How I rank our defensive players.

[Coach]

With thoughts on our sagging defense I thought I create thread on who our best defenders are.

1 ) Timmons. A pro bowl guy. Timmons can play the run or pass well and is as durable as Pennsylvania steel. Timmons is very good, but not great and would be no better than the 3rd best defender on most Steeler defenses from 1992-2015.

2 ) Gay. Yes—this is not a typo. Gay was very solid as a cover guy, and had three pick 6 scores. A few years ago I felt Gay was okay. He had his best season, and also lead the team in pass breakups. He has earned my trust and respect.

3 ) Heyward. Almost a star, Heyward offers a good pass rush, and solid run defense. Our best 3-4 DE since Aaron Smith.

4 ) Assuming he’s back, Harrison. But he will be 37 next year.

5 ) Worilds. A good, but not great pass rusher, he’s likely gone in free agency.

Now the trouble starts. We have young players ( Shazier, Tuitt, some declining vets, and one new veteran Mitchell ) Essentially we only have three proven quality defenders that we know will be back in 2015.

5 ) Tuitt. Based on potential and coming on late, I’m placing him here.

6 ) Shazier. Solely based on potential and what he showed in the pre-season and rare regular game season appearances. Shazier has the ability to be an interceptor type vs the run, and a real asset vs the pass.

7 )) McCLendon. An okay nose tackle. A little weak vs the run, didn’t make many splash plays vs the pass in 2014

8 ) McCain. He’s small, but very fast and can cover.

9 ) Mitchell. Mitchell has more flags than passes defensed, and zero interceptions. He can hit, but these days that can be a liability.

10 ) Williams. Our closest thing to a thumper, Williams is almost a poor man’s levon Kirkland. He adds much needed toughness,. I know he’s a back up, but I think he belongs here.

10 ) Polamalu. Older and slower, he had just one pass defended and zero interceptions. Please retire Troy, and thanks for the memories.

11 ) Jones. Jones had a bad rookie year, and got hurt in his sophomore season. We really need be able to hold his own. He has not offered much as a pass rusher and gets killed vs the run.


Others:

Kesiel - if he can recover from an injury, he’s a fine role player.

Spense - looks more like a special teams guy to me. He was bumped out of the nickel in favor of Williams.

Allen – when called upon he’s okay

Blake - Not a bad dime DB

Taylor – Please retire. Would take him as a back up at the right cap number.


The 2015 draft better load up on the defense. OLB, CB, NT, and S.

 

[Hines57]

McCullers, sure to pass McClendon at some point and be our mountain in the middle. Would add him to the mix.

 

[Coach]

McCullers, sure to pass McClendon at some point and be our mountain in the middle. Would add him to the mix.

McCullers made some interesting plays, but his instincts are off. He's very tall for a NT ( Watch out for cut blocks ) and too slow to make plays. I think he's a back up to fringe starter type.

 

[nitsuj1225]

That's a list weak on talent if you ask me. I'm a big Heyward and Tuitt fan though...they are definitely promising. I'd put Spence over Jones. Although neither look like the long term answer at this point.

With Dick gone, I think there are huge question marks over the vets. Ike and Harrison obviously love the guy so would they even want to come back without him here? I doubt Harrison comes back last year without Dick here. Add Troy and Keisel to that list as well. We need some big help in the draft and free agency on defense and this list proves that.

 

[Litos]

this thread depressed me. Just shows how little talent we have on D, though I'd move Heyward above Gay.
Let's hope Tuitt and Shazier show improvement and that Jarvis becomes at least a serviceable starter

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Timmons, Gay, and Heyward are all perfectly fine. Of the vets I think Deebo is the only one who may be back and at age 37 will still be our second-best LB. Spence was essentially a rookie this year but I think that he and Shazier have a chance to be solid players. Tuitt and McCullers may yet improve. I like McCain, he came on in the second half, certainly better than Allen, but he is a FA and they'll have to re-sign him. The rest of the list is a dumpster fire.

 

[Coach]

this thread depressed me. Just shows how little talent we have on D, though I'd move Heyward above Gay.
Let's hope Tuitt and Shazier show improvement and that Jarvis becomes at least a serviceable starter

I think Heyward passes Gay in 2015, unless Gay has another season of pick sixes. Our defensive talent is at a low tide. The only past great that was replaced was Aaron Smith.

