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Coach’s mid-term grades.

SteelerSask said:
Ok Ridley fumbles and it was kinda bullshit as I don't think he completely caught a difficult throw. Other than that he is literally A+ for his role on the team.
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I'd like to see him get a few more touches a game; he runs hard. Yes, a history of fumbles, but I wouldn't indict him over the last one, as you said.
 
Steelworth said:
Oh stop taking yourself so seriously. .
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That is a non sequitur. He wrote nothing to indicate he was taking himself too seriously. That is crap. He was the one keeping it light in the midst of unfair bashing.

He was purely making football comments, nothing else.
 
Coach said:
Cope,

" B " is better than average, which Berry is not. He's a below average NFL punter. My call was to keep Matt Wile, and he's averring 45.7 yards per punt, with 19 dropped inside the 20 yard line on the Vikings. Only 2 touch backs. This would also save us a million on the cap. Was I correct in this call? What do you think?

Canady was viewed as suspect, a reason why the Steelers worked out long snappers during the season. To get an A+ he needs to add to kick coverage and tackle people. And if he was A+, there is no way the Steelers would look at replacements during the season.

Those are my special teams observations.

A grade of B+ for Davis? Take a look at what the other free safeties are producing then compare and contrast. He's not that good. If Davis is a B+, the NFL is full of A type of safeties.

I think I know just as much about defense as offense, and something on special teams, though coaching special teams and scouting them is rather easy. For the record, I wanted to draft a punter in round five over Allen. Yes --punter Mike Dickson is that good. The rookie is averring 47.5 yards a punt, ran it once near his own end zone for a first down, and has a special type of leg that can change field positon when you are backed up. . Accurate too with just 2 punts for touchbacks, ( 43.9% of his puns inside the 20 ) and hang time you have to see to appreciate.
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See, there is "better" and there is "better". You look at this one stat (without offer the comparison) as what matters.

I showed you from preseason stats on both why the yards punting and net yards could vary wildly based on situations.

In any event. Wile has 3 more punts. His avg is less than 2 yards more and his net is about 2.5 yards more. Technically, "better" as long as you ignore what might be situational differences.

His inside the 20? 3 more than Berry, his TB, the same. That hang tine you have to see to believe has resulted in 11 FC. A whole NEGATIVE 2 more than Berry.

So, "better" is a stretch. If we looked at each punt, from where they punted, we might (or might not) see that situations can affect the avg on the punt. Our ****** PR coverage, id bet, has more to do with the net than Berry.
 
Steelworth said:
And speaking of bias, I see yours is still strong for Pouncey. He and DeCastro are playing at all-pro levels. Hell, the entire OL is playing at a high level.
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I think I had some nice things to say about Pouncey. He is having a better year. However, he also leads the team in QB pressures.

If someone wants to see where PFF or a 3rd party rating system places him, it could be interesting.
 
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ark steel said:
See, there is "better" and there is "better". You look at this one stat (without offer the comparison) as what matters.

I showed you from preseason stats on both why the yards punting and net yards could vary wildly based on situations.

In any event. Wile has 3 more punts. His avg is less than 2 yards more and his net is about 2.5 yards more. Technically, "better" as long as you ignore what might be situational differences.

His inside the 20? 3 more than Berry, his TB, the same. That hang tine you have to see to believe has resulted in 11 FC. A whole NEGATIVE 2 more than Berry.

So, "better" is a stretch. If we looked at each punt, from where they punted, we might (or might not) see that situations can affect the avg on the punt. Our ****** PR coverage, id bet, has more to do with the net than Berry.
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No dice.

2.5 more per punt Net in Wile's favor
More punts inside the 20, once again Wile is better
We saw the difference in leg strength and hang time in the preseason. Wile was better once again
And did we forget to note that Wile is about 1 million dollars cheaper on the cap? Wile > Berry again.

Call this " better ", or slight improvement if you must. Berry's leg tends to weaken a bit later in the season.

The bottom line: It was the wrong call by Tomlin on who to keep. As for drafting a punter, I think we missed out on a pro bowl level guy in round five.
 
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Coach said:
I think I had some nice things to say about Pouncey. He is having a better year. However, he also leads the team in QB pressures.

If someone wants to see where PFF or a 3rd party rating system places him, it could be interesting.
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This is where stats can become stupid. Simply watch the game. He leads the team in QB pressures. OK define that. Is that against a definable opponent to block? Because when I coach and want real pressure on my opponents QB, I send them right up the middle on an A gap blitz. So yeah a centre will be giving up more pressure than anyone who almost always has a defined person to block and is in a better fit to make that block cause they don't have to snap the ball. I watch Pouncey every week. He and everyone on the line is the lest of the concerns of this team in the present.
 
mr peeples said:
He wasn't alone in that assessment after that draft. I not only wasn't a fan of the Davis pick, I didn't like Burns either, felt like a reach.

