Start / give more snaps to Vance McDonald

[Coach]

At this point in in career Jessie James is what he is. Just okay as a blocker, just okay as a pass catcher, and a player with limited speed. He's really a 2nd type of TE.

With players like Brown, Bryant, and Bell ,you have to assume the zone would have room for the Tight end to do some damage. James can not split the seam, or get deep. But McDonald can. He's much better as an athlete and faster.

So its time for the Steelers to start using his talents more often. Teams just do not have to prepare for James at all. In fact they mostly ignore him and focus elsewhere.

This change has little to lose but a lot to gain. Maybe it doesn't work out, okay then go back to James. But if it does work out, we've got something.

 

[Hines57]

Pretty sure Vance was coming off a week in which he missed a game. I don't know that they wanted him out there for more than X snaps. He also is still very new to this offense. He will get more PT and hopefully produce soon. I would expect they traded for this guy hoping he would be the starter.

 

[Steeler Pride]

What exactly has McDonald done to EARN more snaps? Do you think any coaching staff is putting players on the field just because they are nice guys? Obviously, he is not showing enough in practice to move up the depth chart. Quit "giving" guys a shot and make them earn their playing time by performance on the practice field, film room, team meetings, game performance...etc.

 

[Drink IRON City]

Vance will be the starter and very soon provided injury set back doesn't occur. Jesse James just doesn't have the "it" needed. Look at how much difference with so little playing time our concussed TE made. Just a little upgrade combined with the weapons allready on the field will make a BIG difference.


Salute the nation

 

[Coach]

What exactly has McDonald done to EARN more snaps? Do you think any coaching staff is putting players on the field just because they are nice guys? Obviously, he is not showing enough in practice to move up the depth chart. Quit "giving" guys a shot and make them earn their playing time by performance on the practice field, film room, team meetings, game performance...etc.

My point is McDonald can do things James can't. Are you okay with a back up type staring, or would you want to give a 2nd round talent, who was stuck on the 49ers team that had QB issues a chance to shine?

When I see the weakest link on the offense starting and more physically talented newer player behind it, you should find out what best by giving the more talented guy a chance.

As for who starts, that is Tomlin's choice.

 

[Steeler Pride]

My point is McDonald can do things James can't. Are you okay with a back up type staring, or would you want to give a 2nd round talent, who was stuck on the 49ers team that had QB issues a chance to shine?

When I see the weakest link on the offense starting and more physically talented newer player behind it, you should find out what best by giving the more talented guy a chance.

As for who starts, that is Tomlin's choice.

So you apparently think that the entire coaching staff sees McDonald as far superior in practice yet starts James for the hell of it? The question to ask is WHY is he not getting more reps, what is he not doing to earn those reps. Plenty of guys with superior talent have washed out of the NFL. I am pretty sure that any coaching staff is putting together their depth chart and snap counts based on what they see on a daily basis.

 

[Litos]

My point is McDonald can do things James can't. Are you okay with a back up type staring, or would you want to give a 2nd round talent, who was stuck on the 49ers team that had QB issues a chance to shine?

When I see the weakest link on the offense starting and more physically talented newer player behind it, you should find out what best by giving the more talented guy a chance.

As for who starts, that is Tomlin's choice.

he was coming from injury, he has to feel the water befor jumping in. He will eventually get the starter spot but he has to earn it progressively. Don't rush things

 

[Hines57]

By the way talking about TEs, if Grimble did more than stick out his left arm the Bears would not have blocked the FG and I'm fairly certain we would have won the game. Grimble did the same ******* thing on the 2nd FG attempt later in the game. Barely just stuck his arm out. ****** blocking

 

[Litos]

By the way talking about TEs, if Grimble did more than stick out his left arm the Bears would not have blocked the FG and I'm fairly certain we would have won the game. Grimble did the same ******* thing on the 2nd FG attempt later in the game. Barely just stuck his arm out. ****** blocking

send him to PS, bring the other guy that I don't remember his name already but could block. With Vance back Grimble's catch ability is not needed

 

[Coach]

So you apparently think that the entire coaching staff sees McDonald as far superior in practice yet starts James for the hell of it? The question to ask is WHY is he not getting more reps, what is he not doing to earn those reps. Plenty of guys with superior talent have washed out of the NFL. I am pretty sure that any coaching staff is putting together their depth chart and snap counts based on what they see on a daily basis.

This is the same coaching staff gave Ju-Ju more snaps than Byrant or Rogers vs the Bears. Did you agree with that?

This is the same coaching staff that had a zero like Jarvis Jones starting for too long. Did you agree with that?

Look--James isn't very good. He's a near non factor and the weakest starter of 11 on the offense. Maybe McDonald can upgrade us. I think he fits the talent around him better than James. Why not try him is my point, we have little to lose! If he doesn't work out, go back the journeyman. Just give him a chance.

If Colbert and the coaches who have film on McDonald did not think he potential upgrade they would not have traded for him.

 

[Hines57]

Juju is already a really good blocker.

