes was in grade school and he fricking shredded it apart now the last three times we've faced him. Time for a change at least hire a DC from the outside with his own ideas and concepts rather than most likely promoting Austin to run the same crap again.

 

[Steelr4evr]

Well after the Tebow game he had consecutive 8-8 seasons 2012, 2013. Not to mention the worst start in 2013. Didn’t he go like 0-4 or something to start the season. Watching the Steelers compared to other teams. There is a lack of coaching. The Steelers always look like a free for all backyard ball. When you watch teams like the Bills, Patriots, Buccaneers, Chiefs. There seems to be more organization, more dynamic and opportunities for big plays. You don’t see that with the Steelers.

I call those teams well oiled machines. The Steelers looked like they dropped a ball bearing in the engine before they crank it up.

They almost never looked polished. We now know gameplans come from a magic 8 Ball.


The Steelers staff plays checkers, while real tactician coaches play chess.


Don't hate the man at all. I just hate his performance as the HC. Coach speak doesn't win championships.

 

[Ike Kelly]

First of all chum I do not hate Mike Tomlin. I don’t know the man personally so it’s harsh to say I hate him. Do I think he’s a good coach? I think he’s an average coach that has helped assemble an average football team that produces average results. If you’re ok with that fine, but I’m not.
He rolls out the same outdated defense every game this past year and frankly since he’s been here.
Brings back a 39 year old QB to play behind a rag tag OL and an OC where play calling can be called questionable at the very least. Canada is in over his head and that’s what Tomlin promoted. If buddy Butler retires, same old same old with Tereyl Austin being promoted from within. I didn’t say Austin was an initial internal hire, I said he will be promoted to DC if. Butler retires. That will be a promotion from within.
All you want to do is poke holes in my assessment which is based on what I see, what I actually know, and what I feel. I know for a fact he has great input and final approval on all player personnel so I don’t really care what the **** you think.
You’re happy with this guy,have at it but don’t spew your BS to me. This coach will never,ever get this team to another super bowl. We now have the worst talent in the division so enjoy looking up from the cellar with your beloved Tomlin.

I’m all for people having opinions. I have no problem with it. In fact I applaud them. That’s what the Board is for, casual or articulate discussion of all things football, specifically PIT football. However, when individuals create facts rather than resourcing them to mortar their opinions that’s where the discussion doesn’t hold water. I’m not poking holes in your opinion, I am asking for factual reference to your assertion regarding who makes decisions regarding players. You say “based on what I see, what I know and what I feel”….that you know for a fact Tomlin has great input (note you originally said - final input).

Of course the HC has great input, but Steelers HC doesn’t have the final say. It’s a tripartite review of HC, GM and Art2/owner. A collaboration of the three. It always has been all the way back to 69 with Dan, Chuck Noll and Art Jr. In fact Dan fired his brother because Art disagreed that collaboration between scouts and coaches should continue (mid 80s).

i never said you should give a flip as to what I think, I wouldn't want you to either. All I am saying if you opine something that Is factual, you might want to make sure it is.

 

[Ike Kelly]

That guy Machine Gun Kelly or Ozark Ike likes to come on here and spew his condescending rhetoric like he knows it all.
Don’t tell me I hate someone that I’ve never even met. As a matter of fact I actually think he may be a pretty nice guy and intelligent as well but I don’t believe he is or has ever been the right guy for this job. We continue to chase our tail year in and year out and get nowhere.
And I’ll add one other fact whether he wants to believe this or not. It was Tomlin who went after Bush thinking he was going to be their QB of the defense. That was as HIS GUY!

Its not difficult to know the name, it’s right there next to the icon. If you don’t like someone not agreeing with you don’t get butthurt about it. Describing me as condescending is hilarious as your disdain for Tomlin or any coach on his staff you don’t like is in every thread regardless of the topic. This board in its many versions in the late 90s wanted Chin’s head on a platter many, many times, because he couldn’t get over the hump, played Martyball, and whatever adverse issue occurred. He chased his tail a whole lot as well. As for Tomlin picking Bush, I liked the pick at the time, They needed another 50 in the middle. Jury is still out on him one year removed from ACL. But Pouncey, DeCastro, Heyward, Shazier, Minkah you wouldn't say those were Tomlin picks would you?

