ABC cancels Roseanne Reboot.

[Steeltime]

I've made 3,450 posts on this site. Probably 3,350 of them are about the Steelers. So, no. I don't. You're just being an ******* and in typical fashion for posters on this forum, trying to discredit or insult the messenger to avoid the realities of the message.

Comments on this forum, dumbass. Why not break out the race card? It's probably time since you are out of facts.

Here found one, since you want to play dumb: https://www.politico.com/magazine/s...rump-johnstown-pennsylvania-supporters-215800

Oh, yeah, that article was clearly empathetic to Trump voters. Wow, all it did was explain how and why those voters should be heard and deserve the attention. Like this, for example:

All this, perhaps, is not so surprising, considering polling continues to show that—in spite of unprecedented unpopularity—nearly all people who voted for Trump would do it again. But as I compared this year’s answers to last year’s responses it seemed clear that the basis of people’s support had morphed. Johnstown voters do not intend to hold the president accountable for the nonnegotiable pledges he made to them. It’s not that the people who made Trump president have generously moved the goalposts for him. It’s that they have eliminated the goalposts altogether.

This reality ought to get the attention of anyone who thinks they will win in 2018 or 2020 by running against Trump’s record. His supporters here, it turns out, are energized by his bombast and his animus more than any actual accomplishments. For them, it’s evidently not what he’s doing so much as it is the people he’s fighting. Trump is simply and unceasingly angry on their behalf, battling the people who vex them the worst—“obstructionist” Democrats, uncooperative establishment Republicans, the media, Black Lives Matter protesters and NFL players (boy oh boy do they hate kneeling NFL players) whom they see as ungrateful, disrespectful millionaires.

And they love him for this.

Yeah, wow, how sycophantic. Did you even read the article?

 

[AggieSteel]

Comments on this forum, dumbass. Why not break out the race card? It's probably time since you are out of facts.

You're so ****** hostile man you really think I'm gonna waste my time going back and forth with you? Stop quoting me

 

[Steeltime]

You're so ****** hostile man you really think I'm gonna waste my time going back and forth with you? Stop quoting me

Here is what I wrote:

Really? Why don't you post a couple of them, highlighting the "empathy" the leftist media has for Trump voters.

If in fact you read the article and concluded that the author claimed victim status, or was looking for a "poor you," or was whining, you completely and totally misread the damn thing.

And this:

Still looking for those article "empathetic" to the Trump voters, Aggie. You seem to have found any number that parrot a common theme - Trump voters racist. Not much empathy there.

Further, you are obsessed with race. Read your posts. How many focus on race? 50%? More? I thereby declare irony in your assertion that Trump supporters focus on race - they seem to focus less on race than you do.

No hostility. Quite neutral in fact. I have read your posts for a few weeks on this forum, and accurately observed that you bring race into the discussion a significant percentage of the time. You don't even deny it. Race matters to you - a lot. You wrote:

I've made 3,450 posts on this site. Probably 3,350 of them are about the Steelers. So, no. I don't. You're just being an ******* and in typical fashion for posters on this forum, trying to discredit or insult the messenger to avoid the realities of the message.

I did no such thing. I pointed out that you made a claim, could not find support for your claim, and thereby your claim was not valid. You then post an article which is most certainly not "empathetic" to Trump voters and instead accuses them of "not holding the President accountable" and "removing the goalposts." The same article, by the by, just mentions in passing that Johnstown has lower unemployment than the year prior, and the coal mines seem to be ramping up.

But yeah, those idiot Trump voters are not holding him accountable and would vote for him again just because of how stupid they are. Sure. Whatever warms your coffee.

 

[AggieSteel]

Here is what I wrote:



And this:



No hostility. Quite neutral in fact. I have read your posts for a few weeks on this forum, and accurately observed that you bring race into the discussion a significant percentage of the time. You don't even deny it. Race matters to you - a lot. You wrote:



I did no such thing. I pointed out that you made a claim, could not find support for your claim, and thereby your claim was not valid. You then post an article which is most certainly not "empathetic" to Trump voters and instead accuses them of "not holding the President accountable" and "removing the goalposts." The same article, by the by, just mentions in passing that Johnstown has lower unemployment than the year prior, and the coal mines seem to be ramping up.

But yeah, those idiot Trump voters are not holding him accountable and would vote for him again just because of how stupid they are. Sure. Whatever warms your coffee.