Not a Rogers fan at all. Wish they would take away his hat and give it to Hunter. We don't need another smurf out there.

Bryant has got to fight more for balls. Maybe he is still working off rust from missing an entire year. We need him bad this Sunday.

They played Jarvis because he was better than what was behind him and damn you can only give Harrison so many snaps before you wear him down. Clearly they're saving him for the late season run...if there's to be one.

 

[Ike Kelly]

This is the same coaching staff gave Ju-Ju more snaps than Byrant or Rogers vs the Bears. Did you agree with that?

This is the same coaching staff that had a zero like Jarvis Jones starting for too long. Did you agree with that?

Look--James isn't very good. He's a near non factor and the weakest starter of 11 on the offense. Maybe McDonald can upgrade us. I think he fits the talent around him better than James. Why not try him is my point, we have little to lose! If he doesn't work out, go back the journeyman. Just give him a chance.

If Colbert and the coaches who have film on McDonald did not think he potential upgrade they would not have traded for him.

Ok genius.....look at the stats showing targets.

Receiving

Gms Rec Yds Avg YPG Lg TD FD Tar. YAC

J.*James
3 12 87 7.25 29.0 19 2 4 17 40

V.*McDonald
2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0

If you watch tape or the games you would see McDonald drop the only pass thrown to him. Something he was known for.

James has 12 catches with 2 TDs in 3 games. Now if BOTH are on the field I suspect even more separation for the DBs covering because of the different skill sets.

81 is a throwback player, 89 is a stretch the field. When he learns the playbook and CATCHES passes he will get more snaps. That is common sense. That’s why he hasn’t been tried.....yet. He isn’t up to speed in the offense.

Put your agenda aside and use the football intelligence you say you have, but usually fail to show.


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[Coach]

Ok genius.....look at the stats showing targets.

Receiving

Gms Rec Yds Avg YPG Lg TD FD Tar. YAC

J.*James
3 12 87 7.25 29.0 19 2 4 17 40

V.*McDonald
2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0

If you watch tape or the games you would see McDonald drop the only pass thrown to him. Something he was known for.

James has 12 catches with 2 TDs in 3 games. Now if BOTH are on the field I suspect even more separation for the DBs covering because of the different skill sets.

81 is a throwback player, 89 is a stretch the field. When he learns the playbook and CATCHES passes he will get more snaps. That is common sense. That’s why he hasn’t been tried.....yet. He isn’t up to speed in the offense.

Put your agenda aside and use the football intelligence you say you have, but usually fail to show.


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Read the title of the thread Ike.

Start / give more snaps to Vance McDonald

James is giving us VERY little. Why not work McDonald in and see what he can do.

I agree with you McDonald can stretch the field and since James is just an average blocker,,,why not put him out there for some snaps

Are you saying a veteran of the NFL can't learn our playbook by now?

Give Defenses something to worry about. James 7.3 yards per catch is ho-hum. Last year with the 49ers QB Vance averaged 16.3 yards per catch. You do the math.

Okay, lets stay sub par with Jessie James and not try someone with better upside. I sense the vibe here.

 

[Ike Kelly]

Read the title of the thread Ike.

Start / give more snaps to Vance McDonald

James is giving us VERY little. Why not work McDonald in and see what he can do.

I agree with you McDonald can stretch the field and since James is just an average blocker,,,why not put him out there for some snaps

Are you saying a veteran of the NFL can't learn our playbook by now?

Give Defenses something to worry about. James 7.3 yards per catch is ho-hum. Last year with the 49ers QB Vance averaged 16.3 yards per catch. You do the math.

Okay, lets stay sub par with Jessie James and not try someone with better upside. I sense the vibe here.

This is a grade school conversation. Your thread title gives a query on a player, your opinion isn't fact based but of the "coaches are the problem" derivative.

#89 has been on this team barely 3-4 weeks, never played in this offensive scheme, and noted during the several practices participated a tendency to drop passes. He hasn't settled in yet. So, the coaches don't believe after what they've seen, not what you think, that McDonald is the better player at the TE1 position. Hence why James is starting and has produced.

Just an average blocker. For the love of Mike. If you opine that then 89 doesn't block at all, he's just a glorified WR with height. 81 is performing the role that the Steelers have requested their TEs do for the past 30 years. Block first. Catch passes second.

Sure his YPC is low in your eyes because you are comparing him to a field stretching TE who doesn't block. JJ does and he's a move the chains or red zone target. So that YPC avg is acceptable.

Once 89 has fully grasped the playbook and cleans up his drops, I see him seeing the field more.


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[TDX27]

Sure, try Vance but Jesse has improved each year. This is his first year as a true starter and he has actually done fairly well. He got injured last week otherwise he probably would have had a good game. Jesse isn't an all-pro but for our purposes, he is doing well. Are we forgetting he had 2 TD catches in game 1 and Ben has been looking his way because he's getting open? I guess some are anyway.

