Advocating for the Defense

[Superman]

It isn't my job to know what Butler does. Fact is I don't know and honestly you don't know either. I can just go by what I read and see. Here is an article about it from Jan. https://steelerswire.usatoday.com/2...-took-over-defensive-playcalling-last-season/

Now I'm sure you have more insights to how the team is run than the reporters assigned to them. You need to call Ed Bouchette. Ask him why he did it and tell him how retarded he is for believing what Tomlin said and what he observed.

Also your tweeks weren't the issue I was addressing. I don't understand how you think the 3-4 is outdated but with YOUR tweeks they are a top 3 defense. Can you not see the issue with the convoluted statement? So you are the genius that figured out how to take an outdated archaic defense and make it one of the best in the league. I think you've missed you calling.

You may not see my suggestions but they are there. I don't need a replacement for Tomlin. Just like when a light bulb blows I don't ask myself "Which bulb am I going to replace it with". The NFL and colleges are flooded with all types of coaches. Ask the Eagles who they could possibly get to replace Chip Kelly. It's an ignorant argument. You never heard of Tomlin before he came to interview. And you didn't know **** about him then. Even if I had 10 viable candidates the Steelers don't care what I think. So the point is moot. Just like they don't care when I say Tomlin should go.

that article was for the previous season. not the current cluster **** of a season.

I never said I have more insight into how the defense is ran or should be ran. i do see that Bostic/Vince are both the least athletic starting LBs we have. My most sincere apologies for suggesting we put Ola in at OLB and move Durpee to ILB, as it seemed to have burned your chaffed taint.

I clearly, most absolutely stated that the 3-4 in the way we are running it is not working and therefore outdated. It does need some tweeks. The LB coach we brought in for the Pats game made some adjustments, and the defense played one of the best games of their season. But, as you say, no tweek whatsoever, however significant or insignificant can make a difference, so as a result, we should just fire everyone. Firing everyone will 100% absolutely solve all the problems and next season will result in strip sack fumbles for defensive touchdowns on every single play.

While you make the comparison of Tomlin to any light bulb, you may get better value out of a LED bulb than just any bulb you get your hands on. Will the new bulb be as bright as the one you're replacing it with? ****, it doesn't matter. It's a new bulb. So it MUST be better. It just has to be better. Why must it be better? Because you said so.

And **** Chip Kelly. What did he win in the NFL? nothing of consequence, which is why he took his *** back to college ball. ****, using your logic, we could plug in Hue ******* Jackson and be better. If we **** up with Hue Jackson (pro tip: we would), then we just hire Todd Haley. If we **** up with Todd Haley (pro tip: we would), then we fire him and bring in the next retread. By God, they'll be much better than the previous coach, just because they're not the previous coach. #VaderLogic

Hell, using your logic, Butler would be a better HC than Tomlin simply because he's not Tomlin.

Goddamn it! I figured it out! Send your resume in to the Steelers FO. You're a better goddamned coach than Tomlin, simply because you're not Tomlin. Get on it, Vader!

Send your resume here. Prove just any other goddamn coach is unequivocally going to be light years ahead of Tomlin.
100 Art Rooney Ave, Pittsburgh, PA 15212

oh, and while we have a franchise QB who's window is closing, you're wanting to play musical ******* chairs. ******* brilliant. ******* brilliant. ******* brilliant.

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[Punxsutawney]

oh, and while we have a franchise QB who's window is closing, you're wanting to play musical ******* chairs. ******* brilliant. ******* brilliant. ******* brilliant.

As opposed to banging our heads repeatedly against the wall, expecting a different result?

 

[Vader]

that article was for the previous season. not the current cluster **** of a season.

I never said I have more insight into how the defense is ran or should be ran. i do see that Bostic/Vince are both the least athletic starting LBs we have. My most sincere apologies for suggesting we put Ola in at OLB and move Durpee to ILB, as it seemed to have burned your chaffed taint.

I clearly, most absolutely stated that the 3-4 in the way we are running it is not working and therefore outdated. It does need some tweeks. The LB coach we brought in for the Pats game made some adjustments, and the defense played one of the best games of their season. But, as you say, no tweek whatsoever, however significant or insignificant can make a difference, so as a result, we should just fire everyone. Firing everyone will 100% absolutely solve all the problems and next season will result in strip sack fumbles for defensive touchdowns on every single play.

While you make the comparison of Tomlin to any light bulb, you may get better value out of a LED bulb than just any bulb you get your hands on. Will the new bulb be as bright as the one you're replacing it with? ****, it doesn't matter. It's a new bulb. So it MUST be better. It just has to be better. Why must it be better? Because you said so.

And **** Chip Kelly. What did he win in the NFL? nothing of consequence, which is why he took his *** back to college ball. ****, using your logic, we could plug in Hue ******* Jackson and be better. If we **** up with Hue Jackson (pro tip: we would), then we just hire Todd Haley. If we **** up with Todd Haley (pro tip: we would), then we fire him and bring in the next retread. By God, they'll be much better than the previous coach, just because they're not the previous coach. #VaderLogic

Hell, using your logic, Butler would be a better HC than Tomlin simply because he's not Tomlin.

