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Proof of PFF lunacy

Ike Kelly

Ike Kelly

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Now this takes the legitimacy out Pro Football Focus. Let it sink in this is how their “proprietary method” works.


IMG_0056.JPG

Remember this is Coach’s go to bible of stats.....


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Last edited:
Don’t know why it’s not loading. It’s a jpeg of PFF tweet regarding their week 3 leaders on the Steelers. Dobbs is 83.6. Rudolph is 75.8 and Ben is 78.2. Chuks is the highest rated OL at 81.2.


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Ike Kelly said:
Don’t know why it’s not loading
Click to expand...

Here, Ike.

<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Top Offensive Grades From Preseason Week #3 vs Ten<br><br>QB Joshua Dobbs (83.6)<br>RT Chukwuma Okorafor (81.2)<br>LG Ramon Foster (79.2)<br>QB Ben Roethlisberger (78.2)<br>QB Mason Rudolph (75.8)<br>RT Matt Feiler (73.7) <a href="https://t.co/FUM5zqXiqJ">pic.twitter.com/FUM5zqXiqJ</a></p>— PFF PIT Steelers (@PFF_Steelers) <a href="https://twitter.com/PFF_Steelers/status/1166408535296622594?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 27, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>
 
For whatever it's worth, they have Tuzar Skipper as the 4th ranked rookie overall thus far in the pre-season. Ulysees Gilbert comes in at #17. If I'm the Steelers I replace Chickillo with Skipper and never look back.


<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The top-25 rookies through Week 3 of the preseason:<br><br>4. Tuzar Skipper (90.4)<br>He has been a dual-threat edge defender with solid play both against the run (85.4 run defense grade) and in the pass-rush (86.1 pass-rush grade). <a href="https://t.co/QRIOoVNeQl">https://t.co/QRIOoVNeQl</a> <a href="https://t.co/sJ4RCBgG87">pic.twitter.com/sJ4RCBgG87</a></p>— PFF PIT Steelers (@PFF_Steelers) <a href="https://twitter.com/PFF_Steelers/status/1166392428871503874?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 27, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>
<iframe scrolling="no" allowtransparency="true" src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets/widget_iframe.097c1f5038f9e8a0d62a39a892838d66.html?origin=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.steelernationforums.com" title="Twitter settings iframe" style="display: none;" frameborder="0"></iframe><iframe id="rufous-sandbox" scrolling="no" allowtransparency="true" allowfullscreen="true" style="position: absolute; visibility: hidden; display: none; width: 0px; height: 0px; padding: 0px; border: medium none;" title="Twitter analytics iframe" frameborder="0"></iframe>
 
Josh Dobbs, really. Well as Ike says there legitimacy is very questionable. One could use them as a reference along with other sources but to use them as a sole support then one would need to be naive. Make that VERY naive.





Salute the nation
 
Tibs said:
Here, Ike.

<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Top Offensive Grades From Preseason Week #3 vs Ten<br><br>QB Joshua Dobbs (83.6)<br>RT Chukwuma Okorafor (81.2)<br>LG Ramon Foster (79.2)<br>QB Ben Roethlisberger (78.2)<br>QB Mason Rudolph (75.8)<br>RT Matt Feiler (73.7) <a href="https://t.co/FUM5zqXiqJ">pic.twitter.com/FUM5zqXiqJ</a></p>— PFF PIT Steelers (@PFF_Steelers) <a href="https://twitter.com/PFF_Steelers/status/1166408535296622594?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 27, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>
Click to expand...

Did anyone at PFF actually watch the game?
 
Drink IRON City said:
Josh Dobbs, really. Well as Ike says there legitimacy is very questionable. One could use them as a reference along with other sources but to use them as a sole support then one would need to be naive. Make that VERY naive.
Click to expand...

Absolutely. Their system is purely analytics-based, which is like 1/3rd of a healthy, overall assessment of a player. It does measure things like QB pressures, getting around blocks, etc. It's an interesting perspective, a single piece of a jigsaw puzzle, a narrow slice of information, if you will. Certainly shouldn't be viewed as gospel or a well-rounded analysis of players. For instance, the fact Devin Bush isn't on the top 25 rookies list speaks for itself.
 