I hope we pick OLB, CB, S, NT and OLB with our first five picks.

 

[steelhurt]

We better be active in F/A but first need to resign Ben and Heyward then drop the dead wood to clear as much cap space as possible. If we can bring in a couple quality F/A's on defense, a good CB and if Worrilds departs a good OLB, then we draft all defense except for a TE and RB that will go a long way in fixing things on defense. These last two picks of Jones and Shazier still have me scratching my head though. I didn't like either player.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

IMO we need one good CB, two good SS's, two good LB's, and at least one good DL. Tall order.
They could get by without drafting a RB if Tate decides he's cool with his role here, and just pick up a UDFA.

 

[SteelerFan448]

Guessing our projected starters for next year:

1. Lawrence Timmons - He is our best defensive player and I'm with Coach, he should be no higher than third if this defense was very good.

2. Cameron Heyward - At times he is dominant, at other times you wonder where the potential went. I expect he will be at the top of this list by the end of next year because he is a force against the run and can rush the quarterback.

3. William Gay - This is all that you need to know about the defense. Good player, but would rather him be the nickel back and not a starter. The only playmaker in the secondary.

4. Jason Worilds - Right now, I think he stays. Doesn't do much very well, but is an above average player in this year's market. Needs to change his role next year to put him in better position to make plays.

5. Stephon Tuitt - I think the sky is the limit for Tuitt. Has the size and power to be a dominant force on the defensive line for years to come.

6. Steve McLendon - Decent in the middle. I still want a traditional plugger, but know that won't happen.

7. Ryan Shazier - Speed is great, but needs to get more physical.

8.Mike Mitchell - Benefit of the doubt that he needed a year in the system. Maybe he will be better without Polamalu playing a non-traditional safety role.

9. Jarvis Jones - Bad first year. Injured second year. I'd be happy to see 16 games in his third year.

10. Cortez Allen - Where did all of that potential go? He has all of the tools that you could ask for, but just hasn't put it together.

11. Shamarko Thomas - Could not get a defensive snap last year and many believe he will upgrade over Polamalu? I need to see it to believe it. Show me something.

 

[GMC]

4. Jason Worilds - Right now, I think he stays. Doesn't do much very well, but is an above average player in this year's market. Needs to change his role next year to put him in better position to make plays.

I hope you're wrong on this one. Bring Moats and Debo back, draft an OLB and move Jones to the weak side. That lineup shouldn't be any worse than last year's and will be a lot cheaper.

 

[fogdoctor]

Getting rid of LeBeau did not improve our talent pool. Shocking.

 

[Steelerfan]

this thread depressed me. Just shows how little talent we have on D, though I'd move Heyward above Gay.
Let's hope Tuitt and Shazier show improvement and that Jarvis becomes at least a serviceable starter

Agreed that it is a depressing list. While I agree with the Timmons ranking at #1 for this list's purposes, he still ain't all that.

 

[SteelerAl]

McCullers, sure to pass McClendon at some point and be our mountain in the middle. Would add him to the mix.

McLendon is so damn under-rated. He is more than adequate when healthy.

 

[ark steel]

How much do you think Worilds will get on the open market? Regardless of how much you think he is worth. I hope to hell we don't tag him again. I'm not overly opposed to having him back at a "reasonable" price, but I think he will get better offers elsewhere and I do NOT get into trying to outbid others.

 

[Litos]

How much do you think Worilds will get on the open market? Regardless of how much you think he is worth. I hope to hell we don't tag him again. I'm not overly opposed to having him back at a "reasonable" price, but I think he will get better offers elsewhere and I do NOT get into trying to outbid others.

I say 8 millions on the open market

 

[Coach]

McLendon is so damn under-rated. He is more than adequate when healthy.

A 3-4 defense needs a very good Nose Tackle to stop the run. Next to Hampton or Steed, McClendon hardly rates in stopping the run, or taking on two blockers. The Steelers gave up 4.4 yards per carry last season on an easy schedule.

Yes, you can blame Cam Thomas, but we also had Timmons and Harrison who are killers vs the run. The main problem was our DL did not hold its gaps, and the offensive blockers were on top of the LB's. If we have a B+ to A+ type of run defending NT, this problem can go away. McClendon to me is a B- type of NT vs the Run, and B type of Nose Tackle vs the pass. The Steelers signed him for cheap at his market value for a reason.