Goddamn it! I figured it out! Send your resume in to the Steelers FO. You're a better goddamned coach than Tomlin, simply because you're not Tomlin. Get on it, Vader!

Send your resume here. Prove just any other goddamn coach is unequivocally going to be light years ahead of Tomlin.
100 Art Rooney Ave, Pittsburgh, PA 15212

oh, and while we have a franchise QB who's window is closing, you're wanting to play musical ******* chairs. ******* brilliant. ******* brilliant. ******* brilliant.

Obviously you're either being factious or you just aren't getting it.

1st- You believe the system is outdated but damn it if they'd make you adjustments it would go from outdated to top 3. Can you not see the logical inconsistencies in that statement alone? Seriously? It's like saying a car is beyond repair but if I simply repair it, it will work!!!

2nd- I never said Kelly was a great coach. That's just you trying to find something to ***** at me about. My point, which you obviously missed, is that just because you have a coach doesn't mean he is the right coach. Tomlin was a ******* nobody. You didn't know him and neither did I. Did you object to hiring him because you didn't know **** about him? That's ok though because you didn't know Cowher or Noll either. So the "We can't replace Tomlin because the fans don't know who to replace him with" is childish and ignorant.

3rd- As others have pointed out, including myself, Tomlin is STILL calling the defense. The press doesn't have to write about it every week. It hasn't changed. Hell I told you when the article was written. I said JANUARY. I know it was for the last season. Tom showed you a quote from Tomlin about him being slow calling the defense. What the **** else do you need? You think Butler, who was a DL disciple, is calling these 2 DL on the goal line ****? You think Butler who has no experience running a Tampa 2 is implementing a hybrid Tampa 2 scheme? Seriously?

4th- Name me ONE coach who has won a SB with a QB then 10 ******* years later won another SB with that same QB. Just ONE. You'd rather stick with what is NOT working as opposed to trying something that has worked (hiring another HC like with Elway in Denver)? And you have the nerve to say snidely BRILLIANT!! Yea, you're a ******* genius.

 

[Superman]

Obviously you're either being factious or you just aren't getting it.

1st- You believe the system is outdated but damn it if they'd make you adjustments it would go from outdated to top 3. Can you not see the logical inconsistencies in that statement alone? Seriously? It's like saying a car is beyond repair but if I simply repair it, it will work!!!

2nd- I never said Kelly was a great coach. That's just you trying to find something to ***** at me about. My point, which you obviously missed, is that just because you have a coach doesn't mean he is the right coach. Tomlin was a ******* nobody. You didn't know him and neither did I. Did you object to hiring him because you didn't know **** about him? That's ok though because you didn't know Cowher or Noll either. So the "We can't replace Tomlin because the fans don't know who to replace him with" is childish and ignorant.

3rd- As others have pointed out, including myself, Tomlin is STILL calling the defense. The press doesn't have to write about it every week. It hasn't changed. Hell I told you when the article was written. I said JANUARY. I know it was for the last season. Tom showed you a quote from Tomlin about him being slow calling the defense. What the **** else do you need? You think Butler, who was a DL disciple, is calling these 2 DL on the goal line ****? You think Butler who has no experience running a Tampa 2 is implementing a hybrid Tampa 2 scheme? Seriously?

4th- Name me ONE coach who has won a SB with a QB then 10 ******* years later won another SB with that same QB. Just ONE. You'd rather stick with what is NOT working as opposed to trying something that has worked (hiring another HC like with Elway in Denver)? And you have the nerve to say snidely BRILLIANT!! Yea, you're a ******* genius.

dude, first off, I couldn't care less if we fire Tomlin. He's certainly not warranted another few years to correct this bullshit defense, IMO.
However, unlike you, I'm not going to just reach into the discarded coach bin and plug in the freshest retread. No, I didn't know who Tomlin was.I was a kid when Cowher was hired and wasn't born when Noll was hired. That has **** all to do with anything, though.

I guess the offense being slow to get their calls in is also because Tomlin? Hell, everything is Tomlin to you.

I don't believe he's the best coach in the NFL, but I also know he's far from the worst. Unlike you, I'm not willing to insert retreads and ****-ups into the HC seat just because I'm pissed about how the season has unfolded.

And, yes, HOW WE PLAY THE 3-4 IS OUTDATED.
Using your analogy, a car that breaks down should be pushed off to the side of the road instead of being repaired.

 

[Coryea]

We don't play a 3-4 anymore, our base defense is 2DL-4LB-5DBs, which is idiotic at best, why run a defense that uses your two slowest lbs in the middle of the field? It's absolutely moronic. And the, well we don't have the personnel to run anything else, is bullshit. Add a Dlinemen, pull Bostic off the field, if Williams is still getting burnt, pull him off the field and add an extra db. I'd say they might be vulnerable to the run a bit there, but **** they use 2 Dlinemen on short yardage and goal line plays alot anyways, so that must not be a concern.