In retrospect, Burns turned out to be the bigger FAIL and Davis has improved so I don't feel he was a total wasted pick. Burns looks like a bust to me.
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My post never mentioned Burns, anyway no one cares about your opinion on either

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Steeler Nation mobile app
 
Black & Gold Bleeder said:
Can't wait to see berry doing squat thrusts on the sidelines in Dec. To combat his leg atrophy
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Hey lets do stats for punters!

Clevelands punter is the BEST. He leads the league in YARDS and has nearly TWICE the amount of punts of Berry Shortcake. He's the AMESOMEST!!!

This is why punting, as a statistical measure falls short of actually rating good punters.
 
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The 411 on number 21

While I do think that Davis is playing a bit better thisyear ( and is not a weak link like say Blake was ) , this thread will examine where he rates among his peers on defense. Maybe I am too hard on the guy? I do think he’s making less mistakes this year.


Let’s let the data rule and see.

One of the best things about playing safety according to noless authority than Rod Woodson is your in on a lot of plays and cannot be takenout of the game.

Outside of being tacklinga receiver who has already open and caught the football, what type of splashplays does he offer?

Let’s examine the NFL stats, which none of us control and see:


Splash plays:



Pass defensed. 3 for the year for Davis. The trouble is 100 other players in the NFL are better in this department and over 33 NFL players have 6 or more. This is a low amount and shows QB’s can throw on Davis with little fear of the pass being broken up.

Interceptions. 0 for Davis. Over 90 NFL players have one ormore

Forced Fumbles. 0 for Davis. 64 players have one or more.

Tackles. 39 for Davis. This is okay and only slightly behind last year pace. 97players have more tackles. Of course a tackle by itself is not a splash play, but I thought it was relevant for the conversation.

Sacks. 0 for Davis. 100 players have more. To be fair to Davis he seldom blitzes.

Tackles for losses. 0 for Davis. 76 players have 4 or more


Other numerical observations:

The Steelers have one of the best pass rushes in football ( tied for 3rd ), in theory most DB's should benefit.

Davis is 3rd on the team with missed tackles at 8 for the year. Where this would rate among NFL defensive players is unknown, but I guess it would be on the high side.

For the season, Davis only has two penalties accepted, both of which were for 15 yards. Not bad considering the ref's these day.


** I do not have data on TD' given up or total yardage surrender in coverage but they would be very interesting **
 
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Looks more like the 411 on coach's skewed opinion on Davis.
 
slashsteel said:
Looks more like the 411 on coach's skewed opinion on Davis.
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More like NFL data. It is what it is. You can't debunk it. I listed all categories I could find.

Like I said, I think he's improved. As for splash plays, he not good. If you like safeties who are good at tackling after a player catches the ball, but doesn't do much else, Davis is your man.
 
Is Time of Possession considered in Your stats?
Are % of throws where he has a chance to participate considered against the other Safeties?


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Coach said:
No dice.

2.5 more per punt Net in Wile's favor
More punts inside the 20, once again Wile is better
We saw the difference in leg strength and hang time in the preseason. Wile was better once again
And did we forget to note that Wile is about 1 million dollars cheaper on the cap? Wile > Berry again.

Call this " better ", or slight improvement if you must. Berry's leg tends to weaken a bit later in the season.

The bottom line: It was the wrong call by Tomlin on who to keep. As for drafting a punter, I think we missed out on a pro bowl level guy in round five.
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Oh bullshit on "better". Margins like that on that stat do not mean "better". It is, simply, not significant enough of a difference to make that distinction. Technically, higher, but not, necessarily, "better". This is why no one took your stupid assed bet, because you make distractions that arent.

You said that magnificent hang time, which might be better, but i haven't seen measures, would result in more fair catches. Ive demonstrated Wile has less FC on more punts.

You will notice that i, specifically, did not mention cost. This was purposefully done as i was discussing your dumbass conclusion as to "better".

If my punter kicks from the opponent's 45 and drops it inside the 20, and your punter punts from their own 45 and it ends up inside the 20, which is "better". Based on your stats analysis, your punter is "better". The problem is, the stat doesn't tell the whole story.
 
Since Burns' *** met the pine there is only one player on this team who has serious importance whos play is below the line. Boswell. I still have zero confidence in his ability to kick a game winner and he keeps missing right.
 
Punting from the 50, a 40 yard punt is better than a 50 yard punt. There is your difference in punting for distance.