 

[Ike Kelly]

To be fair, Teryl Austin's times at DC he has fielded some of the worst defenses in the league statistically. Just throwing that out there.

I don't think everyone minds internal hires if the person has a great resume. What people want is someone established that has shown they've fielded a good defense or offense.

Tomlin is giving opportunities to people who haven't really earned them. Which leads people to question, why? Does Tomlin really want to win at all costs? Or does he want to win HIS way. There is no doubt, it's the latter.

You aren’t wrong about Austin’s DET defenses AT ALL. He didn’t have much to work with either. Then again, the whole franchise has been a catastrophe for years. Neither side of the ball can peak the same year in forever. However, the fact that he has been a coordinator is definitely a plus in any qualification for such a position.

 

[Drink IRON City]

You aren’t wrong about Austin’s DET defenses AT ALL. He didn’t have much to work with either. Then again, the whole franchise has been a catastrophe for years. Neither side of the ball can peak the same year in forever. However, the fact that he has been a coordinator is definitely a plus in any qualification for such a position.

I hear yaz Ike but what you said about Detroit could very well be said about our STEELERS. Our front office may be a little more stable but our on field product is struggling and that is why many here are asking for external hires.



Salute the nation

 

[steelhurt]

I’m all for people having opinions. I have no problem with it. In fact I applaud them. That’s what the Board is for, casual or articulate discussion of all things football, specifically PIT football. However, when individuals create facts rather than resourcing them to mortar their opinions that’s where the discussion doesn’t hold water. I’m not poking holes in your opinion, I am asking for factual reference to your assertion regarding who makes decisions regarding players. You say “based on what I see, what I know and what I feel”….that you know for a fact Tomlin has great input (note you originally said - final input).

Of course the HC has great input, but Steelers HC doesn’t have the final say. It’s a tripartite review of HC, GM and Art2/owner. A collaboration of the three. It always has been all the way back to 69 with Dan, Chuck Noll and Art Jr. In fact Dan fired his brother because Art disagreed that collaboration between scouts and coaches should continue (mid 80s).

i never said you should give a flip as to what I think, I wouldn't want you to either. All I am saying if you opine something that Is factual, you might want to make sure it is.

No one created facts here rather than resource them to mortar their opinions as you say. You don't know me, you don't know what I may know but you assume that I'm just creating facts. You're opinion! To clarify I stand by what I said, final input. You want to be a right fighter which obviously you appear be, have at it. Tomlin has final input and I know that as fact and I'm not going any further with it.
Art II doesn't know anywhere near what his father and grandfather knew, period. Art II is strictly a businessman first and foremost. Unlike Dan who did make final decisions even when his dad was alive, Art II is not in that same mindset. Therefore he relies on his GM and HC whereas Tomlin makes the final decision on who to draft and who to pursue in FA. Kevin of course scouts as does Tomlin and attends the combine like Tomlin and the scouts but trust me, Tomlin gives the final approval. When Dan was alive and healthy this was not the case. It was a Dan, Colbert and Cowher collaboration but when Art II took over, things changed. At first when Tomlin got to Pittsburgh and Dan was running the show it was Dan, Kevin and Tomlin, but as Dan's health declined and Art II started taking control, it was more Kevin and Tomlin. The last several years it has been both Colbert and Tomlin but Tomlin having the final approval. Now of course when it comes to FA Art II has to sign off on the money that's obvious but Its who Tomlin wants to pursue. This team has Tomlin's handprint all over it.

 

[steelhurt]

Its not difficult to know the name, it’s right there next to the icon. If you don’t like someone not agreeing with you don’t get butthurt about it. Describing me as condescending is hilarious as your disdain for Tomlin or any coach on his staff you don’t like is in every thread regardless of the topic. This board in its many versions in the late 90s wanted Chin’s head on a platter many, many times, because he couldn’t get over the hump, played Martyball, and whatever adverse issue occurred. He chased his tail a whole lot as well. As for Tomlin picking Bush, I liked the pick at the time, They needed another 50 in the middle. Jury is still out on him one year removed from ACL. But Pouncey, DeCastro, Heyward, Shazier, Minkah you wouldn't say those were Tomlin picks would you?