Sent from my XT1585 using Steeler Nation mobile app

 

[Vader]

dude, first off, I couldn't care less if we fire Tomlin. He's certainly not warranted another few years to correct this bullshit defense, IMO.
However, unlike you, I'm not going to just reach into the discarded coach bin and plug in the freshest retread. No, I didn't know who Tomlin was.I was a kid when Cowher was hired and wasn't born when Noll was hired. That has **** all to do with anything, though.

I guess the offense being slow to get their calls in is also because Tomlin? Hell, everything is Tomlin to you.

I don't believe he's the best coach in the NFL, but I also know he's far from the worst. Unlike you, I'm not willing to insert retreads and ****-ups into the HC seat just because I'm pissed about how the season has unfolded.

And, yes, HOW WE PLAY THE 3-4 IS OUTDATED.
Using your analogy, a car that breaks down should be pushed off to the side of the road instead of being repaired.

Again you misstate what I say and setup you own strawman for you to bat down.

1st- I NEVER said to hire a discarded coach.. NOWHERE. So stop putting words in my mouth. There are plenty of undiscarded coaches to pick from. Seriously dude.

2nd- I NEVER said anything about the offense.. did I? Nope. I don't give a damn about an offense that churning out great numbers. Tomlin not being involved and letting Ben handle it is the best way to go. Now if Tomlin could stop making stupid calls like 4th down and 5 trying to plunge a ******* 250 lbs. FB into the best run defense in the league maybe we'd be on to something.

3rd- Strange you said and I quote:

This is basically LeBeau's tired 3-4 defense that was exposed towards the end of Dick's time here. bend, bend, bend, bend, bend, break. There are some wrinkles that Butler/Tomlin have put in, but they rarely are too positive. Butler is too close to the personnel to see what is/is not working.

You are saying they are running a tired 3-4 defense except with a few adjustments. Then you say it could be a top 3 defense with a few of YOUR adjustments. Talk about cross eyed and retarded. You ***** about the scheme but then in the next sentence say the scheme can be fixed with just a few adjustments. So which is it? Seriously you are talking about moving a few players around and saying it could be a top 3 defense with those changes. At the same time the "Scheme" is outdated. Make up your ******* mind. Which is it? It sure as hell can't be both.

 

[Superman]

Again you misstate what I say and setup you own strawman for you to bat down.

1st- I NEVER said to hire a discarded coach.. NOWHERE. So stop putting words in my mouth. There are plenty of undiscarded coaches to pick from. Seriously dude.

2nd- I NEVER said anything about the offense.. did I? Nope. I don't give a damn about an offense that churning out great numbers. Tomlin not being involved and letting Ben handle it is the best way to go. Now if Tomlin could stop making stupid calls like 4th down and 5 trying to plunge a ******* 250 lbs. FB into the best run defense in the league maybe we'd be on to something.

3rd- Strange you said and I quote:



You are saying they are running a tired 3-4 defense except with a few adjustments. Then you say it could be a top 3 defense with a few of YOUR adjustments. Talk about cross eyed and retarded. You ***** about the scheme but then in the next sentence say the scheme can be fixed with just a few adjustments. So which is it? Seriously you are talking about moving a few players around and saying it could be a top 3 defense with those changes. At the same time the "Scheme" is outdated. Make up your ******* mind. Which is it? It sure as hell can't be both.

see, now you just don't care to understand what i'm saying and are wanting to argue.

the bullshit we run is not working. the bullshit we run is being billed as 3-4 ---- pay attention here ---- even if it is not.

Butler and Tomlin are trying to use the scheme that LeBeau was trying towards the end of his run, since we didn't have that stump in the middle. You must remember seeing Keisel and Heyward/Thomas/McLendon as our only DL? People would ***** relentlessly on this board about it. Yet, here are years later still doing the same stupid **** with Heyward and Tuitt as our DL, sparsely playing Hargraves and rotating the other DLs.

So, yes, the way we run a "3-4" now does need to be schemed/worked differently. We don't have the horses to pull **** off with our best 2 DLs being doubled and using slow assed LBs to cover WRs when not "blitzing" a step or two late in hesitation. See, I was focusing on the LBs and not the entire ******* defense, which you seem to somehow bring into the fold. I want our best/most athletic LBs on the field. I'd absolutely much rather see Hargraves on the field than Chickillo, Matakevich or any such combination. I also want to see Ola at OLB and using Bud in the middle (since he was doing more coverage in past years). Please point out why that is so incomprehensible.

While you did not say anything about the offense getting calls in late, you simply cannot ignore that happened. Thus, if you're stating that Tomlin was 100% responsible for calls to the defense being late, then how can he be pardoned for calls going in to the offense late?

Tomlin has his share of **** ups and failures. I only want to blame him for those, not every single thing. I have very little confidence in him going forward, but some of you, including you Vader, want to blame the man for every single thing that happens on the field. Blown coverage, even though the call was in? Tomlin's fault. Defender slips on a play? Tomlin wouldnt let him change cleats. Boswell misses a FG? Tomlin.

 

[Vader]

see, now you just don't care to understand what i'm saying and are wanting to argue.

the bullshit we run is not working. the bullshit we run is being billed as 3-4 ---- pay attention here ---- even if it is not.

