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Vick meeting with Steelers

Del,

If you wanna leave...just man up and leave..we dont need to be the parents of the petulant child and give you a time out.

I get it you are pissed I am to..Vick does not belong on this team and as much as I dislike what he did to dogs it really has nothing to do with him being on this team for me...its the simple fact that he just isnt worth having on the team with his skills as they are..If Ben goes down we lose... Landry Jones or Vick...we are toast. I just.don't see the point of him being here.

You have been a respected poster here..but ..if you feel you need to now be an Eagle fan...so be it..thats a choice for you to make.

I will be a Steeler fan..I won't like everything they do, hell, I will loathe some things they do..but at the end of the day its a game we are watching..I have hitched my wagon to this team win/lose good/bad..they are no different than any of the others in this league..but they are who I have chosen to follow..wrong or right ..who the hell knows ..but that is my choice to make
 
I agree with Tibbs. At my age, 64 we start to see a lot more ups and downs. Michael Vick committed a crime (no doubt horrible) admitted to it, paid a STIFF penalty (21 months in Federal prison - if he wasn't "Michael Vick" I bet it would have been MUCH less ) and by all accounts has tried to atone.

The Stillers need a dependable backup for Big Ben. If you really think Landry Jones is that person then you are in LA LA land.

We lost our starting center so we are weaker up the middle (I think Cody Wallace is tough but not Pouncey). Ben Needs someone who is mobile and can throw and knows how to win to spell him if his bell get rung.

As to Tebow, give it a rest. He isn't available and likely won't be.

Ernie "Fats" Holmes was one of my favorites. However, the Chief pulled a fast one and called in a lot of blue chips to keep him playing football.

A priest told me a story one time that may put things in perspective.

A faithful parishioner, who loved prize fighting, won 2 tickets ringside at Madison Square Garden for the boxing Heavyweight championship of the world. His wife could care less but his Pastor loved prize fighting. He decided to invite the Pastor to go with him. (His wife was fine with that!).

After the preliminary rounds, they finally came to the main event. The Garden was buzzing with excitement as the champ and the contender came into the ring. They touched gloves and went back to their corners to await the bell. As the contender approached his corner, he genuflected and made the sign of the cross. The faithful parishioner was impressed and nudged his Pastor and said " Hey father look at that, what do you think?"

The Priest replied, 'That's nice, but can he fight?!"
 
Disagree with one point. I am not telling them I think they are the same or that what they do matters not. I am telling them that while they are associating with him I will not associate with the team as a fan, nothing more.

I don't think it was the choice of DeCastro, Brown, Heyward, Beachum, Allen, etc, etc to associate with Vick. He's a fellow employee, he was signed by the owner of the team, not the players...doesn't make any sense to me.
 
Isn't anyone a little skeptical about Vicks supposed remorsefulness and redemption?

I mean he was bankrupt and didn't have any other options beside the NFL. So he jumped through hoops. It's like a draft prospect with character issues answering the questions right at the combine. It really only proves that he's not a complete idiot.

I guess I'd feel better about it had he brought redemption upon himself instead of having it forced upon him.
 
Seen the 7th Planned Parenthood video?

You sir, are wrong.

Been to Chicago over a weekend when the bullets are flying?

They may have some invisible "protections" you speak of. They do nothing to "protect."

You get my point, I'm sure.

There are more commercials and public campaigns about being humane to animals (we watched one this weekend) than there are on reducing inner city violence, as an example.

I do not get your point, I am not sure you have one. The laws that are the protections apply to all people. It is illegal to discriminate based on race which seems to be the only thing you are interested in. The planned parenthood crap deals with the unborn as I said previously and do not at present have the same protections that do people that have been born. I am not infavor of planned parent hood or it being funded by the government. It is generally not a conservative program but is continuously championed by the left wing groups including the present resident of the white house. Interesting you have brought up the bullets flying in Chicago like it is some master discrimination plan. In truth the biggest reason for many of those issues is the unintended consequences of the governments that have been elected, they are excellent examples of failed policies and the real value of the nanny state and the folks who need the government to make everything all better for them. Below is a great example and you can go check the facts for yourself.