One again, I don't hate nor do I dislike Tomlin. What part of this do you not understand? What the hell does Bill Cowher have to do with this conversation I ask? I'm talking about Tomlin who has now been coach for 15 seasons and yes had early success but from 2011 thru 2021 think about that now, that is eleven seasons we've had one AFC championship game and got creamed by the Tomlin's nemesis Belicheck. In that 11 year period not only did he have a franchise QB but generational talent in LevBell and AB, and some other outstanding talent in Heath Miller, Martavus Bryant, Mike Wallace, Emmanuel Sanders, Pouncey, DE Castro, Al Villanueva, Ramon Foster. Defensively Troy, Shazier, Cam, Tuitt, Haden. etc. Its either we made the playoffs and got beat in the first round or didn't make the playoffs at all. One AFC championship game in that eleven season period with all that talent and that is all he's got to show. Hell, there are rumblings in Dallas that Mike McCarthy may be shown the door after his one and done. That still remains to be seen and who knows what will happen in Arizona with Kingsbury after his one and done. I read a couple weeks ago he could be on shaky ground if they fall flat in the playoffs which they did. Point being these NFL owners are not like the Steeler owner who for the most part awards the coach a lifetime job. That is not smart and breeds complacency and mediocrity which we have now. Oh, I would be remiss if I failed to mention we haven't had any losing seasons though.
You're looking at Tomlin and this organization through foggy lenses and not seeing it for what it is. You don't have to agree with me, I really don't care but don't question someone's sources and where and how they got their information. Like I said, you know nothing about me. And you are wrong about every thread I post has disdain for Tomlin or his coaches. Some of them yes, all of them, BS.

 

[Gildong Sack]

Hey.....no apologies necessary. I agree with a lot of what you say. I have said many times on this board that I would have let Tomlin go after the Tebow game. As far as I was concerned he would never get them past a certain point. They haven’t. I have always given him the benefit of the doubt. Hoping he would prove me wrong. Defenders of Tomlin always like to show you his whole body of work....IE his career won lost record and competing teams. Then go on to say things like Look at Detroit,would you like to be their fan. Then of course they use their favorite word. Hater. No different if you have ....gasp...the audacity to criticize Ben. Hater. You are a hater. Lol.

They're like a cult. There is no reasoning with them it's as if they are all 12 year olds falling asleep in their bunk beds ogling a fathead of Ben and intoxicated by the thought of him...the fathead they got for Xmas 2005...

 

[Gildong Sack]

Its not difficult to know the name, it’s right there next to the icon. If you don’t like someone not agreeing with you don’t get butthurt about it. Describing me as condescending is hilarious as your disdain for Tomlin or any coach on his staff you don’t like is in every thread regardless of the topic. This board in its many versions in the late 90s wanted Chin’s head on a platter many, many times, because he couldn’t get over the hump, played Martyball, and whatever adverse issue occurred. He chased his tail a whole lot as well. As for Tomlin picking Bush, I liked the pick at the time, They needed another 50 in the middle. Jury is still out on him one year removed from ACL. But Pouncey, DeCastro, Heyward, Shazier, Minkah you wouldn't say those were Tomlin picks would you?

Lol..."Field goal Bill" they liked to call him. Now in revisionist history mode they talk of him like he's the second coming of Vince Lombardi... hilarious 😂

 

[madinsomniac]

I think Ben has been stubborn regarding OC's and coaches and has been running a more and more watered down version of the first Offense he ran with Whiz. He doesn't like change and has not seemed to be willing to do any thing different. The closest we got to a OC that actually helped him and was doing better was Haley and low and behold they couldn't get along and Ben basically said he goes or I go. Gotta wonder if he was willing to let someone truly coach him and get the best out of him what could have been. The fact that Ben is responsible for Fichtner becoming the OC that is very telling by itself.

Niether the Fitchner nor what we ran this year was anything close to the whiz offense… whiz’s offense used the erhardt blocking scheme, like most of the offenses under cowher ( actually all of them, I think)

Under tomlin/Arians we moved to a more passive blocking scheme more useful for pass blocking than run blocking… kind of what they had in indy with manning… Munch brought in aspects of the kubiak blocking scheme, I don’t really know how best to explain what Sarrett did to it… kind of a hybrid… we were definitely trying to reinstall a more aggressive blocking scheme this year at first, but I don’t really think we made any progress there

 

[slashsteel]

Lol..."Field goal Bill" they liked to call him. Now in revisionist history mode they talk of him like he's the second coming of Vince Lombardi... hilarious 😂

So you are dissing Cowher now? That gold jacket tells me other people thought he did a damn good job. Kept the team competitive despite not having a franchise QB until the end. Yeah pretty sure majority of Steeler fans don't view him on Lombardi's level. I don't mind wacky *** opinions to each and their own. But damn if that statement doesn't come across as trollish.