Blake played CB, not S. Better comparison is Mitchell last year.
 
Cope said:
Punting from the 50, a 40 yard punt is better than a 50 yard punt. There is your difference in punting for distance.

Blake played CB, not S. Better comparison is Mitchell last year.
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Stats play a role as they are quantified. But if you just watch the games you get a pretty good feel for who is playing well.
 
SteelerSask said:
Stats play a role as they are quantified. But if you just watch the games you get a pretty good feel for who is playing well.
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But, sometimes, you only see things that reinforces the opinions you already have.

Sometimes, you get a perception that something it true, when it is not. For instance, a guy might get a FS a couple times in a game. Several games later, he gets a couple more. You remember the other game and percieve him as an issue. However, when look back, you realize those were his only 4 penalties over a large # of games.

You might percieve one player is "better " than the other, but be wrong.
 
Coach you didn't grade your fellow coach Tomlin. He plays a vital role in the outcome of Steeler games. His decisions are the difference between winning and losing.
I think he's turned it around these last 4 games. He was awful at the beginning of the season.
 
Coach said:
While I do think that Davis is playing a bit better thisyear ( and is not a weak link like say Blake was ) , this thread will examine where he rates among his peers on defense. Maybe I am too hard on the guy? I do think he’s making less mistakes this year.


Let’s let the data rule and see.

One of the best things about playing safety according to noless authority than Rod Woodson is your in on a lot of plays and cannot be takenout of the game.

Outside of being tacklinga receiver who has already open and caught the football, what type of splashplays does he offer?

Let’s examine the NFL stats, which none of us control and see:


Splash plays:



Pass defensed. 3 for the year for Davis. The trouble is 100 other players in the NFL are better in this department and over 33 NFL players have 6 or more. This is a low amount and shows QB’s can throw on Davis with little fear of the pass being broken up.

Interceptions. 0 for Davis. Over 90 NFL players have one ormore

Forced Fumbles. 0 for Davis. 64 players have one or more.

Tackles. 39 for Davis. This is okay and only slightly behind last year pace. 97players have more tackles. Of course a tackle by itself is not a splash play, but I thought it was relevant for the conversation.

Sacks. 0 for Davis. 100 players have more. To be fair to Davis he seldom blitzes.

Tackles for losses. 0 for Davis. 76 players have 4 or more


Other numerical observations:

The Steelers have one of the best pass rushes in football ( tied for 3rd ), in theory most DB's should benefit.

Davis is 3rd on the team with missed tackles at 8 for the year. Where this would rate among NFL defensive players is unknown, but I guess it would be on the high side.

For the season, Davis only has two penalties accepted, both of which were for 15 yards. Not bad considering the ref's these day.


** I do not have data on TD' given up or total yardage surrender in coverage but they would be very interesting **
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Just for reference, what does your bible site (PFF) rate Davis at the moment for safeties.

Also, try to paste correctly from one medium to the next. Black fonts works best on white contrast.


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ark steel said:
But, sometimes, you only see things that reinforces the opinions you already have.

Sometimes, you get a perception that something it true, when it is not. For instance, a guy might get a FS a couple times in a game. Several games later, he gets a couple more. You remember the other game and percieve him as an issue. However, when look back, you realize those were his only 4 penalties over a large # of games.

You might percieve one player is "better " than the other, but be wrong.
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There are some stats that are pretty clear. Yards per carry. Yards per catch. Touchdown to Int. Then there is all this deep analytics. I think a lot of that goes too far. In a game like baseball it's one thing. But for football to me the eye test is what matters the most. For example what Coach has to say about Davis. I'm watching the games and can see for myself. You can offer all the stats you want. I have one of my own. When it was Davis and Mitchell the Steelers were getting torched up the middle. Now they are not. I also see the guy play every Sunday and he looks pretty ****** solid. Not everyone is a superstar. Davis wont get Polamalu money. He will get solid money cause he's a very solid player.
 
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Stewey said:
Coach you didn't grade your fellow coach Tomlin. He plays a vital role in the outcome of Steeler games. His decisions are the difference between winning and losing.
I think he's turned it around these last 4 games. He was awful at the beginning of the season.
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B- for The Tomlin man. . He does not impress or understand football. He's reactive to mistakes. How about putting the players in positon to win sooner? His judgement on when to throw the red flag has been very poor, and he has clashed with officials and been fined. The slow start was due to guys not being ready to play. He's lucky the Steelers have some other good coaches around him ( Munchak, Fichtner ) and a good GM that has given him good players. The B- is due to the team record.

And on that note

Fitchner - A - I like him
Butler B- Defese is coming around.
 
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