Butler and Tomlin are trying to use the scheme that LeBeau was trying towards the end of his run, since we didn't have that stump in the middle. You must remember seeing Keisel and Heyward/Thomas/McLendon as our only DL? People would ***** relentlessly on this board about it. Yet, here are years later still doing the same stupid **** with Heyward and Tuitt as our DL, sparsely playing Hargraves and rotating the other DLs.

So, yes, the way we run a "3-4" now does need to be schemed/worked differently. We don't have the horses to pull **** off with our best 2 DLs being doubled and using slow assed LBs to cover WRs when not "blitzing" a step or two late in hesitation. See, I was focusing on the LBs and not the entire ******* defense, which you seem to somehow bring into the fold. I want our best/most athletic LBs on the field. I'd absolutely much rather see Hargraves on the field than Chickillo, Matakevich or any such combination. I also want to see Ola at OLB and using Bud in the middle (since he was doing more coverage in past years). Please point out why that is so incomprehensible.

While you did not say anything about the offense getting calls in late, you simply cannot ignore that happened. Thus, if you're stating that Tomlin was 100% responsible for calls to the defense being late, then how can he be pardoned for calls going in to the offense late?

Tomlin has his share of **** ups and failures. I only want to blame him for those, not every single thing. I have very little confidence in him going forward, but some of you, including you Vader, want to blame the man for every single thing that happens on the field. Blown coverage, even though the call was in? Tomlin's fault. Defender slips on a play? Tomlin wouldnt let him change cleats. Boswell misses a FG? Tomlin.

More tripe and bullshit. You flop around like a fish out of water. So now it's the "way" we run the 3-4... which isn't really a 3-4. You ignore everything of substance I post and instead go back to your same talking points.

1. This entire discussion was about the defense. You bring in the offense to try and get me off on that. I won't play your game. Sorry.

2. I remember DL running some of the same **** AFTER Tomlin started putting his "fingerprints" on the defense. Tomlin wanted to change the D which is why DL was let go. Which is also why Colbert goes from selecting typical 3-4 type players to selecting more 4-3 Tampa 2 style players. Which is why they don't work in this "old, outdated" scheme.

3. Then you bring up another strawman. Tomlin is responsible for everything bullshit. Talking about non-sense like a player slipping on the field. Absolute rubbish and childish attempt to paint me as some mindless moron that can't tell the difference between scheme and player mistakes. So I'll make you this challenge. Find me ONE time on this board where I said Tomlin was responsible for a player slipping down like you suggest. You can't so please stop with the ignorant, childish, buffoon laden rants that make you look infantile. Just stop.

4. So you weren't talking about the entire defense just the LBs? RIIIGHT...

disagree that this is not Butler's scheme. I agree that Tomlin has his thumb in there, too.

This is basically LeBeau's tired 3-4 defense that was exposed towards the end of Dick's time here. bend, bend, bend, bend, bend, break. There are some wrinkles that Butler/Tomlin have put in, but they rarely are too positive. Butler is too close to the personnel to see what is/is not working. He's invested a lot of time and effort into implementing the schemes that aren't working, thus Tomlin insists on going back to the lab, if you will. We don't live in our fears on defense, but in our ignorance and unwillingness to change.

I do believe our defense has the personnel and ability to be top 3, and that was shown to the nation in the ***s game. Our LBs need to be more diverse. As Heinz said, Watt needs to blitz more and drop less into coverage. We also need to put Durpee and his athleticism next to Vince to mask Vince's flaws - thus letting Vince go back to blitzing more and dropping into coverage less. Then put Ola at OLB and let him rush the QB. As of now, we're trotting out the LB corp of Durpee, Vince, Bostic and Watt. That's not as athletic as Ola, Vince, Durpee and Watt. Put the best LBs on the field. I can assure you that group doesn't include Bostic, Matakevich or First Ballot Hall of Famer Anthony Chickillo - in any combination.

If Tomlin, as you state, has "taken over the defense", then tell the class why Butler is still here. It can't be because he provides some intrinsic defensive genius, since, as you state, Tomlin has taken over the defense. I assume that means all aspects of the defense, since you're plainly stating that Tomlin is doing the play calling and drafting the players for this hybrid defense. So Tomlin is doing all the defensive scheming, coaching, personnel calls, etc and Butler is mere eye-candy as a "disciple" of the 3-4 defense so yinzers have a clutch throwback to cling to? I mean, no offense, but that's absolutely cross-eyed retarded. You're saying that the Pittsburgh Steelers are employing Butler for absolutely no reason than to be a fall-guy for Tomlin. A million dollar pinata. I just find that absolutely ludicrous to believe, or even to entertain such a far-flung idea.

You talk in every post about the DEFENSE not just the LBs. **** even in this post you talk about the DL. You can't be this damn dense. You just got yourself in a hole and are fighting to get out. I get it.

 

[Superman]

More tripe and bullshit. You flop around like a fish out of water. So now it's the "way" we run the 3-4... which isn't really a 3-4. You ignore everything of substance I post and instead go back to your same talking points.