 

[Zack_of_Steel]

You know it's bad when- The Ravens, the Bengals and the Browns have all had playoff wins since our last playoff win.

Hey don't undersell it, we were the Browns' win.

 

[madinsomniac]

also, don't forget, Fichtner was Tomlin's very first hire here as head coach. He and Randy are old friends that coached together in college, so Fichtner was a Tomlin guys from the start, not a Ben guy.

Butler was a cowher hire but he too coached with Tomlin in college, and i think Danny Smith coached at his alma matter and also nrth Catholic back in the day… which is probably why his job is cemented for life

 

[madinsomniac]

Hey don't undersell it, we were the Browns' win.

Yesterday a browns player got arrested for running naked down the street… playoff win or not that franchise will always be a hundred times the embarrassment of any other franchise

 

[Gildong Sack]

So you are dissing Cowher now? That gold jacket tells me other people thought he did a damn good job. Kept the team competitive despite not having a franchise QB until the end. Yeah pretty sure majority of Steeler fans don't view him on Lombardi's level. I don't mind wacky *** opinions to each and their own. But damn if that statement doesn't come across as trollish.

Hey I love chin, but the whole "we would have won 3 more rings with him if he'd stayed" is ludicrous.

Cowher lost playoff and AFCCG games he should have won BEFORE Brady and Bellichick came into the league...imagine with his stubbornness the epic losses we would have had...LOL. The only reason I mention Lombardi is because that's the level of coach it would have taken to beat the Patriots of Ben's time.

I'm not being a troll. I'm just pointing out the lack of objectivity by posters here...I mean it's cult like in it's ignorance and worship of certain individuals. And condemnation of others. I.E. Cowher vs. Tomlin..when they both have similar results over roughly the same amount of years.
And Tomlin will wear a gold jacket as well.....and he is being dissed 10,000x times worse, but that's ok....right?

 

[Hines field]

Hey I love chin, but the whole "we would have won 3 more rings with him if he'd stayed" is ludicrous.

Cowher lost playoff and AFCCG games he should have won BEFORE Brady and Bellichick came into the league...imagine with his stubbornness the epic losses we would have had...LOL. The only reason I mention Lombardi is because that's the level of coach it would have taken to beat the Patriots of Ben's time.

I'm not being a troll. I'm just pointing out the lack of objectivity by posters here...I mean it's cult like in it's ignorance and worship of certain individuals. And condemnation of others. I.E. Cowher vs. Tomlin..when they both have similar results over roughly the same amount of years.
And Tomlin will wear a gold jacket as well.....and he is being dissed 10,000x times worse, but that's ok....right?

I do believe Cowher would have been more successful than he was with Ben in his prime. That is pretty much a no brainer. So to say that they have similar success while one has a 1st ballot HOF qb. And the other didn’t speaks volumes for who the better coach was. Was it a Guaranteed three more Super Bowls not necessarily. Though I guarantee it would not be 3 and 7 in the last 10 playoff games and no wins in over 5 years. If any coach is living off past success it is Tomlin. Let’s face any other franchise cuts bait years ago. We have not been a serious contender in the post season forever. People hated on cowher for being conservative, tied to not having a great QB. Though I would rather lose afc championship games than get blown the **** out in wildcard weekend when we do manage to sneak in.

 

[Coryea]

I do believe Cowher would have been more successful than he was with Ben in his prime. That is pretty much a no brainer. So to say that they have similar success while one has a 1st ballot HOF qb. And the other didn’t speaks volumes for who the better coach was. Was it a Guaranteed three more Super Bowls not necessarily. Though I guarantee it would not be 3 and 7 in the last 10 playoff games and no wins in over 5 years. If any coach is living off past success it is Tomlin. Let’s face any other franchise cuts bait years ago. We have not been a serious contender in the post season forever. People hated on cowher for being conservative, tied to not having a great QB. Though I would rather lose afc championship games than get blown the **** out in wildcard weekend when we do manage to sneak in.