Tibs said:
Absolutely. Their system is purely analytics-based, which is like 1/3rd of a healthy, overall assessment of a player. It does measure things like QB pressures, getting around blocks, etc. It's an interesting perspective, a single piece of a jigsaw puzzle, a narrow slice of information, if you will. Certainly shouldn't be viewed as gospel or a well-rounded analysis of players. For instance, the fact Devin Bush isn't on the top 25 rookies list speaks for itself.
Click to expand...
Obviously

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Drink IRON City said:
Josh Dobbs, really. Well as Ike says there legitimacy is very questionable. One could use them as a reference along with other sources but to use them as a sole support then one would need to be naive. Make that VERY naive.





Salute the nation
Click to expand...

If ONLY real NFL personnel put any stock in PFF.
We could get a couple of 1st round picks for Dobbs.
 
Tibs said:
Absolutely. Their system is purely analytics-based, which is like 1/3rd of a healthy, overall assessment of a player. It does measure things like QB pressures, getting around blocks, etc. It's an interesting perspective, a single piece of a jigsaw puzzle, a narrow slice of information, if you will. Certainly shouldn't be viewed as gospel or a well-rounded analysis of players. For instance, the fact Devin Bush isn't on the top 25 rookies list speaks for itself.
Click to expand...

repeating this for when Cooch jumps in here.
 
Tibs said:
Absolutely. Their system is purely analytics-based, which is like 1/3rd of a healthy, overall assessment of a player. It does measure things like QB pressures, getting around blocks, etc. It's an interesting perspective, a single piece of a jigsaw puzzle, a narrow slice of information, if you will. Certainly shouldn't be viewed as gospel or a well-rounded analysis of players. For instance, the fact Devin Bush isn't on the top 25 rookies list speaks for itself.
Click to expand...

This is the feint that PFF throws. You believe its analytics. But it actually is not. Their evaluators grade each player on each play participated. PFF evaluates based what “they” think was the correct responsibility of the player during each play. Something they can’t know unless they have the coaches play books and are in on game planning sessions. A play can be used multiple times in a games, with multiple formations, in addition to specific players. All this based on the coaches game planning with opponents tendencies being taking into the fact. A play may be shown to set up another play at a later point. Or to cause the opponent to show their hand early on a formation. Happens all the time.

A simple analogy would be PFF knows the route you take to work tomorrow because they have google maps with your home and work locations. You on the other hand know al the variables that may not allow you to follow the map.


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Ike Kelly said:
This is the feint that PFF throws. You believe its analytics. But it actually is not. Their evaluators grade each player on each play participated. PFF evaluates based what “they” think was the correct responsibility of the player during each play. Something they can’t know unless they have the coaches play books and are in on game planning sessions. A play can be used multiple times in a games, with multiple formations, in addition to specific players. All this based on the coaches game planning with opponents tendencies being taking into the fact. A play may be shown to set up another play at a later point. Or to cause the opponent to show their hand early on a formation. Happens all the time.

A simple analogy would be PFF knows the route you take to work tomorrow because they have google maps with your home and work locations. You on the other hand know al the variables that may not allow you to follow the map.


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Click to expand...

There goes that darn common sense, again...
 
Ike Kelly said:
This is the feint that PFF throws. You believe its analytics. But it actually is not. Their evaluators grade each player on each play participated. PFF evaluates based what “they” think was the correct responsibility of the player during each play. Something they can’t know unless they have the coaches play books and are in on game planning sessions. A play can be used multiple times in a games, with multiple formations, in addition to specific players. All this based on the coaches game planning with opponents tendencies being taking into the fact. A play may be shown to set up another play at a later point. Or to cause the opponent to show their hand early on a formation. Happens all the time.

A simple analogy would be PFF knows the route you take to work tomorrow because they have google maps with your home and work locations. You on the other hand know al the variables that may not allow you to follow the map.


Sent from my iPhone using Steeler Nation mobile app
Click to expand...