You see things one way, I see them another, obviously


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[slashsteel]

I seen a turn around for the better in this country. not sure why people hate Trump so badly. Country isn't fixed but they are in a better position than they were with the last president.

 

[deljzc]

"Race" democrat is a political faction in this country that has been around since the 1960's. It has waxed and waned in power just like other sub-groups inside the general Left - Independent - Right political demographics. And of course some issues create circles that cross over each other (protectionism, unions, trade can sometimes bounce between left/right ideologies).

AggieSteel is a race democrat. He values the issues of race very highly. They are important to him. If a candidate is not ADDRESSING race, he is not doing his job in the eyes of AggieSteel. Racial issues are the root of many other issues he cares about.... economy, healthcare, social welfare/safety net programs, foreign relations, government spending, et. al. All go back or tie-into racial issues.

The problem is can he discuss politics with people that DON'T care about racial issues (or don't think they are that important) and not fall into the trap of then claiming the other person is racially ignorant or a downright bigot. While AggieSteel might see all (or most) political issue interwoven with race, many do not. Some choose to think they are separate issues and could be tackled with separate ideology.

We haven't had a race democrat here in a while. I'm not sure what Elfie is for sure. Tibs and Trog are really euro-socialist now (or at least debate that position). Most others have left.

We'll see if Aggie can stick around. I don't mind the positions, I just don't agree on a lot of them so far.

 

[AggieSteel]

AggieSteel is a race democrat. He values the issues of race very highly. They are important to him. If a candidate is not ADDRESSING race, he is not doing his job in the eyes of AggieSteel. Racial issues are the root of many other issues he cares about.... economy, healthcare, social welfare/safety net programs, foreign relations, government spending, et. al. All go back or tie-into racial issues.

Yes, although I wouldn't go so far as to say "at the root" I would say "a contributing factor in" .. but yes, thank you for understanding this without being a prick about it.

The problem is can he discuss politics with people that DON'T care about racial issues (or don't think they are that important) and not fall into the trap of then claiming the other person is racially ignorant or a downright bigot. While AggieSteel might see all (or most) political issue interwoven with race, many do not. Some choose to think they are separate issues and could be tackled with separate ideology..

I have political discussions off this board all the time pertaining to issues I have bolded, and rarely talk about race. Those are all very important issues to me. I've just noticed that it seems on this board, people get actively hostile and/or defensive when confronted with the idea that race may have contributed to a particular situation, and I want to bring the perspective that we don't have to deny it

 

[Steeltime]

I have political discussions off this board all the time pertaining to issues I have bolded, and rarely talk about race. Those are all very important issues to me. I've just noticed that it seems on this board, people get actively hostile and/or defensive when confronted with the idea that race may have contributed to a particular situation, and I want to bring the perspective that we don't have to deny it

If you think contributors on this forum get "defensive" or "hostile" when accused of racism, you really have not been here very long. That accusation is so common and empty that it is a punchline around here.

In fact, it's why I told you to play the race card - because it is so frequently played. It has become a joke.

 

[slashsteel]

If you think contributors on this forum get "defensive" or "hostile" when accused of racism, you really have not been here very long. That accusation is so common and empty that it is a punchline around here.

In fact, it's why I told you to play the race card - because it is so frequently played. It has become a joke.

Not just on the board but in America.

It is race baiting to get what I want type of mentality.

And the media loves them some controversy.

And some people love to buy into controversy.

However misguided it may be.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

I'm pointing out that there is another reason (racial resentment -- oops, forgot can't talk about that or else I'm obsessed) is a stronger predictor of Trump support than all the other factors that article touts. The article's title implies it can explain to us "how we got Trump" and ignored one of the biggest (if not THE biggest) factor. You say I'm obsessed, I say y'all's denying is strong. Again, just pointing out something y'all refuse to acknowledge

You are actually going to write for the world to see that Trump's support is about racial resentment?

And then say that the content of the article posted is NOT true??

 

[AggieSteel]

You are actually going to write for the world to see that Trump's support is about racial resentment?

And then say that the content of the article posted is NOT true??