Hell, Cowher made 4 AFCCG without Ben (2 in 3 seasons with Ben), Tomlin has made only 3 AFCCG with Ben

 

[Ike Kelly]

No one created facts here rather than resource them to mortar their opinions as you say. You don't know me, you don't know what I may know but you assume that I'm just creating facts. You're opinion! To clarify I stand by what I said, final input. You want to be a right fighter which obviously you appear be, have at it. Tomlin has final input and I know that as fact and I'm not going any further with it.
Art II doesn't know anywhere near what his father and grandfather knew, period. Art II is strictly a businessman first and foremost. Unlike Dan who did make final decisions even when his dad was alive, Art II is not in that same mindset. Therefore he relies on his GM and HC whereas Tomlin makes the final decision on who to draft and who to pursue in FA. Kevin of course scouts as does Tomlin and attends the combine like Tomlin and the scouts but trust me, Tomlin gives the final approval. When Dan was alive and healthy this was not the case. It was a Dan, Colbert and Cowher collaboration but when Art II took over, things changed. At first when Tomlin got to Pittsburgh and Dan was running the show it was Dan, Kevin and Tomlin, but as Dan's health declined and Art II started taking control, it was more Kevin and Tomlin. The last several years it has been both Colbert and Tomlin but Tomlin having the final approval. Now of course when it comes to FA Art II has to sign off on the money that's obvious but Its who Tomlin wants to pursue. This team has Tomlin's handprint all over it.

If you haven’t created the fact, prove it. Post the link or record that documents what you say is fact that “Tomlin has final say on personnel matter”. You won’t because there is none. Dale Lolley answered a Q&A session about this topic just a couple days ago. Colbert and Tomlin’s relationship regarding player decisions is exactly the same as it was with Colbert and Cowher. With Dan/Art2 being part of the decisions. So it’s your opinion. which I’ve already commented is perfectly fine. The whole purpose for this board. Some people will agree to disagree. To get defensive about your opinion is your problem, not mine.

As for your exclamation on me being a “right (rights?)“ fighter…WTH? What rights am I fighting? I just asked for a link to the resource you say is fact. Your opinions are yours, but to say Art2 “doesn't know anything near as to what his father or grandfather knew…” is ludicrous, as is that Art2 relies on his GM and HC to make final decisions, like he has no control. Completely ignorant reasoning. He’s the owner, yes majority owner at that and makes the final decision as he signs the checks. Any minority owner has no, (NONE) input over organization operations. Art2 grandfather, definitely did not know how to run the franchise as a winning one or his history behind it would have been different. Dan Rooney along with Noll turned the franchise into a successful one. Dan ran the show? Art2 took over all organizational matters from Dan in 2003. Sure, he discussed things with his father, as he was Emeritus, but Art2 “ran the show”. In fact Art2 was running things pretty smoothly when his father lived in Ireland as the appointed US Ambassador from 2009 through 2012. Art2 “has to sign off”….LOL, listen to that in your head. A owner that has to sign off to someone he hired. Your statements are your opinions, plain and simple. I agree to disagree with them as you can disagree with any opinion I or anyone else has. But when you inflect factual Into yours, you should have the resource to back it up.

 

[Ike Kelly]

One again, I don't hate nor do I dislike Tomlin. What part of this do you not understand? What the hell does Bill Cowher have to do with this conversation I ask? I'm talking about Tomlin who has now been coach for 15 seasons and yes had early success but from 2011 thru 2021 think about that now, that is eleven seasons we've had one AFC championship game and got creamed by the Tomlin's nemesis Belicheck. In that 11 year period not only did he have a franchise QB but generational talent in LevBell and AB, and some other outstanding talent in Heath Miller, Martavus Bryant, Mike Wallace, Emmanuel Sanders, Pouncey, DE Castro, Al Villanueva, Ramon Foster. Defensively Troy, Shazier, Cam, Tuitt, Haden. etc. Its either we made the playoffs and got beat in the first round or didn't make the playoffs at all. One AFC championship game in that eleven season period with all that talent and that is all he's got to show. Hell, there are rumblings in Dallas that Mike McCarthy may be shown the door after his one and done. That still remains to be seen and who knows what will happen in Arizona with Kingsbury after his one and done. I read a couple weeks ago he could be on shaky ground if they fall flat in the playoffs which they did. Point being these NFL owners are not like the Steeler owner who for the most part awards the coach a lifetime job. That is not smart and breeds complacency and mediocrity which we have now. Oh, I would be remiss if I failed to mention we haven't had any losing seasons though.
You're looking at Tomlin and this organization through foggy lenses and not seeing it for what it is. You don't have to agree with me, I really don't care but don't question someone's sources and where and how they got their information. Like I said, you know nothing about me. And you are wrong about every thread I post has disdain for Tomlin or his coaches. Some of them yes, all of them, BS.