Exactly.... its like the espn qb ratings... its so subjective its absurd... even moreso in preseason
 
Tibs said:
Absolutely. Their system is purely analytics-based, which is like 1/3rd of a healthy, overall assessment of a player. It does measure things like QB pressures, getting around blocks, etc. It's an interesting perspective, a single piece of a jigsaw puzzle, a narrow slice of information, if you will. Certainly shouldn't be viewed as gospel or a well-rounded analysis of players. For instance, the fact Devin Bush isn't on the top 25 rookies list speaks for itself.
Click to expand...

Ike Kelly said:
This is the feint that PFF throws. You believe its analytics. But it actually is not. Their evaluators grade each player on each play participated. PFF evaluates based what “they” think was the correct responsibility of the player during each play. Something they can’t know unless they have the coaches play books and are in on game planning sessions. A play can be used multiple times in a games, with multiple formations, in addition to specific players. All this based on the coaches game planning with opponents tendencies being taking into the fact. A play may be shown to set up another play at a later point. Or to cause the opponent to show their hand early on a formation. Happens all the time.

A simple analogy would be PFF knows the route you take to work tomorrow because they have google maps with your home and work locations. You on the other hand know al the variables that may not allow you to follow the map.


Sent from my iPhone using Steeler Nation mobile app
Click to expand...

The idea of PFF looks great.

For the reasons above, I think it falls short. I'd guess they have several people watching each player and those people compare notes before issuing a report on that player. you'd need a lot of experience for each of the watchers to get it even close to right. at least, we are assuming the amount of experience would lead you to guessing the player's assignment more correctly.

I'm not sure how they grade neutral plays, either. If the TE correctly chips and goes out into the flat, but the ball is thrown the other way, is this graded as a good play by the TE, or not graded, at all. if it is what he was supposed to do, it should be graded properly and not ignored.

What about a similar play where the TE chips the LT and goes into the flat. LT mauls the QB. Was the TE supposed to chip the LT and an OL was supposed to pick him up (and didn't or got beat) or was the TE supposed to stay with the LT on a double team.
 
Tibs said:
For whatever it's worth, they have Tuzar Skipper as the 4th ranked rookie overall thus far in the pre-season. Ulysees Gilbert comes in at #17. If I'm the Steelers I replace Chickillo with Skipper and never look back.


<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The top-25 rookies through Week 3 of the preseason:<br><br>4. Tuzar Skipper (90.4)<br>He has been a dual-threat edge defender with solid play both against the run (85.4 run defense grade) and in the pass-rush (86.1 pass-rush grade). <a href="https://t.co/QRIOoVNeQl">https://t.co/QRIOoVNeQl</a> <a href="https://t.co/sJ4RCBgG87">pic.twitter.com/sJ4RCBgG87</a></p>— PFF PIT Steelers (@PFF_Steelers) <a href="https://twitter.com/PFF_Steelers/status/1166392428871503874?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 27, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>
<iframe scrolling="no" allowtransparency="true" src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets/widget_iframe.097c1f5038f9e8a0d62a39a892838d66.html?origin=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.steelernationforums.com" title="Twitter settings iframe" style="display: none;" frameborder="0"></iframe><iframe id="rufous-sandbox" scrolling="no" allowtransparency="true" allowfullscreen="true" style="position: absolute; visibility: hidden; display: none; width: 0px; height: 0px; padding: 0px; border: medium none;" title="Twitter analytics iframe" frameborder="0"></iframe>
Click to expand...

I know it's PFF, but they have this one right. :heh:

If he doesn't make the final cut and gets snatched away, I'm going to go ******* postal:

steam-out-my-ears-300x2581.jpg
 
Steelworth said:
I know it's PFF, but they have this one right. :heh:

If he doesn't make the final cut and gets snatched away, I'm going to go ******* postal:

steam-out-my-ears-300x2581.jpg
Click to expand...

We often overrate preseason stars, but I just can't see a situation where Skipper makes it the practice squad. There aren't 31 teams that are going to pass on the chance of grabbing a young guy who flashed the ability to get to the quarterback.
 
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