A tale of two cities
........................................................................Chicago, IL...........................Houston, TX
Population............. ..........................................2.7 million...........................2.15 million
Median HH Income..........................................38,600.................................37,000
African-American..............................................38.9%..................................24%
Hispanic.............................................................29%....................................44%
Asian..................................................................5.5%...................................6%
Non Hispanic White...........................................28.7%.................................26%
Pretty similar until you compare the following

Concealed Carry Law.........................................no.....................................yes
# of Gun Stores..................................................0....................184 dedicated gun stores plus 1500 ..................................................................................................
....................................................................................................legal places to buy guns Walmart, ..................................................................................................
.....................................................................................................K-Mart sporting goods etc.
Homicides 2012................................................1806.................................207
Homicides per 100K..........................................38.4..................................9.6
Avg Jan high temp.............................................31.....................................63

Liberal Conclusion cold weather causes Murder.
 
http://www.timesonline.com/columnis...-ab11-b34ca1b2b972.html#.Vd16arrjVBZ.facebook

Mueller: Bashing of Vick by Steelers fans height of hypocrisy

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Michael Vick

Paul Sancya/The AP

The Steelers signed quarterback Michael Vick to a one-year deal Tuesday. Vick threw for 604 yards and three touchdowns last season.

Posted: Tuesday, August 25, 2015 9:08 pm

Chris Mueller Special to The Times | 1 comment

Michael Vick, as most everyone knows by now, signed with the Steelers to back up Ben Roethlisberger. To say that he was reviled before he put ink to paper to commit his services to the team would be a massive understatement.

A check of twitter Tuesday morning, after news broke that Vick was visiting the Steelers, would have yielded an incendiary mix of fans swearing off watching the team for good, complaining about the franchise’s lost integrity, or going the extra mile and pledging their allegiance to all AFC North teams except Pittsburgh.

Viewed outside the maelstrom that surrounded his signing, Michael Vick is nothing more than a high-profile insurance policy, one whose presence on this roster was made necessary by Bruce Gradkowski’s hand surgery, and Landry Jones’ being Landry Jones.

But people don’t by and large care about the angle of this story that concerns Michael Vick, the football player. The faithful are far more concerned with Michael Vick, the convicted felon. Michael Vick, the dogfighter. Michael Vick, the symbol of all that is irredeemable and evil in this world.

That last one is made up, obviously, but it is a pretty accurate statement on how a vocal segment of the population views him.

It’s a curious thing, really. Killing and torturing innocent, trusting, unconditionally loving dogs is an awful, evil thing to do, but Vick did his time. He was incarcerated and bankrupted, then released after a year and a half behind bars and has since stayed mostly out of the limelight. He has spoken repeatedly on behalf of the Humane Society, and has, by all accounts, talked the talk and walked the walk.

Michael Vick, to all appearances, is proof that sometimes, the system works. Criminals are rehabilitated. They accept their wrongdoing and make an effort to change for the better. Certainly Vick’s situation is different than most; his skill set dictated that he would get another shot in the league, and his marketability and earning potential (both for himself and others) dictated that a team of PR professionals would help him say and do all the right things in public.

That doesn’t seem to matter to folks that would rather see him wither and fade away, and be given no opportunity to make a living he has every right to pursue. Some of these same fans, the ones who will never watch the Steelers again because of the guy that will wear a baseball cap and hold a clipboard, are all too happy to cheer for James Harrison, who was charged with slapping his girlfriend across the face during a dispute in March 2008. The charge later was dropped.

Some of the same people questioning everything the Rooney family purports to stand for because of Vick’s presence don’t feel the least bit squeamish, don’t have the slightest compunction about rooting on Ben Roethlisberger, whose behavior in a bar in Georgia five years ago was drunken and boorish at best, and possibly worse — though no one will ever know for sure.

This is the message being sent by that crowd, no matter how they try to spin it: Violence against a woman is within the limits of what we will tolerate from our star athletes. An alleged incident of sexual violence, at the very least loutish behavior involving a woman is OK. It will be accepted, and forgotten about as soon as it is convenient to.

Or maybe the real message here is that Michael Vick doesn’t figure to play much, if at all, for the Steelers, and fans know that. They know that Vick is a backup to one of the best quarterbacks in the league, and if all goes well, he won’t go near the field. Perhaps they feel a little bit bolder about taking a strong moral stand because they know they won’t have to face the internal conflict of cheering for Vick, because he likely won’t have any affect on the team’s fortunes this year.

That’s really the bottom line in all of this. Just as the “Steeler Way” is a bogus notion where the front office is concerned, so too is it a laughable, antiquated concept when it comes to fans. The Steelers will keep almost any player regardless of the trouble they get in, so long as the belief exists that said player can help the team. A majority of fans will root for any player, no matter what the transgression, so long as that player remains a key contributor.

There is no “Steeler Way”. The outcry against Michael Vick from some corners of the fan base isn’t a principled moral stand. It’s an emotional reaction against someone who did something extremely unpleasant, but more importantly, likely won’t be a factor for this year’s team.

If the signing of Michael Vick was what caused you to draw a line in the sand and end your relationship with the Steelers, I have but one question.

What took you so long?
 