Ok, you don’t hate Tomlin as a person, but you definitely don’t like him or is completely against him coaching the franchise. To say he’s failed from 2011 through 2021….so have 22 other clubs in that same span. In fact of the seven winning coaches, one is a three time winner in that timeframe and is a documented cheater. During that that period he had opportunities much more than not. More so than most other coaches besides the cheater.

I don’t look through foggy lenses, I have criticisms towards Tomlin just as much as I did towards Cowher. But I know throwing the baby out with the bath water mentality rarely fixes anything unless you start with a different mindset. Not unlike what Dan Rooney did in 68-69. Yes I disagree with you, respectful so, in regards to the HC situation. I don’t disagree changes are needed, OC in particularly. I didn’t like the hire to begin with, but I don’t pretend I can make decisions better than the professional.

 

[diver]

If you haven’t created the fact, prove it. Post the link or record that documents what you say is fact that “Tomlin has final say on personnel matter”. You won’t because there is none. Dale Lolley answered a Q&A session about this topic just a couple days ago. Colbert and Tomlin’s relationship regarding player decisions is exactly the same as it was with Colbert and Cowher. With Dan/Art2 being part of the decisions. So it’s your opinion. which I’ve already commented is perfectly fine. The whole purpose for this board. Some people will agree to disagree. To get defensive about your opinion is your problem, not mine.

As for your exclamation on me being a “right (rights?)“ fighter…WTH? What rights am I fighting? I just asked for a link to the resource you say is fact. Your opinions are yours, but to say Art2 “doesn't know anything near as to what his father or grandfather knew…” is ludicrous, as Is Art2 relies on his GM and HC to make final decisions, like he has no control. Completely ignorant reasoning. He’s the owner, yes majority owner at that and makes the final decision as he signs the checks. Any minority owner has no, (NONE) input over organization operations. Art2 grandfather, definitely did not know how to run the franchise as a winning one or his history behind would be different. Dan Rooney along with Noll turned the franchise into a successful one. Dan ran the show? Art2 took over all organizational matters from Dan in 2003. Sure, he discussed things with his father, as he was Emeritus, but Art2 “ran the show”. In fact Art2 was running things pretty smoothly when his father lived in Ireland as the appointed US Ambassador from 2009 through 2012. Art2 “has to sign off”….LOL, listen to that in your head. A owner that has to sign off to someone he hired. Your statements are your opinions, plain and simple. I agree to disagree with them as you can disagree with any opinion I or anyone else has. But when you inflect factual Into yours, you should have the resource to back it up.

One of the big problems is people take this stuff personally. Tomlin isn't just losing, he is losing with the intent of pissing people off.

Once people take this stuff personally it clouds judgement and opinions become fact in their minds.

Look, I think Tomlin should be fired. But I keep it to what I see on the field. I don't need to justify it with opinions, like he only won with a Cowher team, or his coaching tree isn't anything (my personal favorite...it's so damn stupid), or he is too much of a players coach or whatever.

Keep it to what we see. For the love, that should be enough.

 

[Coryea]

One of the big problems is people take this stuff personally. Tomlin isn't just losing, he is losing with the intent of pissing people off.

Once people take this stuff personally it clouds judgement and opinions become fact in their minds.

Look, I think Tomlin should be fired. But I keep it to what I see on the field. I don't need to justify it with opinions, like he only won with a Cowher team, or his coaching tree isn't anything (my personal favorite...it's so damn stupid), or he is too much of a players coach or whatever.

Keep it to what we see. For the love, that should be enough.

Of the 3 candidates, Tomlin was the guy I hoped they hired, but it's become painfully obvious that Tomlin is to stubborn and things have to be his way, there's lack of adjustments, lack of accountability, and hell just plain lack of game planning.