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the 4-2-5 defense

Coach

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http://steelerswire.usatoday.com/2016/03/24/projecting-the-steelers-in-a-4-2-5-base-defense/

It seems pretty clear that the days of calling the Pittsburgh Steelers a “3-4 team” are over. Over the course of the last two seasons, we’ve seen a steady decline in the amount of base 3-4 defense the Steelers have played. This isn’t all their doing as the increase in passing in the NFL has necessitated this as much as anything.

Having said that, Pittsburgh must be progressive in terms of their roster when it comes to these changes. Trying to maintain a 3-4 roster while only playing it around 25 percent of the time isn’t smart business. So what we are seeing is Pittsburgh jettisoning some the more traditional guys (like Steve McLendon and Cam Thomas), and them moving toward a very different look on defense.

But what would a full time “nickel” or 4-2-5 defense look like for the Steelers? And how much adjustment is still needed to make it work? Let’s take a look.

Defensive Line:

The Steelers have a trio of player along the defensive line right now that are tailor-made for this sort of scheme. Cameron Heyward, Stephon Tuitt and Bud Dupree form three-fourths of what could be a dominating 4-man front. The last two years, the Steelers have tried using undersized guys in the defensive end roles and you see them wear down.

But the decision that has to be made here is about Heyward and Tuitt. I’ve said for years that Heyward is an All-Pro defensive tackle if he were allowed to focus all his time there. But what to do about that fourth spot? Does Tuitt move to a strongside defensive end spot opposite Dupree, or do the Steelers bring in another defensive end and keep Tuitt inside? I think both plans have merit, so long as the Steelers don’t try and get too cute with moving guys around along the line.

Linebackers:

Obviously if the majority of snaps are made with only two true linebackers on the field, it creates something of a logjam at the position. Counting Dupree as a DE, it leaves several guys vying for limited reps. However, the choice is pretty clear. Ryan Shazier and Lawrence Timmons, both inside linebackers now, would be ideal three-down guys in this scheme full time. They are smart, athletic players that can do lots of different things.

The odd guys out in this are Jarvis Jones, Arthur Moats and Vince Williams. While they would provide depth and be helpful in sub packages that require more LB, none of them bring to the table what Shazier and Timmons do.

Secondary:

This is where things get a bit more interesting. The Steelers would need to have three cornerbacks they can count on for a huge number of snaps. One would be William Gay, but after him there are a number of directions they could go. The hope is that Senquez Golson and Ross Cockrell assume those other two roles. That would leave Cortez Allen and Doran Grant to round things out. This is one spot where a draft pick is a heavy possibility.

At safety, it looks like the Steelers are going to look to the draft for someone to play opposite Mike Mitchell. Neither Shamarko Thomas or Robert Golden add much to the defense, and neither give the Steelers that true center field presence a defense like this needs.

Summary:

On paper, this defense is probably worse than last season right now. Considering the current makeup of the roster, don’t be shocked if three rookies are playing prominent roles in 2016, if the draft falls right. If this team is serious about a Super Bowl run this year, this could be the biggest year ever or rookie contributions.

^^This is why this 3 of the first 4 picks need to be on defense. While I don't agree with the summary ( defense is worse than last season right now ) , I do think the Defensive Line is one player away from being very good, but that player needs to be a facotr vs the run and pass.

The Seconday remains a problem.
 
I will have to play wait and see on this. Last year they switched more to this as the season went on. I am not sure if it was more out of necessity due to what other teams were doing or because we didn't have the talent to play a 3-4. I still think you need 3 good D-linemen with one or two LB's to put consistent pressure on a QB and to stop the run on downs other than 1st. I am just not convinced this is the D of the future when no other top D is doing it. Hell, not even the genius LeBeau used this as a base D.
 
you bring in Billings to create the nastiest DL
RE Dupree
NG Billings
3T Tuitt
LE Heyward
OLB shazier
mack Timmons
 
And if we go 1 Billings 2 Cravens 3 Bradberry

we could run a 3-4, 4-3, 4-2-5 and even a 46 with Cravens as the deep S

3-4 heyward billings tuitt jones shazier timmons dupree gay cockrell mitxhell golden
4-3 de walton dt heyward dt billings de tuitt olb moats mlb timmons olb shazier

4-2-5
de dupree
dt heyward
dt billings
de tuitt
lb shazier
timmons
lb s cravens
cb cockrell
cb gay
cb golsen
s mitchell
 
What's with the love for cravens? The guy isn't that fast and isn't that strong either, classic tweener that won't be enough on the NFL
 
What's with the love for cravens? The guy isn't that fast and isn't that strong either, classic tweener that won't be enough on the NFL

I think initially some saw him as a Polamalu type S. I think he can be a solid player, the question is at what position. His latest statement is he will play wherever they put him. I still think that might end up at safety.
 
I think initially some saw him as a Polamalu type S. I think he can be a solid player, the question is at what position. His latest statement is he will play wherever they put him. I still think that might end up at safety.

About the only thing he has in common with Polamalu is both played at USC. He was pretty set on playing linebacker, but he seems to have loosened that stance.
 
Cravens at about 230lbs ran a 4.65 at his pro day the other day. Not fast but not slow. I would gather if he lost 20lbs he would still be big enough for safety but would probably lose .10 off his forty. It all depends on Craven if he's on my board. If he says I'm a LB only then I wouldn't take him at all. If he says he's open to safety or a hybrid S/LB position then I'd be fine with taking him just depends on where he falls on the board.
 
I would prefer this 4-2-5 defense to our 2-4-5 we liked to do a ton of last season. Teams can run the ball down out throats in that formation, and Baltimore did it quite well to seal their win late in the season vs us. We need some depth on the Dline if we want to run that more often. The LB depth would be fine with just 2 LB's playing, but we have no depth on the Dline right now, to even run a 3 man front.
 
I thought our Nickel was a 2-4-5? Being able to bring the OLBs up to the LOS disguises what we are running out of that set. I'm all for picking up tweener DE/OLBs in this draft to help with the OLB position. Nassib perhaps?
 
I tried running the 4-2-5 monster here at the high school level. It just didn't work. The kids would not remain committed to their gaps. My thought were when playing teams like Gateway or Central this would help us match up and hopefully create some mismatches. It just wouldn't work. Had to go back to the 4-4-3. Just my personal experience with it.
 
I tried running the 4-2-5 monster here at the high school level. It just didn't work. The kids would not remain committed to their gaps. My thought were when playing teams like Gateway or Central this would help us match up and hopefully create some mismatches. It just wouldn't work. Had to go back to the 4-4-3. Just my personal experience with it.

Coach here.

The 4-2-5 is best vs the PASS, and just okay vs the run. The NFL is a passing league these days. You have to bring the heat and be able to cover.

One key is you need to linebackers that are fast and can tackle well. We have that. Check the box.

The other key is you need a good 4 man rush. Right now, ours is hit or miss. Replace Jones, and develop Dupree and we are there.

The wild card for the system in the " 5 " if you have a safety that can run, cover and blitz. We used to have that guy in Polamalu.
 
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