Interesting comment by an individual who considers allegations to have the same merit as facts. I find his logic flawed and his assumptions inaccurate. But in the typical fashion of most of the media why let a fact or several get in the way of a good story. This will be a field day for the media as they can now take a position which one does not matter and inflame people to further their own ends. It is a game they have played before attacking the steelers organization so as to incur the wrath of the fans and have more hits on their stories. Now it would not do much to attack the organization but it will do the next best thing and attack the fans that have taken exception to an act the organization has done, should produce the same result for them or maybe they will just be ignored as will be activities for the 2015 season.
 
Tell me your feelings about the Confederate flag vs. dog fighting.

I don't understand how you are equating the two.

First off, I've been fortunate enough to live in the south all my life. No one in my family tree ever owned slaves. I'd be amazed if no one in my family lineage fought in the Civil War. To that, the only person I've ever known whose family owned slaves was not from the south, unless you consider Ohio and Indiana part of the deep south.

Was slavery bad? of course it was. Was it a **** smear on US history? absolutely.
But, please consider that slaves were not trapped and captured in the same way that US history books want you to believe. No, the white man was not running around with a big net seeking to capture a black man or woman in Africa. Wouldn't that be a waste of precious time? Slaves were bought from slave traders in Africa. Slaves were sold to the other men by their own people. Still, doesn't make it "right" in any aspect. And yet, slavery continues in Africa.

Keep in mind, the slave trade was not solely in the south, and not everyone in the south owned slaves, as you've insinuated.

Dogs... a lot of people down south own dogs. Labs, Pointers, Hounds, etc.
Please let me know the next time you see a dog selling another dog into a dog fighting ring.

I don't like the signing of DogKilla at all. Yes, he may have been incarcerated and lost money from this evil act. Yes, he may be making retributions. Yes, he may now be outspoken about dog fighting. Yes, he may be saying and doing all the right things. now.

I don't care. IMO, he's a disgusting piece of **** that I've reserved the same ill will for the likes of Ray Lewis, Rae Carruth, and a few others. I hate Tom Brady, but that hatred is even more intense for DogKilla. Hell, the Pats - a disgusting organization in their own right - needed a QB and skipped right past DogKilla to sign Matt Flynn.

I may watch games, but if DogKilla gets on the field, my inclination at this point is to turn the tv off. I don't associate with known felons and convicts in my personal life. Though, I do associate with some individuals with questionable personalities like ark, DBS and Burgundy. I don't equate Ben to DogKilla anymore than I do you to Mike Brown. I hate the signing of Vick and wish we hadn't done it. Nevertheless, the ink is dry on the contract and until he takes a botched snap from Hubbard, a shot to the knee from DeCastro or a concussion-generating shot from Timmons, he has the opportunity to play for the Steelers.

If he does, I will not cheer for him. If he leads the Steelers to a win, I will not cheer for him.

I will, however, applaud the efforts of those having to work with this ****** individual.

I'm still wondering how Timmons feels about this signing, as he is a pit bull owner and has this pic as his main image on twitter
timmons.jpg
 
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I'm far more concerned with the defense's ability to hold opponents to less than 30 points (and the Pats** to less than 50) than I am with who the second string QB is.
This is really all Landry Jones' fault. If he didn't suck we're not having this discussion.
 
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Okay, here's warning for everyone. Free passes are over. I let everyone vent and do their thing but that's over from here on out. No bating posters mostly Del. Don't try to provoke him. I completely disagree with his opinion but if you try to bait him that's against forum rules and you're gonna get 2 days off.

Starts now.
 
Okay, here's warning for everyone. Free passes are over. I let everyone vent and do their thing but that's over from here on out. No bating posters mostly Del. Don't try to provoke him. I completely disagree with his opinion but if you try to bait him that's against forum rules and you're gonna get 2 days off.

Starts now.

Maybe I'm slow, but I'm not sure I understand. When does disagreeing with someone become "baiting" someone?
 
Local TV interviewed the CB we picked up from Philly, he said that Vick was a good dude and good for the locker room.
Maybe he can train Coach Porter's pit bulls not to attack his neighbor's miniature horses again.

Must be something with horses. I've had my son's pit while he was serving oversees. When he got back, he rented a house out in the country near his base. It was on land where the owner was boarding show horses and show ponies.
Son took the dog to his new home, fully intending to keep her with him until he deployed again. She's back with me now as she just couldn't stop chasing the horses and ponies. Bit a couple of them and got kicked by them numerous times.
 
My personal view on Michael Vick's transgressions from over eight years ago:

Matthew 6:14-15
For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.

Colossians 3:13
Bear with each other and forgive one another if any of you has a grievance against someone. Forgive as the Lord forgave you.