So it’s me saying that, not data. Cool


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[deljzc]

Aggie,

I would contend that many voted for Trump because of LIBERAL resentment. But to you (and for much of America's history since 1960's) "liberal" and "race democrat" have become so interwoven, you are quick to say my liberal resentment (and I fully admit that is there) is also racial. I can assure you it is NOT about race to me. It might be about racial politics, which I think do not help minorities as much as you think or help the racial divisions in this country but it is absolutely NOT about race itself.

That is one of the hardest things for conservatives to convey to race liberals. Just because we are against the current logic of democrat race policies does NOT mean we are against your race, or want to see racial injustice or racial inequality or racial discrimination. That can't be further from the truth.

Because I believe in legal immigration, am against illegal immigration, want stronger (more secure) borders does NOT mean I hate or bigoted towards Mexicans. I actually want more legal Mexicans to come to this country based on a merit system of entry. I really do. Our country needs them. The economy needs them. Given the right support (legally) and infrastructure, Mexicans assimilate into the melting pot of American culture very well.

But illegal is illegal. Those here that broke the law is not fair to those that did it the correct way. The spots, services, jobs illegals take are spots, services, jobs that should be given to LEGAL immigrants. This whole system needs to be in the open and not under the table like it currently is. These are tenets I believe in regardless of my feelings about race and actually I think these issues are not about race at all and should be discussed that way.

But a race democrat will never see it that way. A race democrat will always assume that race plays a part in immigration discussions. A race democrat assumes racial stereotypes, racial bias, racial bigotry and racial discrimination is apart of every position a white man takes. That white are incapable of using color blind logic just to make a decision. EVERYTHING has bias in it now. And the media has been feeding you that narrative for the last 25 years (and it's growing).

I believe that suspicion of bias in EVERYTHING has completely destroyed our ability to talk logically about racial policies in this country. The concepts of "white privilege" and "inherent bias" and "subconscious stereotypes" has made anything I say (as a white man) inadmissible in the race debate and policy discussion in this country. You have been programs that unless I almost beg forgiveness for my "white privilege" and "bias", I can't even start to talk about race. It's almost like unless I become a race democrat, I can't TALK about race at all.

That is wrong. I want equality. I want the black family unit to improve (because I think THAT is the root of many of their social programs). I want the black to be proud of this country and feel it offers opportunity. I want equality in policing and punishment and prison sentences.

But I am also tired of the blame game. And the guilt game. And the retribution game. I just want equality and opportunity. What people ultimately DO with equality and opportunity is up to them.

 

[Hypocycloids]

Racial resentment? LOL. What will libtards think of next?

Voters in Pa., Wisc., Mich., Ohio, and wherever else who voted in a black man in two elections now have racial resentment because they voted for Trump? Riiiiight.

The election of Trump was the repudiation of Obama and his leftist policies/politics. It was time to get that **** outa here.

 

[AggieSteel]

Aggie,

I would contend that many voted for Trump because of LIBERAL resentment. But to you (and for much of America's history since 1960's) "liberal" and "race democrat" have become so interwoven, you are quick to say my liberal resentment (and I fully admit that is there) is also racial. I can assure you it is NOT about race to me. It might be about racial politics, which I think do not help minorities as much as you think or help the racial divisions in this country but it is absolutely NOT about race itself.

That is one of the hardest things for conservatives to convey to race liberals. Just because we are against the current logic of democrat race policies does NOT mean we are against your race, or want to see racial injustice or racial inequality or racial discrimination. That can't be further from the truth.

Because I believe in legal immigration, am against illegal immigration, want stronger (more secure) borders does NOT mean I hate or bigoted towards Mexicans. I actually want more legal Mexicans to come to this country based on a merit system of entry. I really do. Our country needs them. The economy needs them. Given the right support (legally) and infrastructure, Mexicans assimilate into the melting pot of American culture very well.

But illegal is illegal. Those here that broke the law is not fair to those that did it the correct way. The spots, services, jobs illegals take are spots, services, jobs that should be given to LEGAL immigrants. This whole system needs to be in the open and not under the table like it currently is. These are tenets I believe in regardless of my feelings about race and actually I think these issues are not about race at all and should be discussed that way.

But a race democrat will never see it that way. A race democrat will always assume that race plays a part in immigration discussions. A race democrat assumes racial stereotypes, racial bias, racial bigotry and racial discrimination is apart of every position a white man takes. That white are incapable of using color blind logic just to make a decision. EVERYTHING has bias in it now. And the media has been feeding you that narrative for the last 25 years (and it's growing).