 

[SteelerAl]

A 3-4 defense needs a very good Nose Tackle to stop the run. Next to Hampton or Steed, McClendon hardly rates in stopping the run, or taking on two blockers. The Steelers gave up 4.4 yards per carry last season on an easy schedule.

Yes, you can blame Cam Thomas, but we also had Timmons and Harrison who are killers vs the run. The main problem was our DL did not hold its gaps, and the offensive blockers were on top of the LB's. If we have a B+ to A+ type of run defending NT, this problem can go away. McClendon to me is a B- type of NT vs the Run, and B type of Nose Tackle vs the pass. The Steelers signed him for cheap at his market value for a reason.

All false. Many 3-4 defenses have flourished without a Casey Hampton-type of NT. See many of the defenses run by Wade Phillips over the years. See the fact that our defense was just fine when Casey Hampton was injured and Chris Hoke took his place (record was something like 17-2 in games Hoke started).

And we were forced to sign McLendon to a relatively big contract for a RFA who was quite inexperienced because the Packers were about to sign him out from under our noses.

 

[Punxsutawney]

A 3-4 defense needs a very good Nose Tackle to stop the run. Next to Hampton or Steed, McClendon hardly rates in stopping the run, or taking on two blockers. The Steelers gave up 4.4 yards per carry last season on an easy schedule.

Yes, you can blame Cam Thomas, but we also had Timmons and Harrison who are killers vs the run. The main problem was our DL did not hold its gaps, and the offensive blockers were on top of the LB's. If we have a B+ to A+ type of run defending NT, this problem can go away. McClendon to me is a B- type of NT vs the Run, and B type of Nose Tackle vs the pass. The Steelers signed him for cheap at his market value for a reason.

It's worth pointing out that McClendon missed a lot of games, and the run defense showed improvement when he returned later in the season.

I think you can get by with a less than dominant NT, if you have a dominant Aaron Smith/Haloti Ngata type DE to compensate. I think Tuitt shows potential in that regard, with Heyward proving to be a good, though somewhat inconsistent, player.

I just do not see DL being a priority for them with the help they need at OLB and DB.

 

[Litos]

A 3-4 defense needs a very good Nose Tackle to stop the run. Next to Hampton or Steed, McClendon hardly rates in stopping the run, or taking on two blockers. The Steelers gave up 4.4 yards per carry last season on an easy schedule.

Yes, you can blame Cam Thomas, but we also had Timmons and Harrison who are killers vs the run. The main problem was our DL did not hold its gaps, and the offensive blockers were on top of the LB's. If we have a B+ to A+ type of run defending NT, this problem can go away. McClendon to me is a B- type of NT vs the Run, and B type of Nose Tackle vs the pass. The Steelers signed him for cheap at his market value for a reason.

worilds was rather horrible against the run, rarely keeping containment

 

[Coach]

It's worth pointing out that McClendon missed a lot of games, and the run defense showed improvement when he returned later in the season.

I think you can get by with a less than dominant NT, if you have a dominant Aaron Smith/Haloti Ngata type DE to compensate. I think Tuitt shows potential in that regard, with Heyward proving to be a good, though somewhat inconsistent, player.

I just do not see DL being a priority for them with the help they need at OLB and DB.

Yes, he did miss a few games. Nose Tackles need to be durable. I'm with you on Tuitt and Heyward. Four of our DL players are up for free agency in 2016 including Heyward and McClendon.

OLB is our biggest need. While DB is a big need, I do not want to reach for one in round one. We need a better #2 corner and safety who can makes plays.

 

[ark steel]

I say 8 millions on the open market

I've waffled between 6.5m and 7.5m. Kruger got 8.1/year and I think Worilds would have gotten similar or more last year. I think Kruger's was before salary cap increased, too, but I don't recall the timing there. I believe Worilds wanted at least 8.1m/year last year and the FO didn't want to guarantee that much up front and/or commit to the long term deal. No idea why they were OK with giving him almost $10m, though. It could be that they felt didn't have a lot of choice since he wouldn't agree to their terms.

In any event, I don't know if other teams will be convinced of Worilds worth in the $8m range based upon his performance last season.