Ephesians 4:31-32
Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice. Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.

Matthew 18: 21-22
Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, “Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother when he sins against me? Up to seven times? “Jesus answered, “I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times.”

Luke 6:37
Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

John 8:7
When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, “If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her.”

2 corinthians 2:5-8
If anyone has caused grief, he has not so much grieved me as he has grieved all of you to some extent—not to put it too severely. The punishment inflicted on him by the majority is sufficient. Now instead, you ought to forgive and comfort him, so that he will not be overwhelmed by excessive sorrow. I urge you, therefore, to reaffirm your love for him.

Welcome to Pittsburgh to our new back-up QB. By all indications Vick has turned his life around and is a solid character. He's done his penance for his crime. He has come out and fully supported efforts to ban all forms of dog-fighting. As a celebrity/professional athlete he's given this cause much wider exposure. In turn, hopefully the brutal, evil act of dog fighting can be banished forever. A much larger question mark is what abilities he still has as a QB at 35? Regardless, I'm willing to give him a chance. I applaud the Rooneys and the Steelers front office for having the ability to forgive and to give someone another chance. That's a stand-up way to be. Makes me proud to be a Steelers fan.


Amen, 1000%.
 
So my personal problem with the signing is I dont see Vick as the highly accurate short passer that fits our O right now. He was always more likely to take off with the ball than dump it to the RB, which limits Bell's effectiveness. He certainly wont be making the crisp right on time passes that take advantage of brown or wheaton's strengths. The two pieces of the O that he would likely benefit are Miller and Bryant. Im just not sold on him as an effective option for us in the case of ben missing time... he is so boom or bust. This is a huge gamble IMO.
 
Maybe I'm slow, but I'm not sure I understand. When does disagreeing with someone become "baiting" someone?

when the mods say it does...for those who have posts deleted this morning...be thankful that is all I did. I said last night that I wasn't going to give any warnings but just start booting folks....
 
The first time I saw his name, I thought it was a joke.

But apparently it isn't, which underscores how meager the "QB supply" is.

So whoever thought Mettenberger could be had for a middling draft pick is probably wrong. You'd have to give up a pretty high one to get him. Same for Glennon.

There's no reason - at all - for the Titans to give away Mettenberger. That's just a pipe dream.
 
Isn't anyone a little skeptical about Vicks supposed remorsefulness and redemption?

I mean he was bankrupt and didn't have any other options beside the NFL. So he jumped through hoops. It's like a draft prospect with character issues answering the questions right at the combine. It really only proves that he's not a complete idiot.

I guess I'd feel better about it had he brought redemption upon himself instead of having it forced upon him.

Nope, not skeptical at all because he was only required to do a certain amount of community service/work with the Humane Society. He completed that and continued to do more. So, it seems that after redemption was "forced on him", he continued to seek it on his own. A guy who was doing just enough to fulfill his requirements doesn't continue that type of behavior once the requirements have been removed.
 
So my personal problem with the signing is I dont see Vick as the highly accurate short passer that fits our O right now. He was always more likely to take off with the ball than dump it to the RB, which limits Bell's effectiveness. He certainly wont be making the crisp right on time passes that take advantage of brown or wheaton's strengths. The two pieces of the O that he would likely benefit are Miller and Bryant. Im just not sold on him as an effective option for us in the case of ben missing time... he is so boom or bust. This is a huge gamble IMO.

Was Bruce Gradkowski capable of any of that either? Leftwich?

The crowd that's out there saying "Vick's just not that good" really has no concept of what is available. That's why I keep saying that people sure seem to want to give Landry Jones a shot at playing QB in a real game...that's the type of QB that is available.
 
Maybe I'm slow, but I'm not sure I understand. When does disagreeing with someone become "baiting" someone?

How are we going to pass the Dri Archer thread then?
 
Was Bruce Gradkowski capable of any of that either? Leftwich?

The crowd that's out there saying "Vick's just not that good" really has no concept of what is available. That's why I keep saying that people sure seem to want to give Landry Jones a shot at playing QB in a real game...that's the type of QB that is available.

every year a couple heady but noodle armed QBs come available... that would probably fit us better... if Vick plays at the top of his game he is capable of playing conference championship level football, but if he isnt its going to be an ugly mess... much more boom or bust than a steady but unspectacular career backup type.
 
every year a couple heady but noodle armed QBs come available... that would probably fit us better... if Vick plays at the top of his game he is capable of playing conference championship level football, but if he isnt its going to be an ugly mess... much more boom or bust than a steady but unspectacular career backup type.

And once again you can't wait until final cuts to find a guy who will be your NO 2 QB. He needs time to get familiar with the offense. You have to do it now
 
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