I believe that suspicion of bias in EVERYTHING has completely destroyed our ability to talk logically about racial policies in this country. The concepts of "white privilege" and "inherent bias" and "subconscious stereotypes" has made anything I say (as a white man) inadmissible in the race debate and policy discussion in this country. You have been programs that unless I almost beg forgiveness for my "white privilege" and "bias", I can't even start to talk about race. It's almost like unless I become a race democrat, I can't TALK about race at all.

That is wrong. I want equality. I want the black family unit to improve (because I think THAT is the root of many of their social programs). I want the black to be proud of this country and feel it offers opportunity. I want equality in policing and punishment and prison sentences.

But I am also tired of the blame game. And the guilt game. And the retribution game. I just want equality and opportunity. What people ultimately DO with equality and opportunity is up to them.

I agree with you on a lot of things, trust me. I have no doubt that you and Tim and others on this board are more thoughtful and intelligent voters who have several issues you care about. I am not trying to paint a broad brush here. I have 100% certainty that the writer of that article was speaking with yours and Tim’s voices as well

All I’m saying is that if it purports to tell us “how we got Trump” that’s where it loses me. If it were “this is my opinion and others I know” then fine. But it’s not. And if it purports to tell me “how we got Trump” then the mistake the writer made, and that you and Tim make, is projecting your reasons and your thoughtful voting strategy on to the other 63 million people who voted. I didn’t conduct those studies. Smarter people than any of us did. No “libtards” “made them up” it’s just pure facts. The data says what it says. So to tell a long, drawn-out story about “how we got Trump” in an article without mentioning that he appeals to some of the darker sides of people’s nature is just being dishonest and biased. Even if it speaks to you personally, which I have no doubt that it does.

Maybe if the title were more “why I voted for Trump” or something like that, I wouldn’t have even responded at all


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[Tim Steelersfan]

So it’s me saying that, not data. Cool


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I'm quite aware you are saying it. And shocked. Shocked after the article says it's people like you, who've been conditioned by the growing Alt Left movement, to call everyone you disagree with a racist. It's gotten so bad that if someone is elected in this country that's not Alt Left, they are racist, or it is because of racism, or both.

And you admit freely that is what you think as well.

From the article that you think is bullshit, yet you embody it...

The other, the left, believes America is racist and oppressive and yearns for some form of socialism...

The left has dominated cultural institutions...for decades and has used that domination to convince itself and others that conservatives aren’t simply wrong but bigoted and vicious...

You are a product of that.

I'm not a racist. I don't see racism in everyone I disagree with. As Steeltime has been pointing out, it appears it's you who is racist, just as so many on the Left are really the ones guilty of this claim.

Kinda hard to have discussions with you going forward when you've self admittedly thrown everyone you disagree with into the racist bucket.

You'll get along GREAT with Elfie.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

I am not trying to paint a broad brush here.

Yet you painted with the biggest and broadest brush of all...

Trump got to office because of racial resentment is the broadest brush you can make. You just "generalized" and "stereotyped" 50% of America.

Remember that lecture about generalizing and stereotyping in the American Jews v Israelis debate and you insisting you like to look beyond these labels and have a discussion on merits? Yeah, about that.

 

[deljzc]

I agree with you on a lot of things, trust me. I have no doubt that you and Tim and others on this board are more thoughtful and intelligent voters who have several issues you care about. I am not trying to paint a broad brush here. I have 100% certainty that the writer of that article was speaking with yours and Tim’s voices as well

All I’m saying is that if it purports to tell us “how we got Trump” that’s where it loses me. If it were “this is my opinion and others I know” then fine. But it’s not. And if it purports to tell me “how we got Trump” then the mistake the writer made, and that you and Tim make, is projecting your reasons and your thoughtful voting strategy on to the other 63 million people who voted. I didn’t conduct those studies. Smarter people than any of us did. No “libtards” “made them up” it’s just pure facts. The data says what it says. So to tell a long, drawn-out story about “how we got Trump” in an article without mentioning that he appeals to some of the darker sides of people’s nature is just being dishonest and biased. Even if it speaks to you personally, which I have no doubt that it does.

Maybe if the title were more “why I voted for Trump” or something like that, I wouldn’t have even responded at all


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I think you are confusing racial politics with race.