1. This entire discussion was about the defense. You bring in the offense to try and get me off on that. I won't play your game. Sorry.

2. I remember DL running some of the same **** AFTER Tomlin started putting his "fingerprints" on the defense. Tomlin wanted to change the D which is why DL was let go. Which is also why Colbert goes from selecting typical 3-4 type players to selecting more 4-3 Tampa 2 style players. Which is why they don't work in this "old, outdated" scheme.

3. Then you bring up another strawman. Tomlin is responsible for everything bullshit. Talking about non-sense like a player slipping on the field. Absolute rubbish and childish attempt to paint me as some mindless moron that can't tell the difference between scheme and player mistakes. So I'll make you this challenge. Find me ONE time on this board where I said Tomlin was responsible for a player slipping down like you suggest. You can't so please stop with the ignorant, childish, buffoon laden rants that make you look infantile. Just stop.

4. So you weren't talking about the entire defense just the LBs? RIIIGHT...





You talk in every post about the DEFENSE not just the LBs. **** even in this post you talk about the DL. You can't be this damn dense. You just got yourself in a hole and are fighting to get out. I get it.

you incredibly dense and obtuse ******, did you not see that there are others - specifically Coryea - in this thread, too?

Yes, I did start out speaking about only the LBs. Yes, that is a fact.
In Post 30, you, Vader, brought up the DL. I tried to stay on my topic. You insisted to go to yours. So when I did, you get all bent out of shape. Post 30:

Tomlin took over the play calling last year. This isn't a true 3-4 defense. There is no 3-4 NG. A 3-4 defense doesn't have 2 DL for a goal line set. This is not anything close to a DL defense. All defenses have elements of other defenses but this isn't DL's defense. Tomlin started drafting defensive players that don't fit the 3-4. Butler is a 3-4 guy, Tomlin isn't. So which of those two do you think is running this hybrid defense? It sure as hell isn't the 3-4 DL disciple. It's probably the guy that has experience with a Tampa 2 defense.

Also one game doesn't make a defense. Every team has a good defensive game every year. Also if they are a top 3 defense within Butler's tired old 3-4 with your tweeks then is the 3-4 really the problem? That makes no sense to me. Either the scheme is out dating and worn, the players don't fit the system, or the 3-4 is a good system being ****** with by the HC to make him look like he knows how to run a defense.

Now, maybe you just have a problem remembering the bullshit you spew, but to most everyone else, NG and DL when referring to a football team's defense will infer Nose Guard and Defensive Lineman. Or did you mean something else?

And, if you want to slap a pad on and stop being a whiny ***** for a minute, you'll see that we do agree on the defense being ineffective. I simply ******* want the most athletic LBs on the field. Why that makes your taint chapped is beyond my imagination. Oh, because I said I believe our defense has the "ability" to be a top 3 defense. Note, I never said they were, nor did I say they are at this point in time. I see that we are as of now the 9th best defense overall, but also 18th in points per game. We're tied at 3rd with 48 sacks (Minnesota is tops with 50), 26th in interceptions and 18th in forced fumbles. So we are getting pressure on the QB, but we could do better. We obviously lack in the secondary and at creating turnovers.

and, yes, the "3-4" in how we run it is not as effective as it could be. That's not a ringing endorsement for continuing what we're doing. That's not waving pom poms and being happy. We are doing some things right, but are sorely lacking in others. I do agree with you that the 2 DL bullshit is frustrating. In that, if we have 2 DL and slow-footed LBs, is it not a recipe for disaster?

but, carry on with your inability to grasp what i'm saying.

 

[Litos]

bottom line is that the scheme sucks but there are some decent players on the team that would be better used by other coaches. Can´t we all get along?

 

[Vader]

First off you twit. YOU responded to ME. I never said a ******* word to your obtuse ***. You said AND I ******* QUOTE:

disagree that this is not Butler's scheme. I agree that Tomlin has his thumb in there, too.

This is basically LeBeau's tired 3-4 defense that was exposed towards the end of Dick's time here. bend, bend, bend, bend, bend, break. There are some wrinkles that Butler/Tomlin have put in, but they rarely are too positive. Butler is too close to the personnel to see what is/is not working. He's invested a lot of time and effort into implementing the schemes that aren't working, thus Tomlin insists on going back to the lab, if you will. We don't live in our fears on defense, but in our ignorance and unwillingness to change.

You were talking about the 3-4 DEFENSE. You didn't say one ******* word about a LB in your first paragraph. It just informed everyone that you thought Tomlin wasn't in control of the defense. You were responding to ME about what I had said about the 3-4 defense... not what I said about the LBs. Then you started babbling on about the changes YOU would make. Can you not grasp that? I was talking about the scheme. The overall scheme NOT just the LBs. BTW DL can mean Dick Lebeau.

I don't give a damn about "your" topic. Since we were talking about the scheme NOT just the LBs. Hell even the title of the post is "Advocating for the defense". Not "Advocating for the LBs". So yes I "heaven forbid" discussed the NG and DL (defensive line) because they are really apart of the defense. If you want to talk about just the LBs then fine. But don't start talking about the 3-4 and scheme because the 3-4 scheme is more than just LBs. So if you could pull the strap-on out of your *** you'd see that. Hell you are even talking about the secondary in this post... How dare you!!!

