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Catch vs Incomplete

scstillerfan

scstillerfan

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Today in the Steelers game, there were at least 3 plays where the receiver caught the ball, took 2 steps, then lost it. The refs at least were consistent in calling incomplete. I don't agree, but at least be consistent.

Ravens vs Raiders, Steve Smith makes a similar catch, barely touches the second foot before the ball gets blasted out. Review says it's a catch. WTF NFL?
 
I saw that too. No consistency at all. No way Smith's was a catch.
 
How about reviewing plays in real time instead of slow motion? So the technology that reveals blown calls cannot be used to review them. That makes sense!
 
Steve Smith of Ravens had one that was reviewed and called a catch and fumble out of bounds. Catch, 2 steps with 2nd foot just and ball immediately knocked out. Reviews and called a completion

Oh, poor ravens...next 2 are division games, would live nothing more than 0-4
 
There is so much inconsistency in these calls. I was watching at a restaurant with no sound. I felt they called the Boldin one a catch on the field. They let the play continue when it got picked up. Then they said it wasn't. Then they upheld that call. He caught it, turned up field and then took two steps with the ball secure in his hands. Catch, strip, fumble. The Niners seemed to get the benefit of every close play call, until Kapernicks 4th down run came up a half yard short. And even then the ruling on the field was a TD.
 
SteelerSask said:
There is so much inconsistency in these calls. I was watching at a restaurant with no sound. I felt they called the Boldin one a catch on the field. They let the play continue when it got picked up. Then they said it wasn't. Then they upheld that call. He caught it, turned up field and then took two steps with the ball secure in his hands. Catch, strip, fumble. The Niners seemed to get the benefit of every close play call, until Kapernicks 4th down run came up a half yard short. And even then the ruling on the field was a TD.
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The Boldin call was not a catch. I don't know what the refs saw in that. The play where Kap hit his TE in the end zone and it got reviewed for no touchdown was another confusing play. It is what it is though. The game really wasn't decided by the refs at all. We just flat out whooped them
 
Yeah, I think catch + 2 steps + drop = fumble, every time unless the player hits the ground after the second step. That would make the calls much easier without room for interpretation.
 
MTC said:
The play where Kap hit his TE in the end zone and it got reviewed for no touchdown was another confusing play. It is what it is though. The game really wasn't decided by the refs at all. We just flat out whooped them
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The Calvin Johnson rule lol.
 
scstillerfan said:
Yeah, I think catch + 2 steps + drop = fumble, every time unless the player hits the ground after the second step. That would make the calls much easier without room for interpretation.
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The definition of a catch is possession with 2 feet down. Therefore a fumble is losing possession at any time after that moment. The term "football move" needs to be taken out of equation. There is no defined football move. Easier to call a fumble if possession is established, which it was.
 
Cope said:
The definition of a catch is possession with 2 feet down. Therefore a fumble is losing possession at any time after that moment. The term "football move" needs to be taken out of equation. There is no defined football move. Easier to call a fumble if possession is established, which it was.
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Agree with this, because every sideline catch that the receiver goes out of bounds after catching the ball with 2 feet down would not be considered a catch because no "football move" was done until the receiver was out of bounds
 
SteelerFan448 said:
That's because common sense no longer prevails. They've made this rule so complicated that no one knows what a reception is anymore.
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It has gotten to the point where a completion is sort of like porn. I can't define it but I know it when I see it.
 
To complete a catch, you must have posession, which means the ball must be secure in your hands, not just touching the fingertips, two feet or an equivalent body part outside of hands down in bounds, and you must make a football move or maintain control through contact with the ground or a defender. a simple turn upfield is a football move. Refs get confused too often. if a guy catches the ball with two hands, comes to a complete stop with 2 feet down and holds it for ten seconds then gets it knocked out its either a fumble or he has surrendered himself and is down... its not an incompletion because he has established possession. The stop is the football move... incompletions happen within the immeadiate momentum of the play. Refs somehow often miss that
 
Ive never understood why they shouldn't be allowed to rule off of slow motions replay. I mean, isn't using the technology to get it right the WHOLE POINT of having reviews?
 