 

[Coach]

This is a grade school conversation. Your thread title gives a query on a player, your opinion isn't fact based but of the "coaches are the problem" derivative.

#89 has been on this team barely 3-4 weeks, never played in this offensive scheme, and noted during the several practices participated a tendency to drop passes. He hasn't settled in yet. So, the coaches don't believe after what they've seen, not what you think, that McDonald is the better player at the TE1 position. Hence why James is starting and has produced.

Just an average blocker. For the love of Mike. If you opine that then 89 doesn't block at all, he's just a glorified WR with height. 81 is performing the role that the Steelers have requested their TEs do for the past 30 years. Block first. Catch passes second.

Sure his YPC is low in your eyes because you are comparing him to a field stretching TE who doesn't block. JJ does and he's a move the chains or red zone target. So that YPC avg is acceptable.

Once 89 has fully grasped the playbook and cleans up his drops, I see him seeing the field more.


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Oh, please tell me why Haden who was on the team for less than 3-4 weeks started and saw action, but a veteran TE can't see the field?

If the coaches want a weapon at TE, they should start using him.

If you use hindsight, this is the 2nd time in 2 years the Steelers wanted to upgrade TE, first was Green, a player I really did not care for, and now its McDonald. If James is as good as you think he is, the Steelers do not make either move.

 

[Litos]

Oh, please tell me why Haden who was on the team for less than 3-4 weeks started and saw action, but a veteran TE can't see the field?

If the coaches want a weapon at TE, they should start using him.

If you use hindsight, this is the 2nd time in 2 years the Steelers wanted to upgrade TE, first was Green, a player I really did not care for, and now its McDonald. If James is as good as you think he is, the Steelers do not make either move.

Are you seriously comparing a former all pro to Vance McDonald?

 

[Coach]

Are you seriously comparing a former all pro to Vance McDonald?

No, I'm saying they are both veterans on other teams prior to the start of the season. One guy hit the field and played immediately while the other is not being used.

Ju-ju is a rookie, he's getting a lot of snaps.

I do not buy that McDonald can't get on the field because he's too stupid to run a few routes, do you?

 

[Litos]

No, i said he was coming from injury and doesn't have enough practices with the team. He is not a consumate vet like Haden, a top guy in the league before injury.

If you said we have kelce or Reid in the bench I'd get your drift

 

[Ike Kelly]

Oh, please tell me why Haden who was on the team for less than 3-4 weeks started and saw action, but a veteran TE can't see the field?

If the coaches want a weapon at TE, they should start using him.

If you use hindsight, this is the 2nd time in 2 years the Steelers wanted to upgrade TE, first was Green, a player I really did not care for, and now its McDonald. If James is as good as you think he is, the Steelers do not make either move.

This is why your opinions, not subject matter, are ridiculed. You comparing an 8 year veteran DB, who played under DC from the LeBeau tree (Horton) the majority of his career and his transition was smooth because our scheme is based on LeBeau’s, to a 5 year vet playing under Harbaugh’s offensive scheme.

I doubt you even understand why JJ is part of the 21 personnel formation and sometimes the 11 personnel. No doubt McDonald would be valuable in the 12 personnel IF he starts catching the ball. I hope he does, because her could be special and he is an all in team player.

If I use hindsight? Give me a break...they are always looking to upgrade, within their philosophy though. Always have, otherwise the team would be another Snyderesque or Jerry Jones franchise.

“As good as I think he is”.....He is a solid TE, all-pro? Definitely not. But he is doing the job. You can’t have All-pros at every position. And trying to compare a former AllPro DB to a matchup spread TE, is idiotic.


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[Ike Kelly]

No, I'm saying they are both veterans on other teams prior to the start of the season. One guy hit the field and played immediately while the other is not being used.

Ju-ju is a rookie, he's getting a lot of snaps.

I do not buy that McDonald can't get on the field because he's too stupid to run a few routes, do you?

Yeah he is, because he is at this time a better option than Eli. Because Eli can’t block as well as JJSS. Wouldn’t be surprised if he supplants Eli later in the season. I like Eli a lot, but his limitations are being minimized by JJSS play.

Who is he saying he’s to stupid to get in the field? Much less run a few routes? He hasn’t been a full participant in practice for 2 of the 4 weeks he’s been on the team.

You should smell what your shoveling.


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[jitter77]

I think james is underrated and under used. It is not his fault if he does not get the ball. He is certainly no burner, but he seems to be able to get open and has good hands.
We dont really know about vance yet and he is a better athlete, but that does not make him a better football player instantly. Also saying he is a second round pick means squat.
I do think vance should be given a few chances, but he has to do something work them before even considering him as a starter.

 

[Steeler Pride]

Still think Vance is earning more reps still?

 

[slashsteel]

Still think Vance is earning more reps still?

good blocker

hands

not so good


sort of as advertised

I was hoping those hands had a little to do with his QB play, but early it is looking like it has more to do with not being able to catch ****.

 

[Stryker]

Right now, he is spot on with his rookie year. More drops than receptions...