 

[Superman]

First off you twit. YOU responded to ME. I never said a ******* word to your obtuse ***. You said AND I ******* QUOTE:



You were talking about the 3-4 DEFENSE. You didn't say one ******* word about a LB in your first paragraph. It just informed everyone that you thought Tomlin wasn't in control of the defense. You were responding to ME about what I had said about the 3-4 defense... not what I said about the LBs. Then you started babbling on about the changes YOU would make. Can you not grasp that? I was talking about the scheme. The overall scheme NOT just the LBs. BTW DL can mean Dick Lebeau.

I don't give a damn about "your" topic. Since we were talking about the scheme NOT just the LBs. Hell even the title of the post is "Advocating for the defense". Not "Advocating for the LBs". So yes I "heaven forbid" discussed the NG and DL (defensive line) because they are really apart of the defense. If you want to talk about just the LBs then fine. But don't start talking about the 3-4 and scheme because the 3-4 scheme is more than just LBs. So if you could pull the strap-on out of your *** you'd see that. Hell you are even talking about the secondary in this post... How dare you!!!

oh, I see the issue. i walked on the legend of LeBeau and that rankles you. All hail the 10-yard cushions, because that's what we had at the end of his tenure. I absolutely did say, and stand behind my statement that LeBeau's defense towards the end of his time here was tired and was being exposed. YOU even say that the 2-DL doesn't work, but goddamn it if LeBeau didn't use ... 2DL. Nah, that's all on Tomlin.

I went on to say that we have the personnel and ability to be top 3. Which somehow burns your labia even more. How and why is a mystery to Jesus, God and Allah. None of whom can find a rational reason why that bothers you so much. Do you completely disagree that we have talent on the defensive side of the ball? Is that what it is? If so, then we should implement your coveted performance improvement method and fire everyone on the defensive side. Hell, you were pulling light bulbs out of your *** babbling on about how the next guy in any role is better than the previous guy simply because he's not the same guy.

And yes, Princess, the thread is about the defense. I pointed out one aspect of the defense. Just one, and your skirt wrinkled and your frilly socks got soiled. It's like you can't engage in a conversation unless it's specifically on what you wish to talk about. My apologies to your douche bottle for not typing a full dissertation on the cognitive abilities and inefficiencies of the entire defense.

that aside:

Can we run a 3-4 utilizing Heyward, Hargrave and Tuitt as the DL? Probably so. Do we? Rarely.
Are our LBs on the field the best combination available? Likely not. Can we do better with personnel currently rostered? Possibly so.
Is our secondary the best it can be? No.
Who's the problem - Butler or Tomlin? both.

 

[topseed]

If Tomlin, as you state, has "taken over the defense", then tell the class why Butler is still here. It can't be because he provides some intrinsic defensive genius, since, as you state, Tomlin has taken over the defense. I assume that means all aspects of the defense, since you're plainly stating that Tomlin is doing the play calling and drafting the players for this hybrid defense. So Tomlin is doing all the defensive scheming, coaching, personnel calls, etc and Butler is mere eye-candy as a "disciple" of the 3-4 defense so yinzers have a clutch throwback to cling to? I mean, no offense, but that's absolutely cross-eyed retarded. You're saying that the Pittsburgh Steelers are employing Butler for absolutely no reason than to be a fall-guy for Tomlin. A million dollar pinata. I just find that absolutely ludicrous to believe, or even to entertain such a far-flung idea.

That is absolutely the reason. Butler will be the fall guy. Couldn't have said it any better myself. Maybe a "puppet." Or a "muppet," because that's exactly what Butler looks like.

Now that the Steelers have blown a two-and-a-half game lead in the division in the past five weeks, and after they fail to make the playoffs with one of the most talented rosters in the entire league, whom do you believe is more likely to lose his job next week?

Butler or Tomlin?

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

I really thought that they drafted Marcus Allen to play a hybrid LB role. He pretty much did that at Penn State. It made total sense too. There was a big need for an ILB with coverage skills. Rumor is they loved Vander Esch. They got shut out of the top end ILBs in the draft.

I felt that the late pick of Allen was to compensate for missing out on the ILBs. Maybe it was but he got injured and missed most of the preseason.

I wish they tried him at LB. Yeah, he's a rookie and probably would have made some mistakes but he's far better suited to any other LB on this team in coverage.

 

[topseed]

I really thought that they drafted Marcus Allen to play a hybrid LB role. He pretty much did that at Penn State. It made total sense too. There was a big need for an ILB with coverage skills. Rumor is they loved Vander Esch. They got shut out of the top end ILBs in the draft.

I felt that the late pick of Allen was to compensate for missing out on the ILBs. Maybe it was but he got injured and missed most of the preseason.

I wish they tried him at LB. Yeah, he's a rookie and probably would have made some mistakes but he's far better suited to any other LB on this team in coverage.