I know racial politics and the backlash against the "political correctness" and "white guilt" those politics have been pushing down America's throat help elect Trump.

But that is NOT racism. And there is where I have a huge disagreement with this growing divide in our country and the ongoing narrative of race the media has spewed the last 18 months since Trump's election. And believe me it is ALL over the place. NPR just got a new host for their "The Takeaway" (which I listen too at noon every day in my area). Here name is Tanzina Vega (after being named the permanent replacement to John Hockenberry who was accused and fired in the #metoo movement). She has talked about race CONSTANTLY and daily on her show since being named host in May. It is constant. And it is often in the context of "Trump America" (whatever the hell that means).

Everything about race now is in "Trump America", which is a term just created by the way and means NOTHING except in the dictionaries of liberal progressives.

It's these types of definitions, new terms, that I am rebelling against. Not your race or blacks or Mexicans or even Arabs.

If you want to take my disgust at the way race politics work, at the way progressives attack and degrade whites and our history in an attempt "even the score" or create equality as a sign I am racist, go ahead. It's frustrating to me because I try really hard not to let stereotypes (which exist) evolve in my mind into bigotry or hatred. And I try really, really hard not to discriminate or make any decision that would impact a black or brown person's livelihood or life legally (in the limited decisions I make about such things at my job). I talk about race with my kids. Encourage them to see everyone as equal and judge people by actions and achievements. To give everyone a chance and be open to experiencing different cultures.

But just because I hate racial politics and what sometimes comes out of the "racial" democrat's mouth (and those racial democrats elect to office) does not make me racist.

 

[AggieSteel]

I'm quite aware you are saying it. And shocked. Shocked after the article says it's people like you, who've been conditioned by the growing Alt Left movement, to call everyone you disagree with a racist. It's gotten so bad that if someone is elected in this country that's not Alt Left, they are racist, or it is because of racism, or both.

And you admit freely that is what you think as well.

From the article that you think is bullshit, yet you embody it...

The other, the left, believes America is racist and oppressive and yearns for some form of socialism...

The left has dominated cultural institutions...for decades and has used that domination to convince itself and others that conservatives aren’t simply wrong but bigoted and vicious...

You are a product of that.

I'm not a racist. I don't see racism in everyone I disagree with. As Steeltime has been pointing out, it appears it's you who is racist, just as so many on the Left are really the ones guilty of this claim.

Kinda hard to have discussions with you going forward when you've self admittedly thrown everyone you disagree with into the racist bucket.

You'll get along GREAT with Elfie.

Okay it's clear to me that both of you are misreading my posts. Are you doing it on purpose? I went OUT OF MY WAY to point out that thoughtful, intelligent voters like you and del have many issues you vote on. I just simply think an article claiming "how we got Trump" and leaving out racial resentment isn't telling the whole story, and is intentionally being dishonest. Does that mean "Tim and del are racists" no it does not. I'm here to talk with you guys, not sling insults and labels around on people. Why do you have to take it personally? Why do you insist on taking what you want to take out of my words?

Yet you painted with the biggest and broadest brush of all...

Trump got to office because of racial resentment is the broadest brush you can make. You just "generalized" and "stereotyped" 50% of America.

Remember that lecture about generalizing and stereotyping in the American Jews v Israelis debate and you insisting you like to look beyond these labels and have a discussion on merits? Yeah, about that.

Actually I didn't do that. I didn't say "all Trump voters" or "because of racial resentment" I said "one of if not the biggest factors" (the data backs me up there) and "if you don't mention it, you're not telling the whole story". Does that mean "Tim and del and other Steeler Nation posters are racist" ? No. Again, I'm not here to insult you guys, or anyone really. Anyone who thinks it's his or her job to go around calling other people racists is a lame to me. You're seeing intentions that are not there. But if an article wants to tell me there are a million and one reasons "why we got Trump" and not even mention that, then it's wrong. How can you not see the difference between what I'm actually saying, and what you're claiming I'm saying?

I think you are confusing racial politics with race.

I know racial politics and the backlash against the "political correctness" and "white guilt" those politics have been pushing down America's throat help elect Trump.