Possession is when the ball comes to rest within the receiver's grasp. It can be fingertips, or pinned against the body. You can have possession with one hand (Odell Beckam;s catch), or a hand and a fingertip from the other hand. As long as the football doesn't move (wiggle, bobble), possession is established.

Going to the ground is the only rule that extends possession to include possessing the football after contact with the ground. And those rules are clearly written. (See Des Bryant).
 
The solution is to remove instant replay from the game. Let the officials call the game on the field. You'll be the winner sometimes and the loser sometimes, but the game will keep moving and over the course of a year these things tend to even out. It's impossible to watch an NFL game in which the Steelers aren't playing, even with instant replay and slow motion they are still getting calls incorrect. Why does every call have to be correct? And, as everyone is so quick to mention after a loss in which the refereeing was pathetic, "we didn't lose because of the bad calls, we lost because we were outplayed." Well, if you aren't losing or winning because of bad calls then why worry about it?

Just do away with it and be done with it, the game would be better for it.

Papillon
 
It's a coin flip now. Nobody knows. Even the retired refs like Pereira on the broadcast are wrong half the time on these catch reviews. Nobody knows.

The NFL took a well defined and simple rule and turned it into a jumbled mess where you can completely justify either call on most close plays.

Why did they do this? To help offense of course. Offensive coaches complained that there were too many fumbles where the receiver gets two feet down then gets blasted and the ball pops loose. They demanded that there be a vague "football move" requirement which would reduce fumbles.

I agree that there should be some small unit of time after 2 feet and possession. When the hit arrives nearly simultaneously and knocks it loose, it should be incomplete and not a fumble. But why not clearly define that time? It's easy

1. a 3rd foot (or other body part) automatically completes a catch, OR
2. A specific unit of time from the moment of reception (2 feet + control) until a ball comes loose.

The unit of time seems impossible but it's not. All replays are digital, that means they have numbered frames. A frame is a standard time. If you decide that 1 second is the time that must pass to be a completion, then that corresponds to a set number of frames.

Let's say 1 second = 10 frames of video. All they have to do in the booth is mark the moment of reception (2 feet + control) and then look at the 10th frame after that. If the ball is loose then it's no catch. If the ball is still in control then it is a catch at that point and would be a fumble after that if it's loose.

That sounds complicated but it's really not. Since the on field ref no longer decides on the field, this could easily be done by the video people in NY who do the reviews.
 
papillon said:
The solution is to remove instant replay from the game. Let the officials call the game on the field. You'll be the winner sometimes and the loser sometimes, but the game will keep moving and over the course of a year these things tend to even out. It's impossible to watch an NFL game in which the Steelers aren't playing, even with instant replay and slow motion they are still getting calls incorrect. Why does every call have to be correct? And, as everyone is so quick to mention after a loss in which the refereeing was pathetic, "we didn't lose because of the bad calls, we lost because we were outplayed." Well, if you aren't losing or winning because of bad calls then why worry about it?

Just do away with it and be done with it, the game would be better for it.

Papillon
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Taking instant replay out would make it about a billion time worse. How bad is it when you can watch on the ******* jumbotron in HD that a ref ****** up a call, and they have NO way to fix it. Removing replay would be the stupidest move the NFL could make, especially with todays technology. I know some of you ******* want to go back to 1950, but it isn't happening, you can't un see a ****** up call, and let that ****** up call decide a Superbowl with the entire world watching, KNOWING you had a way to fix that bad call but removed it, and see how that would work out for ya.

Joe
 
scstillerfan said:
Today in the Steelers game, there were at least 3 plays where the receiver caught the ball, took 2 steps, then lost it. The refs at least were consistent in calling incomplete. I don't agree, but at least be consistent.

Ravens vs Raiders, Steve Smith makes a similar catch, barely touches the second foot before the ball gets blasted out. Review says it's a catch. WTF NFL?
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The bald truth is the bad calls often help the team down two scores in regular season games. Is it fair? NO. Does it happen too often to be a coincidence? YES.
 
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