I agree, and I loved the pick. What can Bostic or Fort do that Allen wouldn't be able to? He's physical, he can tackle, he can blitz, and he sure as **** would provide better pass coverage. If they insist on putting only 2 defensive lineman out there, Allen seemingly would make a lot more sense.

 

[Litos]

I agree, and I loved the pick. What can Bostic or Fort do that Allen wouldn't be able to? He's physical, he can tackle, he can blitz, and he sure as **** would provide better pass coverage. If they insist on putting only 2 defensive lineman out there, Allen seemingly would make a lot more sense.

It probably had to do with being a rookie and missing training camp in one of the most difficult positions to learn, I see Thomas as another athletic guy that could thrive there but apparently he might only be a late bloomer like Harrison?

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[Coryea]

It probably had to do with being a rookie and missing training camp in one of the most difficult positions to learn, I see Thomas as another athletic guy that could thrive there but apparently he might only be a late bloomer like Harrison?

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Or Tomlin is too stubborn to play Thomas??? Baltimore has a guy they signed as a free agent last year or the year before, I can't even spell it Onwausor, a LB that just won AFC defensive player of the week

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[Coach]

I really thought that they drafted Marcus Allen to play a hybrid LB role. He pretty much did that at Penn State. It made total sense too. There was a big need for an ILB with coverage skills. Rumor is they loved Vander Esch. They got shut out of the top end ILBs in the draft.

I felt that the late pick of Allen was to compensate for missing out on the ILBs. Maybe it was but he got injured and missed most of the preseason.

I wish they tried him at LB. Yeah, he's a rookie and probably would have made some mistakes but he's far better suited to any other LB on this team in coverage.

Tape,


The Steelers could have picked Leonard in round one, he's amazing. Or Baker in round two. We did not miss out on all of the top ILB's. Washington, a pick I did not like and said would not play much with two all-stars in front of him was a luxury pick the defense could not afford. Yes- Vander Esh would have been amazing, but the Steelers could not get him, and its likely they tired because they failed to trade up for Evans.


I don't think Marcus Allen will be anything but a special teams guy. Sorry, he's slow ( 4.6 for safety is slow ) and has very poor ball skills. I watched all the safeties in coverage at the senior bowl like a hawk, and he was badly beaten several times one on coverage drills. How many passes did he get his hands on in college? Very, very few. He's another player who lets his man get open and tackles him. Our great coverage hope underneath, he is not.

The good news for us is this is a solid defensive draft. Unless the Ravens lose and we win, we pick between 16-20...about where the 1st or 2nd Inside linebacker comes off the board in most drafts. Let's hope for Qb's to be drafted early and our scots to be on the money. One thing is clear, high picks like Dupree ( Who's average ), Burns ( BUST ), and Davis ( Disappointment ) can not be repeated as they will NOT fix the defense.

 

[Coach]

Or Tomlin is too stubborn to play Thomas??? Baltimore has a guy they signed as a free agent last year or the year before, I can't even spell it Onwausor, a LB that just won AFC defensive player of the week

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I'm very excited about Thomas as he looked like the real deal in pre-season in coverage, rushing the passer, and leading the team in tackles. Tomlin thinks of him as a guy to cut, the 51st to 53rd player on the roster. This is okay, because Tomlin doesn't understand how to use linebackers at all.

If I wanted to play con on Thomas, he looks like he needs to get a little bigger, and might not understand the defense enough to start ( Only one way to find out ) , but asking the man to cover a back or tight end, or rush the passer doesn't require much thinking.

It took Tomlin forever to figure out that Williams and Bostic suck in coverage, and to play Fort, which I was crowing for games before. So let's hope Mikey's sunglasses prevent him from seeing the upside with Thomas. I would have played the rookie in sub packages.

 

[Vader]

oh, I see the issue. i walked on the legend of LeBeau and that rankles you. All hail the 10-yard cushions, because that's what we had at the end of his tenure. I absolutely did say, and stand behind my statement that LeBeau's defense towards the end of his time here was tired and was being exposed. YOU even say that the 2-DL doesn't work, but goddamn it if LeBeau didn't use ... 2DL. Nah, that's all on Tomlin.

I went on to say that we have the personnel and ability to be top 3. Which somehow burns your labia even more. How and why is a mystery to Jesus, God and Allah. None of whom can find a rational reason why that bothers you so much. Do you completely disagree that we have talent on the defensive side of the ball? Is that what it is? If so, then we should implement your coveted performance improvement method and fire everyone on the defensive side. Hell, you were pulling light bulbs out of your *** babbling on about how the next guy in any role is better than the previous guy simply because he's not the same guy.

And yes, Princess, the thread is about the defense. I pointed out one aspect of the defense. Just one, and your skirt wrinkled and your frilly socks got soiled. It's like you can't engage in a conversation unless it's specifically on what you wish to talk about. My apologies to your douche bottle for not typing a full dissertation on the cognitive abilities and inefficiencies of the entire defense.

that aside:

Can we run a 3-4 utilizing Heyward, Hargrave and Tuitt as the DL? Probably so. Do we? Rarely.
Are our LBs on the field the best combination available? Likely not. Can we do better with personnel currently rostered? Possibly so.
Is our secondary the best it can be? No.
Who's the problem - Butler or Tomlin? both.