But that is NOT racism. And there is where I have a huge disagreement with this growing divide in our country and the ongoing narrative of race the media has spewed the last 18 months since Trump's election. And believe me it is ALL over the place. NPR just got a new host for their "The Takeaway" (which I listen too at noon every day in my area). Here name is Tanzina Vega (after being named the permanent replacement to John Hockenberry who was accused and fired in the #metoo movement). She has talked about race CONSTANTLY and daily on her show since being named host in May. It is constant. And it is often in the context of "Trump America" (whatever the hell that means).

Everything about race now is in "Trump America", which is a term just created by the way and means NOTHING except in the dictionaries of liberal progressives.

It's these types of definitions, new terms, that I am rebelling against. Not your race or blacks or Mexicans or even Arabs.

If you want to take my disgust at the way race politics work, at the way progressives attack and degrade whites and our history in an attempt "even the score" or create equality as a sign I am racist, go ahead. It's frustrating to me because I try really hard not to let stereotypes (which exist) evolve in my mind into bigotry or hatred. And I try really, really hard not to discriminate or make any decision that would impact a black or brown person's livelihood or life legally (in the limited decisions I make about such things at my job). I talk about race with my kids. Encourage them to see everyone as equal and judge people by actions and achievements. To give everyone a chance and be open to experiencing different cultures.

But just because I hate racial politics and what sometimes comes out of the "racial" democrat's mouth (and those racial democrats elect to office) does not make me racist.

I don't understand how this is a response to what I said to you. Did you read what I said? I made it very clear that I am not trying to be personal toward you or Tim (or anyone, for that matter) and that you guys are thoughtful voters. I did not call either of you racist, nor do I think that's a productive way to discuss anything at all. My argument is entirely with the article and it's completely leaving that factor out of the discussion when claiming "how we got Trump". I have no beef with "del" or "Tim" or whoever. Seriously, why are you taking this personally?

 

[CharlesDavenport]

I could not care less why liberals think Trump got elected. No amount of reason or evidence will make them realize that they are wrong on just about everything. As long as their policies are not getting implemented, I’m good.

 

[AggieSteel]

I could not care less why liberals think Trrump got elected. No amount of reason or evidence will make them realize that they are wrong on just about everything. As long as their policies are not getting implemented, I’m good.

The data came from survey responses from Trump voters. Not Al Gore sitting in his basement inventing stuff

 

[Supersteeler]

Aggie if I can try to help clear up your confusion a bit as to why people are taking it personally. I don't know that it's your intention (I actually don't have any idea what your intention is I guess), but your posts seem to be saying "Yeah I'm not saying you guys are racist, I never said that....and then immediately following that up by saying "......but the major reason people voted for Trump is because they don't like other races." Not sure how you could expect anyone to take that any other way besides personally.

I've said this so many times on here in the past 2 years I'm sick of hearing myself say it....but here's why I voted for Trump: I ******* hate the lying, biased, disingenuous media, I ******* hate coastal elites thinking they know what's best everyone else in every other region of America and the Liberal politicians who pander to them (the description Hillary Clinton gave when she called people in middle America "Deplorables" was a slip she made but one that accurately sums up how Liberal elites feel about people who don't live in Cali, New England, New York, Chocago, etc....aka fly over country), I ******* hate the PC everything culture we've created that makes weak minded, fragile people who cannot deal with the rigors of everyday life without safe spaces and emotional support animals. That's how I got Trump. You can go on about racial resentment or whatever all day long for all I care, it doesn't factor in for me whatsoever.....although I do object to all the bogus White Priviledge, White Guilt bullshit being crammed down everyone's throat. Those are fictional terms invented by hate filled people who want to punish others for their own shortcomings or to curry favor with groups of people who are already hate filled and resentful of life.

 

[AggieSteel]

Aggie if I can try to help clear up your confusion a bit as to why people are taking it personally. I don't know that it's your intention (I actually don't have any idea what your intention is I guess), but your posts seem to be saying "Yeah I'm not saying you guys are racist, I never said that....and then immediately following that up by saying "......but the major reason people voted for Trump is because they don't like other races." Not sure how you could expect anyone to take that any other way besides personally.