 

[Litos]

I've waffled between 6.5m and 7.5m. Kruger got 8.1/year and I think Worilds would have gotten similar or more last year. I think Kruger's was before salary cap increased, too, but I don't recall the timing there. I believe Worilds wanted at least 8.1m/year last year and the FO didn't want to guarantee that much up front and/or commit to the long term deal. No idea why they were OK with giving him almost $10m, though. It could be that they felt didn't have a lot of choice since he wouldn't agree to their terms.

In any event, I don't know if other teams will be convinced of Worilds worth in the $8m range based upon his performance last season.

considering teams like raiders or jaguars with a bunch of cap space open, they might overpay to guarantee "talent"

 

[F83]

This as of this year

1Timmons- A all around LB who cxan do a bit of everything and should only be better with some 4-3 formations coming.

2 Heyward just pure nasty, plays LE with the same intensity as Smith @ some the 70 Steelers DL did just ruthless a no nonsense DL plays both the run and pass very good.

3 William Gay has made a remarkable comeback asa role player opened the year as the nickel CB but when inserted asa starter showed how good his instints are and how he despite his average CB frame play's much bigger

4 Jason Worlids a bit inconsistent asa pass rusher but has potential to be a 10 sack player every year great burst off the edge just needs to play the run better by sheding off blocks better.

5 James Harrison even at 37 showed he has gas left in the tank and him starting when Jones went on long term IR, his beast mode wen't on and it looked like he never left the Steelers.

6 Stephan Tuitt - I so see the the comparisions to SeyMour that scouts were talking about Tuitt has a superb arm span and a great mix of power @ finesse that allows him to line up at both RE @ DT in the nickel.

7 Brice Mccain a pleasent surprise very agile and despite the fact he is short you would never know as he was good vs the run and when he came downhill delivered thumper hits

8 Steve Mclendon Serviceable NT at 6"1 330 more of a 4-3 NG has some good agility can blow up some run play's just not as big or powerful to command the type of double teams that NT like Hampton, Vilfork, Poe, demand.

9 Ryan Shazier is this low b/c he barley played but he is very athletic and can cover a ton of area, playing in the 4-3 nickel will utilize the bewst of him, there Butler can play him asa weakside OLB or straight as a MLB who dsrops back to spy often and at 6"2 230 should play CB on hybrid TE's .

10 Mike Mitchell was just so inconsistent no impact plays made, constantly burned, at times decent vs the run, Let's see with a healed groin how is in coverage.

11 Troy Polamalu probebly the best SS ever but had nothing left please for your family and your legacy just retire Troy, I am sure Ed Reed regrets that last year with Houston, Troy could not cover make any splash plays, game changers at all its time to hang up the cleats and we shall see you in Canton in 3-5 years.

back ups or players who missed significant time

Jarvis Jones after 2.5 games he had 2 sacks @ 1 FF, when he came back the broken wrist was not fully healed and he off the snap could not punch to get around OT's, Needs to bulk up to 245 entering camp.

Cortez Allen, Started well was making plays by picking off bad passes thrown at his way by using his good hieght and agility but mid October was getting toasted on double moves and it came to a point the Indy game once he was beaten he was giving up, this led to his benching.

Vince Williams very impressive as a sub big thumper who showed he can blitz as well and play's with great emotion.

Brett Kesiel Showed some fire in the nickel both asa DE and asa OLB in Lebeau's 1-5-5, Was a force vs the run but I highly doubt he will be back retirement.

Antawn Blake did very well filling as the nickel CB once gay was placed at LCB @ McCain was placed at RCB he was quick and effective should return, as well provided superb over the top coverage on AJ Green.

Daniel Mcullers did'nt play till the 2nd month some things showed overweight raw, but there is potential for him to be a starter in both the 3-4 or 4-3 as a NT/NG, just a massive frame 6"7 I assume 365, Combine listed him at 352 but many scouts said he looked close to 400 and his projection from rnd 2-3 changed to where we got him in the 6th if he improves his pad level and conditioning he will be a dual DL, able to start at NT and in the nickel play some DEif can stay in the 345-355 range.

Ross Ventrone was spectacular on ST coverage

N/A Shamarko Thomas

 

[SteelerFan448]

McLendon is so damn under-rated. He is more than adequate when healthy.

That is a good description for McLendon.