You're such a child. Your first post to me was to ***** about Tomlin not being in control of the defense. Period. Then you start some bullshit about only talking about LBs. Which is more bullshit. You can't remember what you said and when. Since I mentioned Tomlin your ***** got all in a tither and you couldn't stand the idea that Tomlin is responsible for something. He's said it and others have written about it.

I'm done with this ****.

Now to the defense. I've never said the defense didn't have talent. Yes, it is being wasted by the stupid scheme (not just the LBs). I have no issue with firing Butler. I really have no idea what he brings to the table because I don't think he's ever had control over the defense. But either way him and Tomlin can hit the door. Like Harrison said in his interview. The defense is full of 1st and 2nd round talent. There is no reason why they continually give up leads in the 4th quarter. The only issue I have with Harrison's statement is, should they have been 1st round or 2nd round picks? Dupree is a 1st round pick but he doesn't have 1st round talent. OR is he talented enough but not being taught right? I have no idea.

 

[Superman]

You're such a child. Your first post to me was to ***** about Tomlin not being in control of the defense. Period. Then you start some bullshit about only talking about LBs. Which is more bullshit. You can't remember what you said and when. Since I mentioned Tomlin your ***** got all in a tither and you couldn't stand the idea that Tomlin is responsible for something. He's said it and others have written about it.

I'm done with this ****.

Now to the defense. I've never said the defense didn't have talent. Yes, it is being wasted by the stupid scheme (not just the LBs). I have no issue with firing Butler. I really have no idea what he brings to the table because I don't think he's ever had control over the defense. But either way him and Tomlin can hit the door. Like Harrison said in his interview. The defense is full of 1st and 2nd round talent. There is no reason why they continually give up leads in the 4th quarter. The only issue I have with Harrison's statement is, should they have been 1st round or 2nd round picks? Dupree is a 1st round pick but he doesn't have 1st round talent. OR is he talented enough but not being taught right? I have no idea.

I wasn't bitching, you obstinate ************. I was saying this is Butler's scheme and Tomlin has thrown his **** in there, too. But, since it wasn't a complete **** on Tomlin, you get irritated and start whining for pages and pages, wasting bandwidth and bringing the overall intelligence of the board down. Additionally, I said I couldn't care less if we fire Tomlin. So tell me how the hell that makes my ***** get in a tither.

You're not done with this ****. You'll be back whining and complaining that anyone who sees this any different than you has a raging hard-on for Tomlin.

I agree with 90% of your last paragraph. All I disagree with is that this isn't Butler's scheme. It is. His AND Tomlin's. If Tomlin could fire Arians and Haley after fielding productive offenses, what makes you think he can't fire Butler for this **** show we've witnessed for years? If it was all on Butler, he'd be gone. If it wasn't due to Tomlin having his fingers in the pie, then Butler would remain. Either way, I agree they both need to be gone.

Happy, douchebag?

 

[Vader]

I wasn't bitching, you obstinate ************. I was saying this is Butler's scheme and Tomlin has thrown his **** in there, too. But, since it wasn't a complete **** on Tomlin, you get irritated and start whining for pages and pages, wasting bandwidth and bringing the overall intelligence of the board down. Additionally, I said I couldn't care less if we fire Tomlin. So tell me how the hell that makes my ***** get in a tither.

You're not done with this ****. You'll be back whining and complaining that anyone who sees this any different than you is a had a raging hard-on for Tomlin.

I agree with 90% of your last paragraph. All I disagree with is that this isn't Butler's scheme. It is. His AND Tomlin's. If Tomlin could fire Arians and Haley after fielding productive offenses, what makes you think he can't fire Butler for this **** show we've witnessed for years? If it was all on Butler, he'd be gone. If it wasn't due to Tomlin having his fingers in the pie, then Butler would remain. Either way, I agree they both need to be gone.

Happy, douchebag?

I'm always happy *****. I'm done with this **** with you.

 

[ark steel]

I really thought that they drafted Marcus Allen to play a hybrid LB role. He pretty much did that at Penn State. It made total sense too. There was a big need for an ILB with coverage skills. Rumor is they loved Vander Esch. They got shut out of the top end ILBs in the draft.

I felt that the late pick of Allen was to compensate for missing out on the ILBs. Maybe it was but he got injured and missed most of the preseason.

I wish they tried him at LB. Yeah, he's a rookie and probably would have made some mistakes but he's far better suited to any other LB on this team in coverage.

I have it on good authority that picking a punter at that position was the best idea.

 

[Coach]

I have it on good authority that picking a punter at that position was the best idea.

Well he's in the pro bowl, would be playing ( unlike Allen ) on Sundays an save us over million dollars on the cap, so...

On another topic, who would win between Lord Vader, with his force powers and light saber, vs Superman with Mike Tomlin coaching up Vader, and Kevin Butler coaching up Superman. Ya got me! I dunno

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

I'm very excited about Thomas as he looked like the real deal in pre-season in coverage,.

oh really? we had no idea!