I've said this so many times on here in the past 2 years I'm sick of hearing myself say it....but here's why I voted for Trump: I ******* hate the lying, biased, disingenuous media, I ******* hate coastal elites thinking they know what's best everyone else in between and the Liberal politicians who pander to them (the description Hillary Clinton gave when she called people in middle America "Deplorables" was a slip she made but one that accurately sums up how Liberal elites feel about people who don't live in Cali, New England, New York, Chocago, etc.), I ******* hate the PC everything culture we've created that makes weak minded, fragile people who cannot deal with the rigors of everyday life without safe spaces and emotional support animals. That's how I got Trump. You can go on about racial resentment or whatever all day long for all I care, it doesn't factor in for me whatsoever.....although I do object to all the bogus White Priviledge, White Guilt bullshit being crammed down everyone's throat.

I get you.. but there were 63 million Trump voters. Y'all aren't a monolith just like liberals aren't a monolith, no group of people is. There are TONS of issues people vote on - the economy, abortion, guns, religion, Israel, etc. If something is "one of the biggest factors" it doesn't have to influence everyone, or even close to that, to be one of the strongest correlations OVERALL. The implication behind that article was that the writer had it all figured out, everyone voted for the same reasons he did. Did Del? Tim? You? Sure. But the data says it's bigger than that. So I'm expecting people to think beyond "he's saying this about ME" and realize that I'm talking on a purely macro level here and data based on what people are SELF-REPORTING. If I thought you guys were evil, I wouldn't even bother

 

[AggieSteel]

I don't know that it's your intention (I actually don't have any idea what your intention is I guess)

And since you were kind enough to clear up some things. I'll try to clear this up.

My intentions are
1) To pass time because political/cultural discussions can be fun and good mental exercises
2) To introduce points of view that I don't see a lot in here - even though y'all make clear you're tired of them
3) To bring a lively discussion to this board, because when most folks agree with each other on most things, it's not fun. And I happen to think differently than what seems to be the prevailing opinions here, so why not liven it up and give y'all someone to argue with?
4) It's the offseason and there is little Steelers stuff to talk about, and my lady has been consumed with other things recently and I have more time

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

Aggie if I can try to help clear up your confusion a bit as to why people are taking it personally. I don't know that it's your intention (I actually don't have any idea what your intention is I guess), but your posts seem to be saying "Yeah I'm not saying you guys are racist, I never said that....and then immediately following that up by saying "......but the major reason people voted for Trump is because they don't like other races." Not sure how you could expect anyone to take that any other way besides personally.

Bingo. Better said than I could have replied.

Okay it's clear to me that both of you are misreading my posts.

Aggie, I'm not misreading. Don't take this personally, but I'm guessing you have clear thoughts in your head. But you're not a writer. What you are thinking isn't conveyed in what you are typing. It isn't coming across at all as it does after you spin and re-spin your original statements two and three times....or you're just saying ****, realizing it's bad ****, then trying to spin your way out of it. It's one or the other.

Because when I read and reread this over and over...

"I'm pointing out that there is another reason (racial resentment... is a stronger predictor of Trump support than all the other factors that article touts. The article's title implies it can explain to us "how we got Trump" and ignored one of the biggest (if not THE biggest) factor. "

there's really no other way to spin what you wrote. It's clear and evident.

1. I'm in "that" group that voted for Trump. You are implying with the statement above that I and a large majority of those who voted for Trump did so with racial resentment in our hearts. That's exactly what you said.
2. You originally didn't like the WSJ article. In your attempts to dismiss the article, by saying the reasons listed are bullshit, you list a "reason" that they overlooked that was "bigger than all the rest" - racial resentment.

You are in fact stereotyping and generalizing Conservatives as racists. Which is an attack on the whole lot, and those of us here who are. You just called all of us racists.

I appreciate your attempts to spin. And I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that "perhaps" this isn't what you "meant" but it IS damn well sure what you wrote. No spinning that. You behaved just like Obama, Hillary, the NYTimes, the LATimes, HuffPo and every other Liberal with a microphone or every other MSM source likes to do - "stereotype" and lump ALL Conservatives into a bucket and call them racists. Or homophobes. Or Islamaphobes. Or Xenophobes. Pick your phobe of the day.

Frankly, while it irritates me, because you don't know me...I secretly hope you and Obama and Hillary and the MSM KEEP talking this way. It hurts your cause. It helps mine. It drives Conservatives to the polls. And we will keep winning.

The NYT wrote a great piece about this even after the election, saying that unless Liberals change the way they speak to, treat and consider Conservatives, it could be decades before they see the White House again.

 

[CharlesDavenport]

The data came from survey responses from Trump voters. Not Al Gore sitting in his basement inventing stuff